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Is the W223 coming out this year or what? If not I'm going to get a Panamera and come back when it does. Would hate to leave s-class but I don't see any other option in the same price range.
@Chucky3000 What are you doing here ? I thought you sold out to Porsche a few years ago,
P.S. BMW is garbage. We love our S here.
Released next year.
I'm here because I am still a fan of Mercedes - and was considering the new S Class as a replacement to the Porsche. I enjoyed it but living in NYC - the car is not suitable for these roads. Popped 10 tires, etc
Not sure how you can say they are garbage - that's a bold blanket claim.
I'm here because I am still a fan of Mercedes - and was considering the new S Class as a replacement to the Porsche. I enjoyed it but living in NYC - the car is not suitable for these roads. Popped 10 tires, etc
Not sure how you can say they are garbage - that's a bold blanket claim.
I agree. I once had a disagreement with someone who owned a 750Li from 2014 and my father bought one from that year - the individual edition. Upgraded paint, and an interior that rivaled rolls royce. When we went to sit in my friends - it was as you said - basically a piece of plastic. It's a case of if you are willing to pay a lot more - you can get a proper high end luxury german car. I sat in a 2020 BMW 750Li with individual spec in a dealership a few weeks back - and the interior was TOP NOTCH luxury. Every surface was beautiful. They had a "standard" version as well - and the same issue - a serious downgrade in luxury.
Blanket statements are rarely reflective of reality. I definitely prefer the S-Class over the 7 Series but it always depends...
A 760li will blow away any S450 and S560. It's basically a Rolls Royce Ghost in less attractive clothing. The S450 will beat the 740 any day of the week as well. The S-Class is a great car with a better V8 engine and it simply looks classier but it needs to be in exclusive Nappa leather to feel truly luxurious IMO. The 7 series is simply less attractive with their odd grill, bumpers and monstrous exhaust tips.
But BMW does a much better job with the individual interiors and paints. Wish Mercedes would provide that level of customization. Not cheap but cheaper and better than the Designo Manufactur options.
The W223 S-Class will once again set the standard to other brands to follow. There will be some disenchanted members here by some of the design decisions made but they will end up to be the new standard and show up in the next BMW's, Audis etc.
That said, I am quite frustrated of what Mercedes is doing with the next GLS. Supposed to be the S-Class of SUV's and it ends to be anything but luxurious. Cheapest looking interiors I have laid my eyes on in years. A total of 1 Nappa leather interior choice (Black/gray) and 3 horrible leather options. I wish they would look at BMW of how to do it right with the X7 full leather interiors...
Blanket statements are rarely reflective of reality. I definitely prefer the S-Class over the 7 Series but it always depends...
A 760li will blow away any S450 and S560. It's basically a Rolls Royce Ghost in less attractive clothing. The S450 will beat the 740 any day of the week as well. The S-Class is a great car with a better V8 engine and it simply looks classier but it needs to be in exclusive Nappa leather to feel truly luxurious IMO. The 7 series is simply less attractive with their odd grill, bumpers and monstrous exhaust tips.
But BMW does a much better job with the individual interiors and paints. Wish Mercedes would provide that level of customization. Not cheap but cheaper and better than the Designo Manufactur options.
The W223 S-Class will once again set the standard to other brands to follow. There will be some disenchanted members here by some of the design decisions made but they will end up to be the new standard and show up in the next BMW's, Audis etc.
That said, I am quite frustrated of what Mercedes is doing with the next GLS. Supposed to be the S-Class of SUV's and it ends to be anything but luxurious. Cheapest looking interiors I have laid my eyes on in years. A total of 1 Nappa leather interior choice (Black/gray) and 3 horrible leather options. I wish they would look at BMW of how to do it right with the X7 full leather interiors...
My take on the GLS is basically a GLE grown up, finish wise. Certainly not even close to S as so many expected.
My take on the GLS is basically a GLE grown up, finish wise. Certainly not even close to S as so many expected.
Bigger car, better suspension. Bit better looking in 580 trim. Same interior as the GLE. Hence my concern. The MY20 model is specifically positioned by MB as the S of SUV's. So the expectation should be as much and the last GLS (Grand edition) looked the part on the interior. Nothing like this on the new one...
