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I’m looking at a 2014 S550 with 50,000 miles on it. I have an E300 at the moment but I’ve always wanted an S class and I love the W222. It’s in great shape and runs great but my mechanic told me that the engines in the W222 are money pits. He mentioned wiring harnesses and said he’s replaced several engines because of cylinder scoring.
Is this common? Are there years that are better than others? As an E class owner I have no illusions about maintenance and repair costs but I want to make sure I’m starting out in the right foot
I’m looking at a 2014 S550 with 50,000 miles on it. I have an E300 at the moment but I’ve always wanted an S class and I love the W222. It’s in great shape and runs great but my mechanic told me that the engines in the W222 are money pits. He mentioned wiring harnesses and said he’s replaced several engines because of cylinder scoring.
Is this common? Are there years that are better than others? As an E class owner I have no illusions about maintenance and repair costs but I want to make sure I’m starting out in the right foot
Thanks!
Oil in the wiring harness, yes...big time. You can search the forum or Youtube for videos about that, really easy to find.
Your mechanic said he's replaced several engines due to cylinder scoring? I find that interesting; the cost is so high that people tend to just walk away. The claim of cylinder scoring is a real thing, for 2014 only cars. The cylinder lining was made of some material I can;t seem to remember, maybe somebody else wil chime in. Opinion time: Personally; I'd run away from a 2014 for those reasons. But...If you got the engine scoped and the cylinder walls looked fine, and the service history and oil are good, then I'd consider it for the right price. Lastly, low mileage doesnt amount to much on a 10 year old car. All the rubber, gaskets, wiring, hoses, etc are 10 years old, regardless of miles. I wouldn't pay any sort of premium for it based on low miles, because of age. Again, those are just my opinions.
Cylinder scoring occurred mainly on pre March 2015 builds. Look for something manufactured after March and you wont have to be concerned.
Oil in harness, this was and still is an issue for numerous models as they shared the same crankshaft sensor parts, so its not just exclusive to the S-class. Inspect, clean with electronics cleaner, install pigtails, check and clean with every oil change. You wont have any issues.
I have a 2014 with 103k miles. In damn near perfect condition and I do not exaggerate when I say this. It is definitely a roll of the dice, I won't lie. But the S-Class is so much more car than an E-Class.
Maintenance wise , yes W222 is more expensive than E Class but same engines were also used in E Class (M278) . Well, I love M278 no matter what but honestly, E Class is more practical car but S Class is a different world . You would feel that every time you get in an S Class .I was also advised to stay away from M278 due to its complexity namely high mileage ones but no any engine is perfect to me
I’m looking at a 2014 S550 with 50,000 miles on it. I have an E300 at the moment but I’ve always wanted an S class and I love the W222. It’s in great shape and runs great but my mechanic told me that the engines in the W222 are money pits. He mentioned wiring harnesses and said he’s replaced several engines because of cylinder scoring.
Is this common? Are there years that are better than others? As an E class owner I have no illusions about maintenance and repair costs but I want to make sure I’m starting out in the right foot
Thanks!
Going back to your original post. I have a hard time believing one repair shop in central Kentuck has replaced "several" M278 engines. I could be wrong, but highly doubtful. If I were you, I'd ask the guy to quantify that number. Is he saying their shop has done 1 swap in 10 years, and has heard of other shops doing the same? Or has his shop personally done 20 engine swaps? I'm not a fan of ambiguity. Having said that; regardless of the answer - this is not the mechanic you want to use if you buy the car. He obviously isn't a fan of working on that generation of S-Classes. That's his choice. They are very complex and require expensive diagnostic equipment and sometimes problems can be difficult to identify, but that's the case with all modern engines. I'd just suggest you find a different indy mechanic if you do move forward with the purchase. IMHO
To the best of my ability to search, there are only four Mercedes dealerships in Kentucky - northern KY, Louisville, Lexington, and Bowling Green...and S Class cars are not very thick on the ground.
Corvette C8 997S, Jeep Grand Cherokee Summit Reserve BMW 750 S560 Coupe
In January I picked up a 2018 S class coupe, my 70th MB (out of close to 500 cars). I am pretty well known on many car forums, since I used to build one of kind cars (as a hobby) for people with more money than they knew what to do with. There are a few cars that I would probably not advise someone to buy without a warranty of some kind. The S class is one of them. You might be able to find a 2019 car that can still be eligible for a CPO, and it will have a better transmission in it (I was not a fan of the older transmission I owned a 2015 Sedan and a 2016 coupe). Nope it's not a Ferrari (I owned plenty of those), or a Lamborghini (though I voided my 2004 Gallardo warranty on day 4 when I took it apart and turned it into a RWD car then sent the specs to Lamborghini), but these cars can get expensive to repair (it can cost over $1500 to replace the voice activation module) and it might be worth spending a little more on a newer and CPO eligible car.
