My Powerchip ECU Tune
08-26-2009, 04:08 AM
#26
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V12-Biturbo
Ahh Nope...
I think Reckless had an old, very conservative, mail order tune in the car before. CPT has dyno'd plenty of other V12 cars before, so questioning their dyno's integrity I think is a bit premature. I have personally witnessed my RENNTech SL600, a Kleemann S600, another ECU'd S600, and my SL65 dyno there. ALL the other dynos, except Hussain's, were relatively in line with expectations.
You guys will just have to take my word when I say that CPT does not bull**** around with their dyno. They have a weather station right next to the screen, they input the figures from the station, and that's it. They don't even use shootout mode, and have no interest in doing so. In fact, I don't think they even know how to use it because they don't want to give varying figures.
ENDSMTG is going to take his E55 over to CPT to see how his numbers from Fluid Motor Union's DD compare to CPTs. That should give us a good comparo between the two. As far as I can see, they both will give close numbers. FMU does not mess with the CFs either, their DD actually has built in weather readings so they don't touch anything.
-m
You guys will just have to take my word when I say that CPT does not bull**** around with their dyno. They have a weather station right next to the screen, they input the figures from the station, and that's it. They don't even use shootout mode, and have no interest in doing so. In fact, I don't think they even know how to use it because they don't want to give varying figures.
ENDSMTG is going to take his E55 over to CPT to see how his numbers from Fluid Motor Union's DD compare to CPTs. That should give us a good comparo between the two. As far as I can see, they both will give close numbers. FMU does not mess with the CFs either, their DD actually has built in weather readings so they don't touch anything.
-m
In an attempt show you i'm right, lets play along w/this mini tune for a second...
So you'd have us believe in STOCK FORM he's way to high for the Coveted King of Dyno machines lol..
If it were reading Conservative OP's S600 should've Dyno'd @ 400-420 rwhp & Drum roll here 475-500 rwto, you'd have us believe The Powerchip ECU on 93 Octane gained BETWEEN 160-185 RWTQ on 19-20PSI
or possible 91 gain in RWHP, not possible on otherwise stock S600Even on 105 Octane tune this isn't possible...Remember he has No supporting cooling mods done.
This stock S600 #'s match-up EXACTLY to HIGHEST DynoJet results w/same S600. That are posted All over Dragtimes on DynoJets...
Last edited by Thericker; 08-26-2009 at 05:10 AM.
08-26-2009, 03:46 PM
#29
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Sean:
Vadim is talking about the "peak" difference "under the curve". You are talking about the difference in torque at its "peak" figure. Like when I sent you a PM discussing my "peak difference" of 100+ lbs-ft of torque "under the curve".
Tom
Vadim is talking about the "peak" difference "under the curve". You are talking about the difference in torque at its "peak" figure. Like when I sent you a PM discussing my "peak difference" of 100+ lbs-ft of torque "under the curve".
Tom
08-26-2009, 11:36 PM
#30
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S600TT, R350
TRUE peak TQ is what gets these heavy cars off the line, & keeps tranny in 1 piece.
Sean, I do not think you understand the physics of how car accelerates.
Peak number does not mean a thing. Area under the curve over time is what makes the car accelerate faster.
Do not make me school you on this...................
BTW, it is a joke................ so chill dude.................
08-26-2009, 11:39 PM
#31
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GL550, C55, 335i Coupe, vintage Mustang
I have driven the vehicle in question before and after he dyno'd at CPT. In fact, he may not know this, but I have been working on that car since before Reckless owned it. I installed the boost gauge, brakes, etc. and can say that in my opinion, his car was stock. His boost(on the gauge) was right in line with every other 600 that I have been around. I have been around CPT's dyno for a while now, and for some reason I can't explain, and neither can Al, Reckless' car dyno'd well beyond what any normal 600 has. I wish I could explain it, and I can't. I don't doubt Al at all, in fact he is one of the only dyno operators I trust implicitly due to his non-variance of procedure during a dyno. I do not want to discredit FMU as they do a good job, but to be honest, you HAVE to know what you are doing with these cars when you hook up boost and RPM sensors when you do a dyno. Without a proper RPM signal, there is no way to accurately measure torque, and most shops take a boost reading off the right side intercooler. That is not an accurate measure of boost since it is before the actual intake manifold. I believe that Reckless has a great tune now, but I really feel that his CPT dyno had something freakishly wrong with it. The only thing that will matter to me is seeing it dyno again on CPT's dyno soon. I do look forward to driving it the next time I see it to see how it is now. I love my job.
Nick
This post is in no way meant to discredit anybody, rather, it is just a statement of my knowledge and opinion. Let the flaming begin.
Nick
This post is in no way meant to discredit anybody, rather, it is just a statement of my knowledge and opinion. Let the flaming begin.
Last edited by nick 55; 08-26-2009 at 11:45 PM.
