FINALLY fixed the common TRANSMISSION rough up/down shifting in W222!!!!!!!
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 4,830
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From: Venice Florida
2018 S560
Wow, thats depressing in such a otherwise good car. Need to get Corporate involved I guess. I'm hoping my 9 speed does not continue to get worse, it's no where's near as bad as my 2015 7 speed was.
Newbie
Joined: Jan 2020
Posts: 4
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From: NJ
2015 Mercedes S550
Love my car but have the same issue on a 2015! Ive talked to my service advisor and corporate and everyone keeps telling me to wait for the software update. anyone know when it is planned to be released? I read previously January 2020?
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Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 28
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From: Atlanta
S 550 AMG Sport Package
Does Dealership Reply Contradict Most Everything on this Thread?
"Good morning. Sorry for the delay. Below is what my shop foreman responded back to me on the email, you had sent.
What this document does not show you is the history that we have encountered while performing this forced adaptation . I have performed many of these “forced adaptations” and most of the time the adaptations are unsuccessful in that the adaptations do not improve and you actually wind up with more undesirable numbers than you started with. The transmission engineer for the USA is Sergio Akusha. I have worked together with him on multiple PTSS cases for this exact issue . We have replaced transmissions, flashed software, removed and replaced transmission internal transmission components, replaced ME modules, all without improving this condition. The issue is not transmission related but the torque calculation between the engine control module and the information that it provides to the transmission to perform the best shift for ambient conditions. This statement is known by Cory Sarver , Sergio, Germany as well as others that have fought this issue along with much finger pointing back and forth between German transmission vs engine engineers that each say that it is the others problem. The latest information is … Germany has developed the software to correct this condition however it has not been certified for application, this is more than likely due to emissions certification. It is very easy to copy / paste / highlight / and comment on technical issues in an email with limited information however there is much more to this than meets the eye. I have reviewed the shift adaptation values for this vehicle that were retrieved on 1-6-2020 and the adaptation values for shift member B-2 are as follows: 11.5, 12.0 and 6.0. These three numbers represent low, moderate and high temperature ranges. These adaptation numbers are a typical for this shift member and actually not as high as usually seen. The low value of 11.5 is actually good comparatively speaking regarding other like models. If this client insists that we do a “forced“ adaptation the results are typically that the 11.5 value will trend to 15.0 – 17.0. This is a very undesirable outcome resulting in a more harsh shift than was present before and cannot be adapted back to the lower number!
I do not recommend this procedure. I have reviewed the LI document on this subject this morning and the cause is still listed as “uncertain” with no remedy listed. "
Regards
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 559
Likes: 166
From: Rhode Island
2014 E350 Sport (sold), 2015 S550 Sport (sold), 2018 S560 Sport (sold), 2018 GLE43, 2014 E550
I provided a screen shot of above to my favorite dealership and here is their reply:
"Good morning. Sorry for the delay. Below is what my shop foreman responded back to me on the email, you had sent.
What this document does not show you is the history that we have encountered while performing this forced adaptation . I have performed many of these “forced adaptations” and most of the time the adaptations are unsuccessful in that the adaptations do not improve and you actually wind up with more undesirable numbers than you started with. The transmission engineer for the USA is Sergio Akusha. I have worked together with him on multiple PTSS cases for this exact issue . We have replaced transmissions, flashed software, removed and replaced transmission internal transmission components, replaced ME modules, all without improving this condition. The issue is not transmission related but the torque calculation between the engine control module and the information that it provides to the transmission to perform the best shift for ambient conditions. This statement is known by Cory Sarver , Sergio, Germany as well as others that have fought this issue along with much finger pointing back and forth between German transmission vs engine engineers that each say that it is the others problem. The latest information is … Germany has developed the software to correct this condition however it has not been certified for application, this is more than likely due to emissions certification. It is very easy to copy / paste / highlight / and comment on technical issues in an email with limited information however there is much more to this than meets the eye. I have reviewed the shift adaptation values for this vehicle that were retrieved on 1-6-2020 and the adaptation values for shift member B-2 are as follows: 11.5, 12.0 and 6.0. These three numbers represent low, moderate and high temperature ranges. These adaptation numbers are a typical for this shift member and actually not as high as usually seen. The low value of 11.5 is actually good comparatively speaking regarding other like models. If this client insists that we do a “forced“ adaptation the results are typically that the 11.5 value will trend to 15.0 – 17.0. This is a very undesirable outcome resulting in a more harsh shift than was present before and cannot be adapted back to the lower number!
