SW20S

It’s the IR rejecting glass like they all have. My thought was it could be some sort of coating to perhaps address the reflection of the vents? I notice that’s not as bad as I anticipated. Could be something the newer ones have the older ones don’t.

Im a pretty objective guy. A car for me is 3 years, it not forever and I have no issue pointing out its faults. Carmakers make incremental improvements to cars over the years, each year is a little better than the last. I can give many examples of MB doing this in other models as well, 222 included. There were numerous improvements in the 19 and 20 model cars vs an 18, numerous improvements in the pre refresh cars along the years too. You don’t have to change the hardware to make improvements. The same transmission can behave totally differently with flashes etc. There are also differences unit to unit and with the expectations of the driver. People complained about shifting issues in the W222 also and I never felt any issues.

I’ve owned multiple versions of the same generation car several times in my life, and I have always seen improvements in all areas as years go on. Carmakers don’t make releases about every little tweak they make in between model years.

Im well aware of how 48v systems work thank you. There is absolutely an increased complexity insofar as the 48v system and how it interacts with the cars diagnostic system and how it relays those faults to the driver.

Not to be rude but I have had a 222 and have a 223, you haven’t. When you’ve had both you can argue with me that the 223 is not more complex than the 222. The increased complexity is everywhere. I don’t think there’s any question that the complexity has been poorly managed in this car and other MBUX MB models, but they are working through those challenges is my point.

S_W222

I am not sure it’s worth to respond to any of that, cause you seem to have the desire to argue but without any facts. ALL posts here suggests that the 2019 and 2020 are the same exact car with zero improvements. The only difference is that a new comm module for a new app was added in 2019. I asked you to give examples and you could not name a single measurable improvement across the years for W222 facelift.
For the 48V, again you are arguing against the fact without sharing facts. 48V, and according to all manufacturers and science, 48V systems hit the sweet-spot – between efficient power and simplicity with the goal to optimize and standardize accessories and other electronics on the vehicle (to reduce complexity) —> less wires (sometimes, but never more) and lower mass too. Afterall it’s only higher V and lower I for more power delivery and lower losses.
For the W222 transmission, you are incorrect. I can remind you of posts when you acknowledged having some vibration issues when idle that goes away when you move or switch to N. I know you were not sure about the source of that vibration. FYI - That has been confirmed to be a transmission issue cause I had that same issue and investigated that heavily with my dealer.
For the lasts item, am sad to read that here as mostly I encountered professional discussions here, especially from you, but this one is not one of them. I know u said u didn’t mean to be rude, but if you think owning a car for few 100s of miles and weeks allows you to tell others to not argue until they drive same distance then you are absolutely out of your mind. I could have told you that I (likely), and certainly in the last decade, owned at least 3X more cars than you and you can’t argue with me but I’d be adopting a highschool-like argument if I say so. I currently own 2 cars with 48V, and owned 4 in the last 5 years, but I still won’t tell you to wait for your 3rd 48V car to argue about that point.
The bottom line is, I don’t think anyone here knows the exact complexity difference between W223 and W222, but it is absolutely not day and night difference. Mbenz claims they have been doing more standardization and reducing complexity with their recent architecture.

SW20S

I wouldn’t seek to argue with you about cars that you have owned and I haven’t. As for how many cars you’ve owned vs me…you have no idea how many cars I have owned lol. Regardless of how long I’ve had the 223, I’ve had it longer than you have driven one on a test drive, and I’ve lived with it day in and day out for 3 weeks which you haven’t done. Theres an old saying “someone with experience is not at the mercy of someone with an opinion”. I am happy to defer to you on Teslas and BMWs, but not on cars I own and you don’t, sorry.

My experience will grow and I will continue to share that experience. Until you have one yourself though you shouldn’t argue with peoples actual first hand experiences. The 223 is an order of magnitude more complex than the 222, if you get one yourself you will see that too.

Every car gets a little better with each successive year. There are always little tweaks to address customer feedback etc. Examples are creaking interior materials in models that were improved very quietly, namely the C class and GLC models. Every time they release a reflash or a TSB for a car they incorporate those improvements into the build of the cars coming off the line making them better. I had two Jeep Grand Cherokees and have had 3 Chrysler Pacificas, the first GC and first Pacifica were nightmares, the replacements were great. Same generation, not a refresh. I had two LS460s, a 2015 and a 2017, same generation no refresh the 2017 was better in many ways. Engine was smoother, build was better. Rattles I had in the 15 never presented in the 17. Another example for MB is them quietly adding the cast iron liners to the M278 to address bore scoring. No refresh. No press release. No fanfare.

As for the transmission im talking about shifting, not the slight idle vibration. I didn’t have any issues with mine yet Streamliner had MB buy his back. I have experienced no odd or clunking shifting in my 223 either. If I do I will report it. It does have the same idle vibration although it’s lessened.

