S55 or S600?
04-19-2009, 11:42 PM
#26
Former Vendor of MBWorld
I'd have to cast my vote for the S600 with AMG kit, IMO it will be the best of both worlds. This is because of the power potential of the 600 with the good looks of the 55.
04-20-2009, 08:58 AM
#27
MBWorld Fanatic!
I am sure my 600 has the same big brakes as the CL65, they certainly
look big. Also the 600 brake pedal has more feel than the 65 brakes which
are slightly soft. But the seats!! my 600 seats in nappa exclusive leather
are definitely THE most comfortable seat I have ever sat in, the 65 seats
were more sporty and slightly harder. I often think I would like a suite of
furniture in my lounge made from exclusive nappa leather.lol.
look big. Also the 600 brake pedal has more feel than the 65 brakes which
are slightly soft. But the seats!! my 600 seats in nappa exclusive leather
are definitely THE most comfortable seat I have ever sat in, the 65 seats
were more sporty and slightly harder. I often think I would like a suite of
furniture in my lounge made from exclusive nappa leather.lol.
04-20-2009, 10:36 AM
#28
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08 S65, 06 M3 CS(stick), 02 BMW X5 4.6iS, 07 R1 Raven, 08 F-450 4x4, 08 CooperS JCW
I am sure my 600 has the same big brakes as the CL65, they certainly
look big. Also the 600 brake pedal has more feel than the 65 brakes which
are slightly soft. But the seats!! my 600 seats in nappa exclusive leather
are definitely THE most comfortable seat I have ever sat in, the 65 seats
were more sporty and slightly harder. I often think I would like a suite of
furniture in my lounge made from exclusive nappa leather.lol.
look big. Also the 600 brake pedal has more feel than the 65 brakes which
are slightly soft. But the seats!! my 600 seats in nappa exclusive leather
are definitely THE most comfortable seat I have ever sat in, the 65 seats
were more sporty and slightly harder. I often think I would like a suite of
furniture in my lounge made from exclusive nappa leather.lol.
-Rob
04-20-2009, 12:04 PM
#29
MBWorld Fanatic!
W220 Brake Specs
Model Front Rear
S430/500: 13.0"/4 piston 11.8"/2 piston
US S600: 14.2"/4 piston 13.0"/2 piston
S55/Euro S600: 14.2"/8 piston 13.0"/4 piston
S65: 15.4"/8 piston 13.7"/4 piston
S430/500: 13.0"/4 piston 11.8"/2 piston
US S600: 14.2"/4 piston 13.0"/2 piston
S55/Euro S600: 14.2"/8 piston 13.0"/4 piston
S65: 15.4"/8 piston 13.7"/4 piston
04-20-2009, 12:30 PM
#30
Member
Thread Starter
Yes, but does the S65 weigh more than the S600. If the S65 weighs 300 pounds more, and F=MA, then the effectiveness of the bigger brakes might be mitigated.
I found a 2005 S600 that is in my budget.
Going to look at it later today.
04-20-2009, 01:07 PM
#31
MBWorld Fanatic!
The S65 weighs about 6% more than the S600. The front brake swept area is about 18% greater.
04-20-2009, 01:35 PM
#33
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W220 S65 AMG
I am sure my 600 has the same big brakes as the CL65, they certainly
look big. Also the 600 brake pedal has more feel than the 65 brakes which
are slightly soft. But the seats!! my 600 seats in nappa exclusive leather
are definitely THE most comfortable seat I have ever sat in, the 65 seats
were more sporty and slightly harder. I often think I would like a suite of
furniture in my lounge made from exclusive nappa leather.lol.
look big. Also the 600 brake pedal has more feel than the 65 brakes which
are slightly soft. But the seats!! my 600 seats in nappa exclusive leather
are definitely THE most comfortable seat I have ever sat in, the 65 seats
were more sporty and slightly harder. I often think I would like a suite of
furniture in my lounge made from exclusive nappa leather.lol.