Here is a pic of the old one (Nappa leather everywhere with flowing lines trim) and a quick close-up the the new models "upgraded" leather seat. Never mind that leather is not standard; just MB-Tex.
Bigger car, better suspension. Bit better looking in 580 trim. Same interior as the GLE. Hence my concern. The MY20 model is specifically positioned by MB as the S of SUV's. So the expectation should be as much and the last GLS (Grand edition) looked the part on the interior. Nothing like this on the new one...
Here is a pic of the old one (Nappa leather everywhere with flowing lines trim) and a quick close-up the the new models "upgraded" leather seat. Never mind that leather is not standard; just MB-Tex.
That's too bad, MB is missing an opportunity here. In terms of luxury there really is no "jump" from the GLE. I suspect there will be some exodus to X7 and RR for sure but I'm sure there will be plenty of initial demand for the 580. Based on reviews the ride should be quite impressive, but again the luxury part a letdown. That grand edition is really nice, it looks luxury.
There was a recent thread here, from a fellow who just got back into a W222, after a stint with a late model 7 Series. Compared to the S Class seats, he described the BMW’s as “church pews.” We must hand it to MB, the S Class seats are VERY comfortable. As for exterior appearance, the previous 7, with the smaller grills, was MUCH better looking, IMO. I liked the looks of that car much more than my S560. The gigantic grills, to me, are a huge turn-off, and knowing it was done to attract the Chinese, makes it even worse for me. Sorry, no new 7 for me. They should have made the gaudy grills optional, for show-offs and folks with poor taste.
That was me. I was comparing like cars- non individual spec’d 7 series vs S560. To me I don’t like the BMW interior design language. The controls, dash, transitions from one material to the next never spoke of luxury. The seats truly were a letdown (the 760 has nicer leather but the same dead-to-me foam). And I was really blown away to realize the only measurable difference in size was in the back seat for the 7- the 7 is only 1/2” wider inside vs a 5 series. I take up a lot of real estate and appreciate the notable volume improvement from the E to S class. The 7 has a better user interface, that I miss, but every switch cluster, screen etc is carried over from the 5 series (maybe they are a quarter inch bigger or smaller but it’s a twin). They look identical in every way. Even from the outside it’s hard to tell the cars apart (a complaint I now have of all the Germans, but at least the S class still has a unique grill- for now). Some of this has changed now that the 7 is refreshed, but the 5 series will follow suit taking on the same switchgear etc.
BMW has been competing on price for some time now, their leases are easily 25-40% cheaper than a comparable S class. As it is they hardly sell any 7 series, if they priced them on par with the S class I find it hard to believe they’d become anything more than a rounding error. When I sit in an S class I feel like the car was purpose built for luxury and quality. When I sit in a 7 I feel they juiced up a 5 series. I guess if you are willing to spend $50-60k to take a 7 up market in quality that’s cool, but in the end the bones still feel like a stretched 5...
Blanket statements are rarely reflective of reality. I definitely prefer the S-Class over the 7 Series but it always depends...
A 760li will blow away any S450 and S560. It's basically a Rolls Royce Ghost in less attractive clothing. The S450 will beat the 740 any day of the week as well. The S-Class is a great car with a better V8 engine and it simply looks classier but it needs to be in exclusive Nappa leather to feel truly luxurious IMO. The 7 series is simply less attractive with their odd grill, bumpers and monstrous exhaust tips.
But BMW does a much better job with the individual interiors and paints. Wish Mercedes would provide that level of customization. Not cheap but cheaper and better than the Designo Manufactur options.
The W223 S-Class will once again set the standard to other brands to follow. There will be some disenchanted members here by some of the design decisions made but they will end up to be the new standard and show up in the next BMW's, Audis etc.
That said, I am quite frustrated of what Mercedes is doing with the next GLS. Supposed to be the S-Class of SUV's and it ends to be anything but luxurious. Cheapest looking interiors I have laid my eyes on in years. A total of 1 Nappa leather interior choice (Black/gray) and 3 horrible leather options. I wish they would look at BMW of how to do it right with the X7 full leather interiors...