Mechanics are funny that way. Scare tactics. It took me some time to find a solid Indy shop that wasn't trying to swindle me because of the car I drive. I find this car to be solid compared to some of the others I've owned. Like the person who mentioned the Ferrari engines, money pit in comparison to what, a Lexus maybe. Because if the m278 is a money pit he's not worked on a BMW e63 or f12 motor or any Maserati tranny. Now those are money pits imo
Mechanics are funny that way. Scare tactics. It took me some time to find a solid Indy shop that wasn't trying to swindle me because of the car I drive. I find this car to be solid compared to some of the others I've owned. Like the person who mentioned the Ferrari engines, money pit in comparison to what, a Lexus maybe. Because if the m278 is a money pit he's not worked on a BMW e63 or f12 motor or any Maserati tranny. Now those are money pits imo
I know, right...it's all relative. The words "common" and "frequent" drive me crazy. Expensive, now that's a word that makes sense...because it's based on the value of a car. Nobody wants to spend more than 10% of the value of the car on repairs in a given year. A motor replacement would be more like 50%. Seriously though, it's hard to gauge the reliability fo a used car. If the first owner kept up with maintenance and didn't abuse the car it's going to be a better car in the long term than someone who neglected maintenace/repairs and abused the car. That's why service history is so important."Jjoeshannon095" is at 103K trouble free miles, congratulations! Might be nice to know how he maintains the car, and how he drives it. But no gaurantee any car will do that.
What we want to do is identify trends, and for that we need solid numbers, not anecdotes. That's whey words like common and frequent and "several" are useless without numbers to back them up. When we have real numbers we can make an informed opinion.
Last opinionated rant. There are 3 kinds of problems. 1. Comfort and convenience problems. 2. Mechanical driveability. 3. Dead on side of road.
In comparing the cars from the W220 to W223 S-class cars have gotten better in category 2 and 3, while getting worse in the first category. But every manufacturer has more issues with Category 1 convenience features, it's just that S-Classes tend to have a lot more of these features installed. Problem is that with online reviews, even from Consumer Reports, they don't make a distinction in their reliability ratings.
Last edited by carlosinseattle; 08-05-2024 at 01:38 PM.
I know, right...it's all relative. The words "common" and "frequent" drive me crazy. Expensive, now that's a word that makes sense...because it's based on the value of a car. Nobody wants to spend more than 10% of the value of the car on repairs in a given year. A motor replacement would be more like 50%. Seriously though, it's hard to gauge the reliability fo a used car. If the first owner kept up with maintenance and didn't abuse the car it's going to be a better car in the long term than someone who neglected maintenace/repairs and abused the car. That's why service history is so important."Jjoeshannon095" is at 103K trouble free miles, congratulations! Might be nice to know how he maintains the car, and how he drives it. But no gaurantee any car will do that.
What we want to do is identify trends, and for that we need solid numbers, not anecdotes. That's whey words like common and frequent and "several" are useless without numbers to back them up. When we have real numbers we can make an informed opinion.
Last opinionated rant. There are 3 kinds of problems. 1. Comfort and convenience problems. 2. Mechanical driveability. 3. Dead on side of road.
In comparing the cars from the W220 to W223 S-class cars have gotten better in category 2 and 3, while getting worse in the first category. But every manufacturer has more issues with Category 1 convenience features, it's just that S-Classes tend to have a lot more of these features installed. Problem is that with online reviews, even from Consumer Reports, they don't make a distinction in their reliability ratings.
A motor replacement for a 2014 would be more like 100%. There was a local 2014 that had to have the motor replaced for scoring. The cost was ~ $30K+.
This video covers a number of potential issues with the M278 motor.
Cylinder scoring occurred mainly on pre March 2015 builds. Look for something manufactured after March and you wont have to be concerned.
Oil in harness, this was and still is an issue for numerous models as they shared the same crankshaft sensor parts, so its not just exclusive to the S-class. Inspect, clean with electronics cleaner, install pigtails, check and clean with every oil change. You wont have any issues.
Do you have any Mercedes Benz documentation that the scoring issue was corrected post March 2015?
I know, right...it's all relative. The words "common" and "frequent" drive me crazy. Expensive, now that's a word that makes sense...because it's based on the value of a car. Nobody wants to spend more than 10% of the value of the car on repairs in a given year. A motor replacement would be more like 50%. Seriously though, it's hard to gauge the reliability fo a used car. If the first owner kept up with maintenance and didn't abuse the car it's going to be a better car in the long term than someone who neglected maintenace/repairs and abused the car. That's why service history is so important."Jjoeshannon095" is at 103K trouble free miles, congratulations! Might be nice to know how he maintains the car, and how he drives it. But no gaurantee any car will do that.