I do not recommend this procedure. I have reviewed the LI document on this subject this morning and the cause is still listed as “uncertain” with no remedy listed. "
Regards
"Good morning. Sorry for the delay. Below is what my shop foreman responded back to me on the email, you had sent.
What this document does not show you is the history that we have encountered while performing this forced adaptation . I have performed many of these “forced adaptations” and most of the time the adaptations are unsuccessful in that the adaptations do not improve and you actually wind up with more undesirable numbers than you started with. The transmission engineer for the USA is Sergio Akusha. I have worked together with him on multiple PTSS cases for this exact issue . We have replaced transmissions, flashed software, removed and replaced transmission internal transmission components, replaced ME modules, all without improving this condition. The issue is not transmission related but the torque calculation between the engine control module and the information that it provides to the transmission to perform the best shift for ambient conditions. This statement is known by Cory Sarver , Sergio, Germany as well as others that have fought this issue along with much finger pointing back and forth between German transmission vs engine engineers that each say that it is the others problem. The latest information is … Germany has developed the software to correct this condition however it has not been certified for application, this is more than likely due to emissions certification. It is very easy to copy / paste / highlight / and comment on technical issues in an email with limited information however there is much more to this than meets the eye. I have reviewed the shift adaptation values for this vehicle that were retrieved on 1-6-2020 and the adaptation values for shift member B-2 are as follows: 11.5, 12.0 and 6.0. These three numbers represent low, moderate and high temperature ranges. These adaptation numbers are a typical for this shift member and actually not as high as usually seen. The low value of 11.5 is actually good comparatively speaking regarding other like models. If this client insists that we do a “forced“ adaptation the results are typically that the 11.5 value will trend to 15.0 – 17.0. This is a very undesirable outcome resulting in a more harsh shift than was present before and cannot be adapted back to the lower number!
I do not recommend this procedure. I have reviewed the LI document on this subject this morning and the cause is still listed as “uncertain” with no remedy listed. "
Regards
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 559
Likes: 166
From: Rhode Island
2014 E350 Sport (sold), 2015 S550 Sport (sold), 2018 S560 Sport (sold), 2018 GLE43, 2014 E550
Thread Starter
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From: U.S.
Current/Last 5-years:GLS;G70;Alpina B8;X7;Accord. Sold:X7,TeslaS;S560;S550,X5;530e;L.Navigator;LS460
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: Cincinnati
2010 E350 4Matic
I provided a screen shot of above to my favorite dealership and here is their reply:
"Good morning. Sorry for the delay. Below is what my shop foreman responded back to me on the email, you had sent.
What this document does not show you is the history that we have encountered while performing this forced adaptation . I have performed many of these “forced adaptations” and most of the time the adaptations are unsuccessful in that the adaptations do not improve and you actually wind up with more undesirable numbers than you started with. The transmission engineer for the USA is Sergio Akusha. I have worked together with him on multiple PTSS cases for this exact issue . We have replaced transmissions, flashed software, removed and replaced transmission internal transmission components, replaced ME modules, all without improving this condition. The issue is not transmission related but the torque calculation between the engine control module and the information that it provides to the transmission to perform the best shift for ambient conditions. This statement is known by Cory Sarver , Sergio, Germany as well as others that have fought this issue along with much finger pointing back and forth between German transmission vs engine engineers that each say that it is the others problem. The latest information is … Germany has developed the software to correct this condition however it has not been certified for application, this is more than likely due to emissions certification. It is very easy to copy / paste / highlight / and comment on technical issues in an email with limited information however there is much more to this than meets the eye. I have reviewed the shift adaptation values for this vehicle that were retrieved on 1-6-2020 and the adaptation values for shift member B-2 are as follows: 11.5, 12.0 and 6.0. These three numbers represent low, moderate and high temperature ranges. These adaptation numbers are a typical for this shift member and actually not as high as usually seen. The low value of 11.5 is actually good comparatively speaking regarding other like models. If this client insists that we do a “forced“ adaptation the results are typically that the 11.5 value will trend to 15.0 – 17.0. This is a very undesirable outcome resulting in a more harsh shift than was present before and cannot be adapted back to the lower number!
I do not recommend this procedure. I have reviewed the LI document on this subject this morning and the cause is still listed as “uncertain” with no remedy listed. "
Regards
"Good morning. Sorry for the delay. Below is what my shop foreman responded back to me on the email, you had sent.