08-27-2009, 12:10 AM
#32
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S600TT, R350
LOL... So explain to me ohh wizard? how Kleemann/RENNtech tuned 600/65 models do so well down 1320' w/PEAK TQ coming in @ MUCH lower RPM's vs your special version coming in @ 70+ MPH
I'd love to see your S600 #'s down the 1/4 mile, off the line you'd fall on your face, Peak TQ on your graph appears @ 70-75mph??
I'd love to see your S600 #'s down the 1/4 mile, off the line you'd fall on your face, Peak TQ on your graph appears @ 70-75mph??
My graph is a 3rd gear run, not acceleration run down a 1/4 mile.
08-27-2009, 12:26 AM
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S600TT, R350
Jeezuss Vadim, I thought we all dynoed in proper 4th gear true 1 to 1 gear...Silly me I thought it was 1/4 mile tree
4th gear on 91 gas is going 170 mph with 20 mph fan. Guess what happens my wizard - DETONATION and 30% less power.
08-27-2009, 12:37 AM
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S600TT, R350
Here is the dyno graph. S65 - Powerchip software - 3rd (red) and 4th (blue)gear runs.
With proper fans on the dyno and race gas this car should be over 600RWHP, but very few dynoes are properly equipped to handle high HP cars.
08-27-2009, 12:51 AM
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S600TT, R350
Hmmm you don't have ANY Octane booster lying around? I remember you highly recomending a certain brand to me on phn that you loved to use lol...I had a single lunchroom fan working on my SL in 95 degree heat in 4th gear, didn't hit 170mph
I realize you're just being obtuse, but why not use proper octane? or fan? & new set of tires that aren't bald & run in proper gear while trying to tune for MAXIMUM gains, lame excuses Wizard...
I realize you're just being obtuse, but why not use proper octane? or fan? & new set of tires that aren't bald & run in proper gear while trying to tune for MAXIMUM gains, lame excuses Wizard...
The bald tire bit was on the street, get you memory straight......
I am putting together with Powerchip guys a dyno day sometime next week. Why do not finally show up, after cancelling five times, and lets see what us wizards can do for you.
It is time to put up or shut up.
08-27-2009, 01:18 AM
#36
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S600TT, R350
Please...Jeremy/Powerchip will TUNE my SL on the Dyno, your version is inherently flawed.
I canceled on you because your results are subpar, you also were trying to get my 05' SL as a test bed for your TCU plans, which you told me couldn't be completed on your older 2003 S600. I didn't want to become another Tombstone in your parking lot alongside Havoc/AMGSC & recently free'd New2this (SL65)
??? Sean, I use POWERCHIP for my tuning. Which part of this you did not understand in many, many hours of our conversations??? Jeremy is the one who is modding the code.
Shall we go into your 15 hour IC Reservoir Tank install quote? 5-6 hr job max, then you added "Sean these Reservoir tanks are extremely RARE, I'll have to custom fab yours for another $500" (I bought a flawless custom made Reservoir tank 5.5 gallons $160 delivered)
Hey, you do not like my quote, get it done somewhere else. Ask Alan how many hours it truely took to do his E55 properly. You wanted custom tank and this what fabricator charges.
Powerchip is doing custom tunes days next week. I will post more details tomorrow.
I canceled on you because your results are subpar, you also were trying to get my 05' SL as a test bed for your TCU plans, which you told me couldn't be completed on your older 2003 S600. I didn't want to become another Tombstone in your parking lot alongside Havoc/AMGSC & recently free'd New2this (SL65)
??? Sean, I use POWERCHIP for my tuning. Which part of this you did not understand in many, many hours of our conversations??? Jeremy is the one who is modding the code.
Shall we go into your 15 hour IC Reservoir Tank install quote? 5-6 hr job max, then you added "Sean these Reservoir tanks are extremely RARE, I'll have to custom fab yours for another $500" (I bought a flawless custom made Reservoir tank 5.5 gallons $160 delivered)
Hey, you do not like my quote, get it done somewhere else. Ask Alan how many hours it truely took to do his E55 properly. You wanted custom tank and this what fabricator charges.
Powerchip is doing custom tunes days next week. I will post more details tomorrow.
08-27-2009, 01:24 AM
#37
Enough with the foreplay boys and get to it already
!I have an idea, let's have a dyno day on Saturday well I'm in town. I suggest using a dyno jet and have a all out hp war between classes. Let the games begin!!!! Ice up the reservoirs, race gas, race tunes, and whatever else creates more hp. I think it would be a blast to see what these cars would do on the same dyno on the same day. Enough with the "heartbreak dyno crap" or my dyno reads lower than yours or etc etc. This whole dyno stuff is getting old and trying to compare different dynos on different days is fricken lame. Let's get a Socal dyno day for this Saturday and lay down the power and have some fun. Leave all of the BS at home.
Vadim, can you set it up? If you could create a new thread and lets do it.