After a few days with my new S600 I realized the brakes were not really up to par. After tuning and some exhaust work, my tuner told me the brakes were not up to par either. So I slapped on some V12 Biturbo badges and the S65 brake kit on the front, and BAM we have a car that stops just as good as it accelerates!
04-20-2009, 02:49 PM
#34
MBWorld Fanatic!
CL65. The CL65 has a rather soggy pedal, ask Tom, I stiil have the post where I asked him if he had a soft pedal like mine, he said his was the same.
As for leather, the 65 had AMG leather which is NOT exclusive nappa leather,
unless you order it.
04-20-2009, 02:54 PM
#35
MBWorld Fanatic!
Please it's Sound 8.
And Oxygen stop being so patronizing.
Most of my information comes from personnel experiences.
The rest I read. I have owned E55,SL55,CL65,S600 and now SL63.
So I think I can talk on the subject!
And Oxygen stop being so patronizing.
Most of my information comes from personnel experiences.
The rest I read. I have owned E55,SL55,CL65,S600 and now SL63.
So I think I can talk on the subject!
04-20-2009, 03:14 PM
#36
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08 S65, 06 M3 CS(stick), 02 BMW X5 4.6iS, 07 R1 Raven, 08 F-450 4x4, 08 CooperS JCW
You dunnit again, I said the brakes on my 600 looked like the brakes on my
CL65. The CL65 has a rather soggy pedal, ask Tom, I stiil have the post where I asked him if he had a soft pedal like mine, he said his was the same.
As for leather, the 65 had AMG leather which is NOT exclusive nappa leather,
unless you order it.
CL65. The CL65 has a rather soggy pedal, ask Tom, I stiil have the post where I asked him if he had a soft pedal like mine, he said his was the same.
As for leather, the 65 had AMG leather which is NOT exclusive nappa leather,
unless you order it.
What you said was that the 600 has better brake-feel than the 65, I won't argue whether or not they're both soggy but that's NOT what you said...you said the 600 brakes feel better
-Rob
04-20-2009, 04:11 PM
#37
MBWorld Fanatic!
You dunnit again, I said the brakes on my 600 looked like the brakes on my
CL65. The CL65 has a rather soggy pedal, ask Tom, I stiil have the post where I asked him if he had a soft pedal like mine, he said his was the same.
As for leather, the 65 had AMG leather which is NOT exclusive nappa leather,
unless you order it.
CL65. The CL65 has a rather soggy pedal, ask Tom, I stiil have the post where I asked him if he had a soft pedal like mine, he said his was the same.
As for leather, the 65 had AMG leather which is NOT exclusive nappa leather,
unless you order it.
Tom
04-20-2009, 10:08 PM
#38
Super Member
04-21-2009, 07:29 AM
#39
MBWorld Fanatic!
sound8, no one cares if you used to own a gold-plated Maybach, incorrect "information" is incorrect no matter how you try and spin it....
What you said was that the 600 has better brake-feel than the 65, I won't argue whether or not they're both soggy but that's NOT what you said...you said the 600 brakes feel better
-Rob
What you said was that the 600 has better brake-feel than the 65, I won't argue whether or not they're both soggy but that's NOT what you said...you said the 600 brakes feel better
-Rob
I speak from experience.
And you said it, they are both soggy, an acknowledgment at last.
It's personal opinion to which feels the soggiest, to me the 600 feels
slightly less soggy. OK.
04-21-2009, 07:32 AM
#40
MBWorld Fanatic!
04-21-2009, 09:30 AM
#41
MBWorld Fanatic!
04-24-2009, 05:48 PM
#44
MBWorld Fanatic!
MB brakes have a progressive feel that allows a lot of modulation. On the other hand, when you need a lot of braking, they bite hard. This is all way before ABS or BAS deploys.
Compared with a purely competition setup, they might be called "soggy" by some. On the other hand, SLR reviewers consistently ding those brakes for lack of modulation. They're off until they're on.
