Originally Posted by MBNUT1

How long did you car shift smoothly?

Originally Posted by badq45t

So SW222, did it feel like you had been rear ended with a big thump!

Originally Posted by S_W222

When it hits in an aggressive way, yes, it did, but it used to be that hard only 1 out of 10 times (9 soft, 1 hard). When the hard downshift hits, I always used to look in the mirror and always felt like 99% someone must have hit me from the back!

Because I can get sooooo picky with car and noises, and because I dealt with it for about 4 years before it was finally fixed, i have become so good in terms if forcing my car to repeat this rough downshifting over and over, I was almost able to predict every time based on speed, conditions, RPM and momentum when/how/if it will occur.

Originally Posted by MBNUT1

Help me understand how a hard downshift feels like you are being hit from the back? In Streamliner's case he described it like somebody else stepped on the brakes which I understand.

Originally Posted by MBNUT1

How long did your car shift smoothly? Just trying to get a sense of what changed. Clearly it is not the transmission mechanicals given that replacing the transmission and torque converter did not cure it.

Originally Posted by S_W222

@Streamliner
Oh man... i tell you, I really had 99% confidence that this would happen.... that's the reason I suggested you call them and ask them to not mess with the car... they worked on the car and re-assembled everything together, and at that point, I would rather have the original factory assembly structure because I know that replacing the transmission won't help at all (it is a DESIGN + SOFTWARE) issue.
The fact they told you (MB says it is a “software issue,” that they are “working on an update,” and would have one soon) means that whoever is doing service there, has no idea how to fix this issue!.. I told u i had to ask they take it to 3 other dealership locations until i found a mechanic who knows how to fix it.... THERE IS A SOLUTION ... i guarantee you, there is already a solution, but it only needs someone knowledgeable enough to do the service.... I will try to find the name of the mechanic who did the service on my car, but he works at MB in the east coast. remember, it is NOT a software issue, it is a design+software issue, and for that, there would need to be lots of manual adjustments for the gear ratios while car is being driven... almost like re-doing the engineering work from scratch and overwrite the car original values... in my case, my car drives like buttery smooth since service was done (1 year now, prefect shifting on all gears at all temperatures including cold start).

To be honest, if enough people would support (and are aware of this issue) you could easily sue MB for such an issue. (it is in ALL models from 2014-2021).... also, knowing that the W223 has same transmission design, I guarantee you it would do the same!.

Originally Posted by Streamliner

Within an hour of picking up my car, after the transmission & torque converter replacement, I phoned MBUSA to open a case. Yesterday, I received a phone call from an MBUSA “Executive Referral Manager,” and we spoke for 25 minutes. I kept my cool, but I REALLY gave this person an earful. I asked if MB had forgotten how to build transmissions. I suggested that if my 2020 had this problem, wouldn’t the new W223’s have it as well, if they didn’t know how to fix it. I was told, once again, that “a software patch was being developed to fix the problem.” When I asked just WHEN I could expect to see this remedy, they told me “we have no ETA on it,” to which I replied “that is unacceptable.”

Based on my conversation, it would appear that MBUSA will be looking to buy back my car. I know of at least one other member here who had his 2020 bought back over this issue. I guess MB must figure that most people just live with the problem and that very few actually push it, so if they have to buy a car back every now and then, no big deal. If that is the case, it is VERY depressing. To be continued..............

Originally Posted by MBNUT1

IMHO for Mercedes to produce an S Class which has unrefined shifting characteristics in this day and age kind of tells me Mercedes engineering has lost their way.

Originally Posted by Streamliner

I have commented on this before and my feeling is that MB is trying to be everything to everybody. They are doing too much at one time and unforgivable design defects are making it into production. I understand wanting to grow a company and expand market share, but at what price? Did we really need the A & B Class vehicles? Personally, I don’t think they even needed the C Class. If they felt the need for entry level passenger cars, they should have created another division and designed, engineered, produced and marketed those vehicles under a different name. Or, they could buy Chrysler—which, of course, they did—and we all know how that fiasco worked out.

The real problem, at least for me, is WHERE do you go from MB? Audi & BMW, to me, are “also rans,” offering nothing that interests me. Bentley? Maybe, but The New Flying Spur doesn’t light my fire, which it should for what it costs. Rolls-Royce? My upbringing really won’t allow me to spend that kind of money on a depreciating asset. So, perhaps I’ll take a step or two backwards to Genesis.