What this document does not show you is the history that we have encountered while performing this forced adaptation . I have performed many of these “forced adaptations” and most of the time the adaptations are unsuccessful in that the adaptations do not improve and you actually wind up with more undesirable numbers than you started with. The transmission engineer for the USA is Sergio Akusha. I have worked together with him on multiple PTSS cases for this exact issue . We have replaced transmissions, flashed software, removed and replaced transmission internal transmission components, replaced ME modules, all without improving this condition. The issue is not transmission related but the torque calculation between the engine control module and the information that it provides to the transmission to perform the best shift for ambient conditions. This statement is known by Cory Sarver , Sergio, Germany as well as others that have fought this issue along with much finger pointing back and forth between German transmission vs engine engineers that each say that it is the others problem. The latest information is … Germany has developed the software to correct this condition however it has not been certified for application, this is more than likely due to emissions certification. It is very easy to copy / paste / highlight / and comment on technical issues in an email with limited information however there is much more to this than meets the eye. I have reviewed the shift adaptation values for this vehicle that were retrieved on 1-6-2020 and the adaptation values for shift member B-2 are as follows: 11.5, 12.0 and 6.0. These three numbers represent low, moderate and high temperature ranges. These adaptation numbers are a typical for this shift member and actually not as high as usually seen. The low value of 11.5 is actually good comparatively speaking regarding other like models. If this client insists that we do a “forced“ adaptation the results are typically that the 11.5 value will trend to 15.0 – 17.0. This is a very undesirable outcome resulting in a more harsh shift than was present before and cannot be adapted back to the lower number!
I do not recommend this procedure. I have reviewed the LI document on this subject this morning and the cause is still listed as “uncertain” with no remedy listed. "
Regards
You all might think this strange I find this kind of response somewhat comforting in that there is complete and forthright discussion of the problem and communication with the transmission engineering staff. It makes sense that they can't just roll out a software upgrade due to emissions certification requirements.
Additionally it echos what my indy has told me when I inquired regarding having the transmission shift quality improved via road test adaptations.
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Member
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 137
Likes: 26
2014 S550
I took mine in on Tuesday for a rough 5 > 4 downshift while cold. They are replacing the conductor plate.
They did say the technician spent most of the day on the line with someone doing tests and troubleshooting. I"m not sure what they were seeing because the rough shift only happened when the car was cold and was only bad on really cold mornings. It's been kinda warm lately. Maybe there is some history in there of shifts?
They did say the technician spent most of the day on the line with someone doing tests and troubleshooting. I"m not sure what they were seeing because the rough shift only happened when the car was cold and was only bad on really cold mornings. It's been kinda warm lately. Maybe there is some history in there of shifts?
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2019 S560, 2015 Honda Civic Hybrid
Curious about the mention of emissions compliance being needed for a software change to an existing car ... why would this be an issue? I could see if it were used on new production cars for the current model year, then the manufacturer's certification might conceivably be affected.
But in a repair situation, who would know the difference? When an ODB-II car is inspected annually for "emissions", all that's actually checked is that specific factory-equipped components (e.g. catalysts) are present and have no stored error codes. So a small change to transmission shift parameters couldn't possibly make a car fail in that context.
But in a repair situation, who would know the difference? When an ODB-II car is inspected annually for "emissions", all that's actually checked is that specific factory-equipped components (e.g. catalysts) are present and have no stored error codes. So a small change to transmission shift parameters couldn't possibly make a car fail in that context.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,975
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From: Cincinnati
2010 E350 4Matic
Curious about the mention of emissions compliance being needed for a software change to an existing car ... why would this be an issue? I could see if it were used on new production cars for the current model year, then the manufacturer's certification might conceivably be affected.
But in a repair situation, who would know the difference? When an ODB-II car is inspected annually for "emissions", all that's actually checked is that specific factory-equipped components (e.g. catalysts) are present and have no stored error codes. So a small change to transmission shift parameters couldn't possibly make a car fail in that context.
But in a repair situation, who would know the difference? When an ODB-II car is inspected annually for "emissions", all that's actually checked is that specific factory-equipped components (e.g. catalysts) are present and have no stored error codes. So a small change to transmission shift parameters couldn't possibly make a car fail in that context.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,694
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2019 S560, 2015 Honda Civic Hybrid
That's surprising to hear. How far back does this obligation go? If Mercedes made a software change for ten year old cars, would they have report a deviation to the certifying agency and seek a waiver?
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 559
Likes: 166
From: Rhode Island
2014 E350 Sport (sold), 2015 S550 Sport (sold), 2018 S560 Sport (sold), 2018 GLE43, 2014 E550
The 2020 transmission update is being installed in my car right now, I will let you all know how it works (2015 S550).
