ABC Visit Workshop message
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2006 S65
Can't lemon law a car just because you don't agree with the way they designed it. That's more a case of you shouldn't buy an old one because they are a known maintenance nightmare. The ABC system was the first crack at it, and it got much more reliable and worry free in the 221/216 chassis cars. Unfortunately, these old cars are so cheap, they are bought by people without the budget to maintain a $100K car that has the best of everything and overly complex systems. So now, there's tons of people that cry about the system when the $10k car they bought needs $10k in service. That's the reason the cars are cheap, just part of the chance you take when you buy one.
As far as "low mileage", sitting is what kills these cars. I see much better average condition on the ones that have 100k+ miles on them, as they need to be driven and driven hard. The systems sitting idle or barely working don't keep them going, they just fail anyway.
As far as "low mileage", sitting is what kills these cars. I see much better average condition on the ones that have 100k+ miles on them, as they need to be driven and driven hard. The systems sitting idle or barely working don't keep them going, they just fail anyway.
I understand what you are saying. However, so many have had this issue with the system. Trust me, I'm not crying about it, I can afford the repair. My problem is that even when people get it fixed, it occurs again: A flawed and dangerous system.
I went into this car knowing about maintenance and cost of replacement parts. For such a major component to fail at an early mileage,(Yes, 76000 is not a lot of miles in todays standards), to me is unacceptable. MB should have had a recall or TB on this. For a hose on the ABC to blow while doing 70mph is extremely dangerous. For that fact, MB should have had a developed replacement parts that would be more reliable.
I do love this car, and will have her back running at top condition. it's just surprising that for so many years, MB has continued to use this bad system without redesigning it.
I see they have the Magic Body Control in todays MBs. Does this still use the same ABC system but with a camera technology?
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'06 MB S55 AMG; '04 Audi Allroad 4.2; '05 BMW M3 Conv.; '92 MB 500E
Both are prone to leaks, hose failures, etc. -- name one fluid or air handling system in a car that's not. And both have improved over the years. But to answer your question, MB still uses both air and fluid hydraulics, and everyone seems to agree fluid is better than air the heavier the car. According to AMG, the W222 S63 with Airmatic "does most of what ABC does", but notice the word "most".
I have not seen people who change fluid frequently report failures anyway. But over the life of a car, there is maintenance AND repair. Doing the maintenance won't always eliminate repairs. I have air suspensions in other cars (basically Airmatic), and I'll take ABC every day of the week and twice on Sunday. It's been easier to maintain + even when both are perfect ABC works better.
maw
Last edited by maw1124; Aug 27, 2016 at 02:10 PM.
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2006 S65
I had a Jaguar XJR with air suspension. During the winter the front end would dip due to the hoses leaking, especially under 30 degrees. The compressor sometimes wouldn't work because of the cold, so I would be driving a lowrider.
When the ABC did work on the Merc, I loved it. It was amazing how it controlled a 4800lb car in hard turns. I guess I'm just bummed that I have a big repair when only had the car 3 months.
Oh well, she will be repaired!
When the ABC did work on the Merc, I loved it. It was amazing how it controlled a 4800lb car in hard turns. I guess I'm just bummed that I have a big repair when only had the car 3 months.
Oh well, she will be repaired!
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From: Laguna Niguel
'94 SL600,'05 SL600,'06 S65,'07 E63,'14 E63S,'09SL600 all sold, ‘15 S65,‘18 E63S,'17 SL65, '17S65Cab
Just a minor point, the w221 S63 is not 4Matic, it has ABC. That said I have owned 4 MB's with ABC and one with Airmatic (W211 S63.)
The ABC is far better than the Airmatic in my experience. Also, regarding failures and repair, the Airmatic required no maintenance in 70k miles and 7 years of ownership. The 2005 and 2006 required major repairs around 50k miles and again at 80k (to fix what was not fixed at 50k miles.) The 2009 has not required any ABC maintenance.
I tend to believe on the older model ABC cars it is time, not mileage that leads to failures. Preventive maintenance could extend the life of some of the ABC components, I did not have any done.