MB brakes have a "house feel" that is quite consistent across most models.
04-24-2009, 07:10 PM
#45
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Isn't it amazing that after AMG was done tuning their supercharged 5.4 liter V8 for the 2003 models AND MB was done tuning their 5.5 liter twin turbo V12 for the 600 models also for the model year 2003... that... surprise... both engines made the exact same 493hp!!!
The answer of course is that they do NOT.
Member Treynor dyno'd his bone stock down to the air filters 2003 S600 at 480rwhp. That my friends is WAY WAY more than 493 ponies at the fly.
Most SC'd 55s put down around 400rwhp which is very much in keeping with 493 flywheel.
So, what gives? Simple. AMG builds an outstanding supercharged V8 that makes more or less 500hp and is the king kong engine for 2003 release. Problem is after MB finished with the TTV12 it was making much more power. Can't have a standard Merc outpowering the most powerful AMG to date now can we. So, both were rated 493hp but in reality the 600s make better than 550hp. Torque wise different planets, the TT rules.
Programming of the 600s is softer and considering the potential owners the throttle is very soft. Gotta squeeze fairly hard to get into the actual power. Nothing that cannot be fixed with an AMG upgrade. Treynors promptly rolled 525rwhp after his upgrade.
The answer of course is that they do NOT.
Member Treynor dyno'd his bone stock down to the air filters 2003 S600 at 480rwhp. That my friends is WAY WAY more than 493 ponies at the fly.
Most SC'd 55s put down around 400rwhp which is very much in keeping with 493 flywheel.
So, what gives? Simple. AMG builds an outstanding supercharged V8 that makes more or less 500hp and is the king kong engine for 2003 release. Problem is after MB finished with the TTV12 it was making much more power. Can't have a standard Merc outpowering the most powerful AMG to date now can we. So, both were rated 493hp but in reality the 600s make better than 550hp. Torque wise different planets, the TT rules.
Programming of the 600s is softer and considering the potential owners the throttle is very soft. Gotta squeeze fairly hard to get into the actual power. Nothing that cannot be fixed with an AMG upgrade. Treynors promptly rolled 525rwhp after his upgrade.
04-24-2009, 10:28 PM
#47
Senior Member
[QUOTE=c131frdave;3477607]Yes, but does the S65 weigh more than the S600. If the S65 weighs 300 pounds more, and F=MA, then the effectiveness of the bigger brakes might be mitigated.
I tend to agree. I saw that the 60-0 For the 2010 S550 is 108 Feet, however one of the popular Car Rags benchmarked the 2008/2009 S63 at 118 ft for 60-0 . So I am not surprised if it takes more brakes to haul down the S65.
I tend to agree. I saw that the 60-0 For the 2010 S550 is 108 Feet, however one of the popular Car Rags benchmarked the 2008/2009 S63 at 118 ft for 60-0 . So I am not surprised if it takes more brakes to haul down the S65.
04-25-2009, 12:55 PM
#48
Member
Thread Starter
Yes, I am a genius. Thank you.
Now that my thread has been successfully hijacked, I'll interject what we finally did (see thread title), and then you all can continue bashing each other about brakes.
We gave a deposit for a 2004 S600, but my wife spotted a 2002 S600 for about half the price, and was the color she wanted (blue). They are both very similarly glorious inside and out, but you definitely can feel the difference when you drive them down the road as far as power goes. Interestingly the '02 came with a warranty, and the '04 did not (or nearly did not- it expires in a few months while the '02s doesn't expire for 3 years). Both had about the same miles.
So, because I've been reading about so many failures of this or that component, and the ridiculous price for spare parts, to be safe we decided to "try" out a Merc by buying the one with the warranty first. If we continue to love it over the next year or so, she says she'll let me buy the bi-turbo.
For now I'm very happy with what we have. It's fast enough to keep up with 95% of what's on the road, and even then most people in New York/New England don't have enough ***** to drive into the triple digits anyway, so I'll beat the middle aged wienie in his Ferrari F430 eventually.