That was me. I was comparing like cars- non individual spec’d 7 series vs S560. To me I don’t like the BMW interior design language. The controls, dash, transitions from one material to the next never spoke of luxury. The seats truly were a letdown (the 760 has nicer leather but the same dead-to-me foam). And I was really blown away to realize the only measurable difference in size was in the back seat for the 7- the 7 is only 1/2” wider inside vs a 5 series. I take up a lot of real estate and appreciate the notable volume improvement from the E to S class. The 7 has a better user interface, that I miss, but every switch cluster, screen etc is carried over from the 5 series (maybe they are a quarter inch bigger or smaller but it’s a twin). They look identical in every way. Even from the outside it’s hard to tell the cars apart (a complaint I now have of all the Germans, but at least the S class still has a unique grill- for now). Some of this has changed now that the 7 is refreshed, but the 5 series will follow suit taking on the same switchgear etc.
BMW has been competing on price for some time now, their leases are easily 25-40% cheaper than a comparable S class. As it is they hardly sell any 7 series, if they priced them on par with the S class I find it hard to believe they’d become anything more than a rounding error. When I sit in an S class I feel like the car was purpose built for luxury and quality. When I sit in a 7 I feel they juiced up a 5 series. I guess if you are willing to spend $50-60k to take a 7 up market in quality that’s cool, but in the end the bones still feel like a stretched 5...
100%, "juiced up 5". There is no correlation between the S and E class. Entirely separate.
100%, "juiced up 5". There is no correlation between the S and E class. Entirely separate.
Unless you spec it as an individual or 760 - I have always said - the interiors are plastic feeling. When you go individual - the woodworks, leather, suede is likely all in partnership with Rolls. As mentioned above - I sat in a dealership a few weeks ago - two 7 series - one with individual and one "standard" and it was night and day.
The night and day though - is a big increase in price.
I'm here because I am still a fan of Mercedes - and was considering the new S Class as a replacement to the Porsche. I enjoyed it but living in NYC - the car is not suitable for these roads. Popped 10 tires, etc
Not sure how you can say they are garbage - that's a bold blanket claim.
Good to see ya. I wasn't being facetious if and apologize if it came off that way. I remember some of the problems you had with your S and aside from the dealership issue you had most of us who were the first to get the W222 experienced the same issues but looking back it all seems so silly that the main problem we had with the W222 was the run-flat tires. lol
The W223 so far based off what the test vehicles and renders show leaves a lot to be desired aesthetically. Looking back at the test vehicles of the W222 I think most of us felt the same but the actual production S-Class ended up looking so good that every mbz model is almost a derivative of the W222's design. I don't think we have any reason to believe the W223 will be any less impressive or at least not a design that we'll grow to love.
My bold blanket claim about BMW is when compared to the S-Class. While calling it garbage is not a word others would use I don't think any of us here who have owned a S-Class believes a 7-series BMW is even a serious contender as a replacement. I don't think you do either because you would have bought one already!
Good to see ya. I wasn't being facetious if and apologize if it came off that way. I remember some of the problems you had with your S and aside from the dealership issue you had most of us who were the first to get the W222 experienced the same issues but looking back it all seems so silly that the main problem we had with the W222 was the run-flat tires. lol
The W223 so far based off what the test vehicles and renders show leaves a lot to be desired aesthetically. Looking back at the test vehicles of the W222 I think most of us felt the same but the actual production S-Class ended up looking so good that every mbz model is almost a derivative of the W222's design. I don't think we have any reason to believe the W223 will be any less impressive or at least not a design that we'll grow to love.
My bold blanket claim about BMW is when compared to the S-Class. While calling it garbage is not a word others would use I don't think any of us here who have owned a S-Class believes a 7-series BMW is even a serious contender as a replacement. I don't think you do either because you would have bought one already!
I wasn't offended at all. No worries whatsoever.
I think 7 series and A8 are contenders to the S Class if spec'd right. I've always said a BMW not spec'd right doesn't feel rich inside - and still feel that today. I wouldn't consider a 7 series if it was not a M760 with individual upgrades or a 750 with full blown individual spec. When you tack those options and build onto the car - the msrp then mirrors a nice S Class.