What we want to do is identify trends, and for that we need solid numbers, not anecdotes. That's whey words like common and frequent and "several" are useless without numbers to back them up. When we have real numbers we can make an informed opinion.
Last opinionated rant. There are 3 kinds of problems. 1. Comfort and convenience problems. 2. Mechanical driveability. 3. Dead on side of road.
In comparing the cars from the W220 to W223 S-class cars have gotten better in category 2 and 3, while getting worse in the first category. But every manufacturer has more issues with Category 1 convenience features, it's just that S-Classes tend to have a lot more of these features installed. Problem is that with online reviews, even from Consumer Reports, they don't make a distinction in their reliability ratings.
I purchased mine from the first owner at 80k miles. Per the VMI(and carfax for that matter) it was serviced exclusively at the dealer, on time, with no expense spared. I do 90% of my own work on my vehicles. In terms of repairs I have had three so far. I had a failing low pressure fuel pump at 86k miles, an airbag light caused by a bad passenger seat adjustment motor, and a leaking coolant line from behind the engine near the firewall. Cost me under $500 in parts.
Normal maintenance includes oil and filter changes at 4k intervals and a transmission service. Elective things I've done so far are the sacrificial harnesses on the cam position sensor/magnets, full front suspension rebuild, engine and transmission mounts, a facelift AMG steering wheel, Apple CarPlay retrofit, S63 AMG bumper swap, and replaced the lenses and unlocked my intelligent headlights. Considering I have a relatively modest income for this type of car it still does scare me, but the risk is worth the reward. Almost nothing better than a properly sorted S-Class.
People keep talking about cylinder scoring and something that fixed it in the 2015 model year ... but I've never seen any documentation on here of what was changed, from what VIN, etc.
People keep talking about cylinder scoring and something that fixed it in the 2015 model year ... but I've never seen any documentation on here of what was changed, from what VIN, etc.
Is this an 'urban legend'?
https://mbworld.org/forums/e-class-w...cylinders.html
There's more info out there, but this thread explains it. Just Google "M278 Silitec". It ran across several models that used the M278 engine. Can;t find the date, but can confirm from previous history about the date chanege where they made the change.
This is EXACTLY the wrong type of information anybody should rely on. What does common mean? The guy who posted it was on the forum for awhile, really nice guy. But without real numbers it makes no sense to rely on this type of information.
@Tom in Austin & @carlosinseattle , unfortunately there actually is MB documentation and reference in regards to the silitec equipped 278's (sub March 2015). Its not a guarantee there will be issues, just something to be aware of and take measures to monitor and possibly prevent. Friction reducers such as MOS2 or Ceratec could help, also there is the oil solenoid disconnect that increases oil pressure at low RMP.
https://mbworld.org/forums/e-class-w...cylinders.html
There's more info out there, but this thread explains it. Just Google "M278 Silitec". It ran across several models that used the M278 engine. Can;t find the date, but can confirm from previous history about the date chanege where they made the change.
I would like to see the actual WIS that he took snapshots from.
After you do your research and figure out what the right car is for you (year, options, etc), get your W222. For this price point, there is nothing better; truly an amazing car.
@Tom in Austin & @carlosinseattle , unfortunately there actually is MB documentation and reference in regards to the silitec equipped 278's (sub March 2015). Its not a guarantee there will be issues, just something to be aware of and take measures to monitor and possibly prevent. Friction reducers such as MOS2 or Ceratec could help, also there is the oil solenoid disconnect that increases oil pressure at low RMP.
Thanks for finding that info Vin! This is exactly what I'm talking about...this is REAL. Cylinder scoring in the 2014's is something to watch out for. Oil in the harnesses is something to take care of before it becomes a problem. The rest of the stuff is a crapshoot at best...it's bologna! It's just a bunch of anecdotal junk out there. Anything can happen once, or even twice, or more. But unless something becomes a pattern, it's not worth labeling as something to be concerned about. One thing we also know is a problem is 20" wheels. Anybody with 20" wheels will have bent rim(s), unless they're forged. It's only a matter of time. But you can go with 19's and reduce the chance of it happening, that's a real thing, and I've experienced it personally. All these "sky is falling" things are a waste of time. I won't go so far as to call that video clickbait, but it has no real world value.
@carlosinseattle I agree with you, I like to see data or at least a detailed first hand explanation of things. If I notice a spike in certain things, I’ll do some research on my own time before committing to buying parts.
Data-less blanket committed statements **** me off, especially something from the “never hybrid/electric” types who have no data referencing their “oh the battery will fail in a year and you’ll have to sell your house.” Then you ask if they are owners and it turns into a oh my brother’s previous neighbor heard about it in an AOL chat room. Meanwhile you have S-class and other hybrid owners with over 200k miles no issues.
08-04-2024, 12:18 PM