Originally Posted by Streamliner

I have commented on this before and my feeling is that MB is trying to be everything to everybody. They are doing too much at one time and unforgivable design defects are making it into production. I understand wanting to grow a company and expand market share, but at what price? Did we really need the A & B Class vehicles? Personally, I don’t think they even needed the C Class. If they felt the need for entry level passenger cars, they should have created another division and designed, engineered, produced and marketed those vehicles under a different name. Or, they could buy Chrysler—which, of course, they did—and we all know how that fiasco worked out.

The real problem, at least for me, is WHERE do you go from MB? Audi & BMW, to me, are “also rans,” offering nothing that interests me. Bentley? Maybe, but The New Flying Spur doesn’t light my fire, which it should for what it costs. Rolls-Royce? My upbringing really won’t allow me to spend that kind of money on a depreciating asset. So, perhaps I’ll take a step or two backwards to Genesis.

Originally Posted by badq45t

100% this felt like I was rear ended. The super hard downshift has happened to me 2x's only, other times it is a litlte jerky, but the first time this happened there was a car behind me probably 15-20 feet back and I was ready to jump out when I felt it, but realized he was way too far behind me to have hit me. The second time I was coming off the freeway and I was very sure I was hit but there was nobody behind me at all. I have a 2016 with some miles and years left on the extended warranty, I plan to stop and talk to the service writer about this issue and then have them evaulate it when I drop off to fix my other bug which is the wheel and seat not moving when I shut down.

This still the best car I have ever owned but I feel vindicated that I was not crazy when this happened.

Originally Posted by Streamliner

As most of you must know, MB has offered to “buy back” my car. With maybe 150 miles on the new transmission and torque converter, the car shifts rougher than it did before the surgery. So, WHY? Why can they not SIMPLY trace the problem down to the component or computer responsible for the rough shifting, replace it and have the car good to go? WHY? Why do the vast majority of 9G-Tronic transmissions work just fine, but some don’t and MB throws in the towel on a $131,000.00 S560 so quickly? I am having a very difficult time trying to understand this. I don’t want them to buy back the car, I want them to FIX it. Hey, Wolfman, might you comment on this please?

Originally Posted by S_W222

While I am not the most experiences member here in these issues concerning MB engineering, but I can assure you, MB corporate engineers already know VERY WELL about this issue , and have known it since 2015!. They have been claiming that a new software will be released to address this combination of Desingn/software/communication issue, YET THEY FAILED TO FIX IT! and they know it.... Fixing the issue would require a whole new design of the component that is causing this issue (which they are yet to identify. I also guarantee you that more than half of the vehicles are having this issue, but most car owners aren't reporting it or noticing it (people have different sensitivity to these issues, which is why some mechanics won't even notice or hear what you are referring to sometimes. MB corporate engineers are just hiding it and not announcing, cause simply they have no idea how to fix it yet!. BUT, like I said, there is a way to fix it manually (not at the design level), but on a manual step-by-step method that needs to be customized for every single car after is it assembled. I am super surprised that you and most others aren't following what I shared in my original post about this issue (just take it or ask them to take it to another dealer who knows how to repeat the steps that finally fixed my car after 3.5 years of tracking the issue!!).

Originally Posted by Streamliner

No offense, but if what you say is factual, then why do the vast majority of 9G-Tronic equipped vehicles perform flawlessly, while some don’t? My 2018 S560 was perfect, as are my 2019 SL450 and my 2019 E450 Wagon. My issue with the S560 is being handled by Fletcher Jones in Newport Beach, the largest MB dealer in the country. They have exceptional access to the MB factory. My car was even driven by an MB engineer who happened to be there at the time. I refuse to take my car to multiple dealers, as you did, hoping that I might find someone who can fix it. Modern day vehicles are almost always repaired by changing out components. My question is, how can MB not know just which component(s) to change out, which will cure this problem?

Originally Posted by DaveW68

At this point would it really hurt to show them the thread and how it was fixed for S_W? From what I understand, others have had this issue fixed too because of him posting what was done. Perhaps it's exactly what is needed to fix your car and maybe no part will fix it on its own.