The 2015 S65 with ABC and MBC is a dream to drive, no maintenance issues after 7k miles.
The ABC is far better than the Airmatic in my experience. Also, regarding failures and repair, the Airmatic required no maintenance in 70k miles and 7 years of ownership. The 2005 and 2006 required major repairs around 50k miles and again at 80k (to fix what was not fixed at 50k miles.) The 2009 has not required any ABC maintenance.
I tend to believe on the older model ABC cars it is time, not mileage that leads to failures. Preventive maintenance could extend the life of some of the ABC components, I did not have any done.
The 2015 S65 with ABC and MBC is a dream to drive, no maintenance issues after 7k miles.
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'06 MB S55 AMG; '04 Audi Allroad 4.2; '05 BMW M3 Conv.; '92 MB 500E
Yes, I corrected thread entry #28 to clarify I was talking about the W222. Stated differently, only to include 4Matic in the S63 did MB AMG move away from ABC. And that's according to MB AMG.
Cheers,
maw
Cheers,
maw
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'06 MB S55 AMG; '04 Audi Allroad 4.2; '05 BMW M3 Conv.; '92 MB 500E
Sorry about that. No one likes to dump an unintended $3k in a car that they sourced carefully. Hopefully you got your money on the way in. And hopefully this doesn't become habit. Out of curiosity, how much was the part and what was the labor rate? It's been a while since I've used a dealer.
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2006 S65
Sorry about that. No one likes to dump an unintended $3k in a car that they sourced carefully. Hopefully you got your money on the way in. And hopefully this doesn't become habit. Out of curiosity, how much was the part and what was the labor rate? It's been a while since I've used a dealer.
Flush, fill, rodeo, $1000
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'06 MB S55 AMG; '04 Audi Allroad 4.2; '05 BMW M3 Conv.; '92 MB 500E
They were doing fine, up until the "flush, fill and rodeo" for a grand. Did you get a look at the old fluid?
My one complaint about the ABC system (I know, I'm lenient) besides their "lifetime fluid" nonsense, is that the sensors are located INSIDE the strut, so that (1) they cannot be replaced separately; and (2) Arnott can't offer rebuilds.
If someone here has contrary information on (1) or (2) above, I'd love to hear it. I'm a big fan of Arnott on my Audi Allroad (which is basically Airmatic -- uses the same pump).
maw
My one complaint about the ABC system (I know, I'm lenient) besides their "lifetime fluid" nonsense, is that the sensors are located INSIDE the strut, so that (1) they cannot be replaced separately; and (2) Arnott can't offer rebuilds.
If someone here has contrary information on (1) or (2) above, I'd love to hear it. I'm a big fan of Arnott on my Audi Allroad (which is basically Airmatic -- uses the same pump).
maw
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2006 S65
They were doing fine, up until the "flush, fill and rodeo" for a grand. Did you get a look at the old fluid?
My one complaint about the ABC system (I know, I'm lenient) besides their "lifetime fluid" nonsense, is that the sensors are located INSIDE the strut, so that (1) they cannot be replaced separately; and (2) Arnott can't offer rebuilds.
If someone here has contrary information on (1) or (2) above, I'd love to hear it. I'm a big fan of Arnott on my Audi Allroad (which is basically Airmatic -- uses the same pump).
maw
My one complaint about the ABC system (I know, I'm lenient) besides their "lifetime fluid" nonsense, is that the sensors are located INSIDE the strut, so that (1) they cannot be replaced separately; and (2) Arnott can't offer rebuilds.
If someone here has contrary information on (1) or (2) above, I'd love to hear it. I'm a big fan of Arnott on my Audi Allroad (which is basically Airmatic -- uses the same pump).
maw
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'06 MB S55 AMG; '04 Audi Allroad 4.2; '05 BMW M3 Conv.; '92 MB 500E
Great, then you have time. See if the Indy you were talking to can do it (swap a strut, fluid, filter and rodeo). FYI, the computer does the rodeo -- maybe it takes 1/2 hour; hour max. By now, you're as familiar as they are, so you can have an intelligent conversation and see if they know what they're doing. If they do, ask them for a labor only price, and use the dealer for "parts only." My guess is you'll save at least a grand.