I'll tell you - I've been in TLC cars that are S Class (Taxi / Livery) that are the most basic spec and there's a hell of a lot of plastic in those too. The back seats in particular are totally boring unless you put the rear seat package (reclining, heating etc)
The porsche I love - but I love it upstate and in Pennsylvania - Driving around Brooklyn and Manhattan is a treck - and I never know if the bang I hear under the car when I hit a pothole is the one that rips the bottom of my car out from under me.
2020 S63 Coupe, 2006 Hummer H1 Alpha, 2018 McLaren 720S, 2022 Porsche 911 TurboS, 2022 Tesla Model X
W223 is expected to be sedan only, correct ?
Friend went to a local dealer and was told by a salesman there that an all new S Coupe is arriving in 2021. Suspect he is misinformed... every reliable source suggests there will be a S Sedan (W223) for 2021, with no coupe variant is in the pipeline. Current C217 may remain production for a few more years concurrent with the new 2+2 soft top SL and AMG GT replacement; or until a totally new coupe based on the Maybach Vision 6 is introduced, which would be many years from now if ever.
Not a fan of the new interior visible in the spy shots although suspect the final W223 interior will be much nicer, and I'm sure tech will be amazing. I have been told Mercedes is working on a new and improved MBUX that will likely be introduced with the W223.
Friend went to a local dealer and was told by a salesman there that an all new S Coupe is arriving in 2021. Suspect he is misinformed... every reliable source suggests there will be a S Sedan (W223) for 2021, with no coupe variant is in the pipeline. Current C217 may remain production for a few more years concurrent with the new 2+2 soft top SL and AMG GT replacement; or until a totally new coupe based on the Maybach Vision 6 is introduced, which would be many years from now if ever.
Not a fan of the new interior visible in the spy shots although suspect the final W223 interior will be much nicer, and I'm sure tech will be amazing. I have been told Mercedes is working on a new and improved MBUX that will likely be introduced with the W223.
Correct. They are sunsetting the coupe with the 217 while the W223 is sold. The cab however, will be discontinued with the launch of the next gen.SL
2020 s450 are in but the 2020 s560 is still not in the dealerships in NY. I have decided to get a 2020 S560 with price being at 117k to 121k depending on the options. The 2019 s 560 could be had at around 20% off using the penfed car buying service. The 2020 s560 is not in yet so there is nothing showing regarding price at the penfed car buying service. When the car comes in I would go into different dealerships and ask for a 20% discount on the car. I wonder what a good deal on the car would be? Fun days ahead!!
Good to see ya. I wasn't being facetious if and apologize if it came off that way. I remember some of the problems you had with your S and aside from the dealership issue you had most of us who were the first to get the W222 experienced the same issues but looking back it all seems so silly that the main problem we had with the W222 was the run-flat tires. lol
The W223 so far based off what the test vehicles and renders show leaves a lot to be desired aesthetically. Looking back at the test vehicles of the W222 I think most of us felt the same but the actual production S-Class ended up looking so good that every mbz model is almost a derivative of the W222's design. I don't think we have any reason to believe the W223 will be any less impressive or at least not a design that we'll grow to love.
My bold blanket claim about BMW is when compared to the S-Class. While calling it garbage is not a word others would use I don't think any of us here who have owned a S-Class believes a 7-series BMW is even a serious contender as a replacement. I don't think you do either because you would have bought one already!
Generalizing again.
I chose the S63 over M760i (which I liked a bit more) only because of my relationship with the MB dealer personnel and the techs but mostly because I could easily modify the MB and at the same place (Renntech mods).
I have turbo upgrade scheduled next week.
Btw, I liked my S8 Plus much, much more then my current S63 or the 760 I was considering.
I wish I could keep it longer but didn't want to keep it after the warranty was over (went over 50k miles- my new record on 1 car).
If mods were unavailable, I would end up with the 760, stock, not "Individual", interior in standard form was easily equal to S63.
10-02-2019, 06:18 PM