Last edited by bassn_07; 08-27-2009 at 01:26 AM.
08-27-2009, 01:31 AM
#38
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S600TT, R350
You told me on the phone you actually tweaked the files? Also how you were instrumental in the E55 super tunes? Guess it's all
Either way Jeremy's latest file is light years ahead of what you were trying to sell me...
Either way Jeremy's latest file is light years ahead of what you were trying to sell me...
Call Travis.
08-27-2009, 03:48 AM
#39
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I have driven the vehicle in question before and after he dyno'd at CPT. In fact, he may not know this, but I have been working on that car since before Reckless owned it. I installed the boost gauge, brakes, etc. and can say that in my opinion, his car was stock. His boost(on the gauge) was right in line with every other 600 that I have been around. I have been around CPT's dyno for a while now, and for some reason I can't explain, and neither can Al, Reckless' car dyno'd well beyond what any normal 600 has. I wish I could explain it, and I can't. I don't doubt Al at all, in fact he is one of the only dyno operators I trust implicitly due to his non-variance of procedure during a dyno. I do not want to discredit FMU as they do a good job, but to be honest, you HAVE to know what you are doing with these cars when you hook up boost and RPM sensors when you do a dyno. Without a proper RPM signal, there is no way to accurately measure torque, and most shops take a boost reading off the right side intercooler. That is not an accurate measure of boost since it is before the actual intake manifold. I believe that Reckless has a great tune now, but I really feel that his CPT dyno had something freakishly wrong with it. The only thing that will matter to me is seeing it dyno again on CPT's dyno soon. I do look forward to driving it the next time I see it to see how it is now. I love my job.
Nick
This post is in no way meant to discredit anybody, rather, it is just a statement of my knowledge and opinion. Let the flaming begin.
Nick
This post is in no way meant to discredit anybody, rather, it is just a statement of my knowledge and opinion. Let the flaming begin.
Everyone who has contributed to my car, Nick (Motorwerks), Jeremy (Powerchip), OJ (Fluid Motor Union) are all top notch people. I can't say enough how lucky I am to find people who do good quality work with heart.
08-27-2009, 04:19 AM
#40
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Nick: Do you feel like I need to re-dyno it at CPT? The initial dyno from FMU matched spot on with the dyno from CPT (+/- 2 on both hp and tq). They had the same philosophy of not inflating numbers at all. I'm not sure if they measured boost from the inter coolers (the graph seemed accurate to me, 14 psi for the stock run).
Do most 600's produce this kind of power after being tuned? The impression I got after talking with every tuner I could was that it should produce 500 RWHP, and 640 RWTQ post tune generally speaking. I got more torque but a little less hp.
Do most 600's produce this kind of power after being tuned? The impression I got after talking with every tuner I could was that it should produce 500 RWHP, and 640 RWTQ post tune generally speaking. I got more torque but a little less hp.
08-27-2009, 09:51 AM
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Did you raise the rev limiter? The S65 is hitting 126mph+ in 3rd gear. Most 65/600 won't hit 120mph in 3rd...
Tom
08-27-2009, 01:37 PM
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08-27-2009, 03:53 PM
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E63 P30, CL500 Sport
With all the "interesting" posts, this thread is getting more confusing than it is getting clearer. Are we comparing two Powerchip files done by the same person at different times, of different cars, and on different dynos 
Lets get all cars on the same dyno on the same day, but then we're still left with the basic question of what exactly will we be comparing? Are we seriously comparing one of Jeramy's files to one of his old files
Vadim, do you do your own tuning now or do you still use Powerchip?
Lets get all cars on the same dyno on the same day, but then we're still left with the basic question of what exactly will we be comparing? Are we seriously comparing one of Jeramy's files to one of his old files
Vadim, do you do your own tuning now or do you still use Powerchip?
Last edited by MB_Forever; 08-27-2009 at 06:11 PM.
08-27-2009, 05:34 PM
#47
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Sean, you are not a good listener. Jeremy does the file tweaking, I collect data and make recommedation on what needs to be done. It has been done this way since 2002. This is how I worked on C32, on E55s, on S600s and on and on and on..........................................
Call Travis.
Call Travis.
09-21-2009, 03:53 PM
#49
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Thread Starter
Past weekend I had put the LET (Eurocharged) Tune on my car to see if it was any different/better than my PC tune (I was jealous of MRAMG & Busa last week). Below are dynos done on a 2WD analog Dyno Dynamics Dyno (the heart breaker 
):
There were 3 runs (LET Cold, LET Hot, initial dyno with my PC file). Gains are approx 23 HP, 69 TQ. I was very impressed.
I will comment further on how the car feels in a day or so (I've only driven it 40 miles or so).
):There were 3 runs (LET Cold, LET Hot, initial dyno with my PC file). Gains are approx 23 HP, 69 TQ. I was very impressed.
I will comment further on how the car feels in a day or so (I've only driven it 40 miles or so).