S_W222

Is yours 4-Matic?
W222 idle vibration was limited only to 4-Matic for whatever reason. De-coding some eco settings almost took that off. There is something in how the engine and transmission are coupled, and for some emissions related stuff, it causes that vibration that Mbenz is refusing to address in exchange to maintain some emissions numbers/threshold (just my own explanation).

SW20S

All W223s in the US are 4Matic, it’s the same kind of vibration it’s just less pronounced. It’s not a big deal at all, especially since the engine stop start shuts off at idle and that’s not problematic like it was in the 222.

RJC

A no excuses transmission that is seamless in its operation shifting both up/down when in auto/comfort mode.

SW20S

Can we not make this thread about the i7 too? lol

S_W222

Probably the only car that I think a two-tone paint makes it better... Two tone looks really good on the i7

SW20S

We were talking about glitches in MBUX and I mentioned how iDrive isn't perfect either. I stopped by the BMW forums today and a lot of stuff sure sounded similar:

Quote:

So today, I just got the scare of my Life! While coasting to a red light, the car killed and the brake lights came on, the stopping power was almost none and the break pedal was hard to the press. I started it back up and managed to pull in a parking lot with weak brakes... it prompted me to engage the parking brakes and after a few times, that seemed to fix it. I've attached a photo of the lights.

Quote:

Greetings all!

All on page 1. The complexity of all of these cars and the sheer amount of functions and personalization makes keeping them glitch free very hard.

RJC

Imho, the more electronics involved the more potential problems, let alone on an all-electric vehicle.

RJC

Luv a classic metallic silver.

OAN - sent you a follow up pm - did you receive it? Fwiw, my iPhone's mbworld app displays some different pms sent/recv'd than the website so maybe it's not displaying?

Times Two

Got some news for everyone regarding the S-Klasse. According to two recent articles on JESMB, the W223 Facelift budget has been increased a great deal, to a figure higher than what is normal/expected for a mid-cycle facelift (minor change). Unfortunately, this probably means it won’t arrive in the US until model year 2027:
https://jesmb.de/23058/

The S-Klasse is also not doing well sales-wise. The EQS sales struggles are well known to many of us, but it appears the Sonderklasse is headed down a similar path: Q2 sales have dropped 42% year over year, which may or may not be the reason for an additional shift cut at Factory 65:
https://jesmb.de/23111/

Frenetic

Maybe they can spend that extra money so it doesn’t feel like we’re sitting in an oversized C Class.

Streamliner

Well, this sounds like a serious move on MB’s part. Perhaps, issues that we have been complaining about here are being vocalized to dealers, MBUSA & Germany. Perhaps, German W223 owners have been very vocal. However it happened, it appears that they are going to do some major surgery to the W223. As disappointing as this may be to some, I find it quite exciting and promising. Now, if they would only offer a full electric version of a REAL S Class! That would really get my attention.

W205C43PFL

Wait... does that mean this reddit link that my friend shared with me is credible information.

SW20S

I'm wondering if you feel that way because you have a low optioned 500, I assume it doesn't have nappa leather? I just had a C300 loaner which I really liked actually but sitting in my S580 feels nothing like sitting in it, I have exclusive nappa with the full leather dash and doors...

Frenetic

It has nothing to do with the leather. It’s just the general layout and screen identicalness.

SW20S

Thats just it, its not identical at all. They both have horizontal gauge screens, and vertical infotainment screens and the way the consoles open is the same, bit the vents are an entirely different shape and placement, the armrests and door panel designs are totally different. The design of the wood trim is totally different, the center screen is smaller and angled towards the driver in the C and flat on the dash in the S, I just have no issue telling these two interiors apart.





I just don't think these two interiors at all look the same. You can tell they are both Mercedes...

Frenetic

They look awfully similar to me. If this isn’t a copy and paste, I don’t know what is.

Wolfman

Time to get new glasses then. The only thing seems to be same/similar are the screens. These are different interiors

SW20S

Totally, I just don't get it at all. All vehicles of a certain brand have a resemblance, but thats all I am seeing here.

NbyNW

Yeah, they're the same. Minor difference but the same. Both came from the same corporate cook book.

Lou B

All this shows is that people see things differently - whether it's pretty women, art, which club to hit 70 yards to the green, cars, iced tea, or German chocolate cake.

As my grandfather, the Admiral, who served in the US Navy for 48 years, 1885-1933, often told us kids, "Different ships, different long splices."

places

Same cookbook. Same architecture. Except for the vents and the doors the rest is pretty close to identical. These interiors were not developed apart. I sat in both and can say the fit and finish pretty much the same. The only thing that saves the S is the upgraded leather, but that's just an application.

QuadBenz

I agree with everything you said except fit and finish being the same. I've spent some extended time in C and GLC loaners and I felt there was a bit more chintziness to be had there.