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Current/Last 5-years:GLS;G70;Alpina B8;X7;Accord. Sold:X7,TeslaS;S560;S550,X5;530e;L.Navigator;LS460
can you reference the update number, serial number or any ID for that software so we can also reference it when speaking with our local MB dealership. Personally I am not going to risk downloading anything because what they did for me last year around sept. or october works as smooth as butter so far, but who knows what could happen anytime...
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 559
Likes: 166
From: Rhode Island
2014 E350 Sport (sold), 2015 S550 Sport (sold), 2018 S560 Sport (sold), 2018 GLE43, 2014 E550
can you reference the update number, serial number or any ID for that software so we can also reference it when speaking with our local MB dealership. Personally I am not going to risk downloading anything because what they did for me last year around sept. or october works as smooth as butter so far, but who knows what could happen anytime...
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 559
Likes: 166
From: Rhode Island
2014 E350 Sport (sold), 2015 S550 Sport (sold), 2018 S560 Sport (sold), 2018 GLE43, 2014 E550
Picked up the car today. Skeleton crew right now for COVID so I was in and out. I looked at the document the tech provided and did not see any details surrounding the transmission update then asked if he could provide anything. He said he would have to grab the engineer for details as it was not in front of him. He left for 5 minutes and came back saying that the guy was busy but he'll try to email me something. Sorry this is not much help. The update seems to have worked for now, I drove around for 10 minutes or so then went home. I purposely tried to recreate the rough 5th to 4th downshift and its gone, for now. Time will tell I suppose, more to come.
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Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 267
Likes: 56
From: Maryland
2023 S580 (current), 2019 Range Rover HSE V6 (current),2021 S580, 2018 S560 4Matic, 2015 S550 4Matic
Picked up the car today. Skeleton crew right now for COVID so I was in and out. I looked at the document the tech provided and did not see any details surrounding the transmission update then asked if he could provide anything. He said he would have to grab the engineer for details as it was not in front of him. He left for 5 minutes and came back saying that the guy was busy but he'll try to email me something. Sorry this is not much help. The update seems to have worked for now, I drove around for 10 minutes or so then went home. I purposely tried to recreate the rough 5th to 4th downshift and its gone, for now. Time will tell I suppose, more to come.
thanks..
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 559
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From: Rhode Island
2014 E350 Sport (sold), 2015 S550 Sport (sold), 2018 S560 Sport (sold), 2018 GLE43, 2014 E550
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2014 S550 AMG, 2017 XT5
Super Member
Joined: Feb 2017
Posts: 559
Likes: 166
From: Rhode Island
2014 E350 Sport (sold), 2015 S550 Sport (sold), 2018 S560 Sport (sold), 2018 GLE43, 2014 E550
I complained about the speed and it seems to be better now by maybe a second or two when flipping between certain screens.
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From: U.S.
Current/Last 5-years:GLS;G70;Alpina B8;X7;Accord. Sold:X7,TeslaS;S560;S550,X5;530e;L.Navigator;LS460
Wow!, if it's better by 1-2 seconds, this means it used to take at least 3 seconds between windows!. In my case it doesn't take more than a second anyway to flip from one window to another, that's interesting, I wonder what could cause the system to slow down knowing it's a simple software and there should be nothing causing it to slow down.
Junior Member
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 25
Likes: 8
From: Virginia, USA
2020 S560 4Matic
2015 S550 4M. I printed this message out and took it to my dealer this week. I had reported this issue a year ago. They supposedly updated the software, but no help. Well, this time, the tech experienced the issue ( had to leave it overnight because the shift is worse when cold). They said there was new soft ware, they loaded it, then did dynamic shift calibration. It is a totally different car now. Why it took this long to identify this fix is beyond me, but I love the upgrade. Thanks for the post!
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 267
Likes: 56
From: Maryland
2023 S580 (current), 2019 Range Rover HSE V6 (current),2021 S580, 2018 S560 4Matic, 2015 S550 4Matic
2015 S550 4M. I printed this message out and took it to my dealer this week. I had reported this issue a year ago. They supposedly updated the software, but no help. Well, this time, the tech experienced the issue ( had to leave it overnight because the shift is worse when cold). They said there was new soft ware, they loaded it, then did dynamic shift calibration. It is a totally different car now. Why it took this long to identify this fix is beyond me, but I love the upgrade. Thanks for the post!