The strut should be at most 2 hours labor, you know what the fluid and filter cost, and they have another $450 of almost pure profit in calibration and alignment. Which is why they call them "stealerships."
maw
The strut should be at most 2 hours labor, you know what the fluid and filter cost, and they have another $450 of almost pure profit in calibration and alignment. Which is why they call them "stealerships."
maw
Last edited by maw1124; Aug 29, 2016 at 04:51 PM.
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2006 S65
One good thing is that the dealership will give me a loaner car. That will save me $200+ on a rental. The Indy shop I spoke with doesn't seem to be that great. They never return emails or answer my questions directly.
How can I tell if the fluid is spent? Black in color?
How can I tell if the fluid is spent? Black in color?
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2006 S65
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'06 MB S55 AMG; '04 Audi Allroad 4.2; '05 BMW M3 Conv.; '92 MB 500E
So their view was that the faulty strut sensor caused the pump to shut off? Just trying to understand as much as I can about how this system works.
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2006 S65
Yes. It sent the ABC system a message the level sensor was malfunctioning. This stopped the pump from pressurizing the system. All 4 struts are currently 'locked' into position. The car is safe to drive per the service manager.
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MERCEDES-BENZ CL-CLASS
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'06 MB S55 AMG; '04 Audi Allroad 4.2; '05 BMW M3 Conv.; '92 MB 500E
Thanks for the kind words. Arnott does rebuild ABC shocks including for the S-Class W220 https://www.arnottindustries.com/par...18_pid214.html
Cheers,
maw
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2006 S65
Ok, final bill: $2400
New strut, alignment, oil change, mBrace activation.
Got the mBrace only for reselling purposes.
Overall, the dealership was phenomenal and they let me use a 2016 C300 as a loaner.
New strut, alignment, oil change, mBrace activation.
Got the mBrace only for reselling purposes.
Overall, the dealership was phenomenal and they let me use a 2016 C300 as a loaner.
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MERCEDES-BENZ CL-CLASS
Originally Posted by maw1124
I asked you a question on the forum and left you a voice mail about this. Why does Arnott do non-AMG ABC Struts only? Also, how do you handle the sensors in the rebuild process?
Thanks,
maw
Thanks,
maw
Sorry for the late reply. I was waiting for confirmation on the sensor question. I got it but must not have posted the reply.
We do support both AMG and Non-AMG models for W220 and W221 Chassis S-Class vehicles. You'll find them here: https://www.arnottindustries.com/par...ENZ_yid18.html
Regarding the sensors we test them before rebuilding them but we do not use new ones. The typical failure point on these is the rubber seal that the OE uses. We replace those with polyurethane versions that hold up much better to the fluid.
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'06 MB S55 AMG; '04 Audi Allroad 4.2; '05 BMW M3 Conv.; '92 MB 500E
I understand rebuilding the electronic sensors. Soldering should do the trick in most cases. Could have saved VinnyT a few bucks...
How've they been holding up in practice? Anyone here used them?
Cheers,
maw
Last edited by maw1124; Sep 9, 2016 at 02:47 PM.
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MERCEDES-BENZ CL-CLASS
They seem to hold up well. We've even instituted a new quality check recently (last year) where we now randomly pull some out of the box and test the unit. Every so often we'll install some on one of our vehicles for a road test.
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MERCEDES-BENZ CL-CLASS
Please note that sometime in 2001 MB changed the hose so earlier W220 models with VIN before approximately (last six) 290213 have a different part number than after that. When you purchase from us we ask for the VIN number during checkout just to make sure you get the right one. If your are buying from one of our resellers you can send our tech support department the VIN and they can check for you too. techassistance@arnottinc.com
You can see the different hoses in the pictures on https://www.arnottindustries.com/par...18_pid214.html
You can see the different hoses in the pictures on https://www.arnottindustries.com/par...18_pid214.html