I'll post some pics in the regular W220 forum when I get a chance. I am the plant manager of a power plant, and it is "outage season", which means I get to work 7 10 hour days in a row for two months...
Now that my thread has been successfully hijacked, I'll interject what we finally did (see thread title), and then you all can continue bashing each other about brakes.
We gave a deposit for a 2004 S600, but my wife spotted a 2002 S600 for about half the price, and was the color she wanted (blue). They are both very similarly glorious inside and out, but you definitely can feel the difference when you drive them down the road as far as power goes. Interestingly the '02 came with a warranty, and the '04 did not (or nearly did not- it expires in a few months while the '02s doesn't expire for 3 years). Both had about the same miles.
So, because I've been reading about so many failures of this or that component, and the ridiculous price for spare parts, to be safe we decided to "try" out a Merc by buying the one with the warranty first. If we continue to love it over the next year or so, she says she'll let me buy the bi-turbo.
For now I'm very happy with what we have. It's fast enough to keep up with 95% of what's on the road, and even then most people in New York/New England don't have enough ***** to drive into the triple digits anyway, so I'll beat the middle aged wienie in his Ferrari F430 eventually.
I'll post some pics in the regular W220 forum when I get a chance. I am the plant manager of a power plant, and it is "outage season", which means I get to work 7 10 hour days in a row for two months...
04-25-2009, 03:11 PM
#49
MBWorld Fanatic!
Yes, I am a genius. Thank you.
Now that my thread has been successfully hijacked, I'll interject what we finally did (see thread title), and then you all can continue bashing each other about brakes.
We gave a deposit for a 2004 S600, but my wife spotted a 2002 S600 for about half the price, and was the color she wanted (blue). They are both very similarly glorious inside and out, but you definitely can feel the difference when you drive them down the road as far as power goes. Interestingly the '02 came with a warranty, and the '04 did not (or nearly did not- it expires in a few months while the '02s doesn't expire for 3 years). Both had about the same miles.
So, because I've been reading about so many failures of this or that component, and the ridiculous price for spare parts, to be safe we decided to "try" out a Merc by buying the one with the warranty first. If we continue to love it over the next year or so, she says she'll let me buy the bi-turbo.
For now I'm very happy with what we have. It's fast enough to keep up with 95% of what's on the road, and even then most people in New York/New England don't have enough ***** to drive into the triple digits anyway, so I'll beat the middle aged wienie in his Ferrari F430 eventually.
I'll post some pics in the regular W220 forum when I get a chance. I am the plant manager of a power plant, and it is "outage season", which means I get to work 7 10 hour days in a row for two months...
Now that my thread has been successfully hijacked, I'll interject what we finally did (see thread title), and then you all can continue bashing each other about brakes.
We gave a deposit for a 2004 S600, but my wife spotted a 2002 S600 for about half the price, and was the color she wanted (blue). They are both very similarly glorious inside and out, but you definitely can feel the difference when you drive them down the road as far as power goes. Interestingly the '02 came with a warranty, and the '04 did not (or nearly did not- it expires in a few months while the '02s doesn't expire for 3 years). Both had about the same miles.
So, because I've been reading about so many failures of this or that component, and the ridiculous price for spare parts, to be safe we decided to "try" out a Merc by buying the one with the warranty first. If we continue to love it over the next year or so, she says she'll let me buy the bi-turbo.
For now I'm very happy with what we have. It's fast enough to keep up with 95% of what's on the road, and even then most people in New York/New England don't have enough ***** to drive into the triple digits anyway, so I'll beat the middle aged wienie in his Ferrari F430 eventually.
I'll post some pics in the regular W220 forum when I get a chance. I am the plant manager of a power plant, and it is "outage season", which means I get to work 7 10 hour days in a row for two months...
Sorry for being an accomplice to threadjacking. Enjoy the new ride!
Tom
