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Yes, I insulted him, not his modification lol. I insulted you a couple times as well, of course after you both insulted me. Honestly I'm more than happy to continue flinging insults at each other but this is beginning to get quite exhausting.
Funny thing is I actually agreed Mahunt, obviously not on the baffle but everything else. He somehow seems to think I insulted his mods and am claiming that the mods that I did is the best thing that ever happened and nothing else compares, which I don't.
It's only you that thinks air intake modifications are scams. You are right though, I don't know the exact science behind everything and I may absolutely be articulating the arguments wrong. I disagree with your HVAC comparison, I don't think you're taking into account the volume of air moving through the intake system at speed as well as the air pressure created by that volume at speed in tiny air intake tubes as compared to a house with only fan pressure, very wide tubes, and extremely long lengths to cover.
I could be wrong though, but what I do know is that smoothing the airflow and bringing in cold air does create HP. Why else would Renntech and AMG and Brabus all offer intakes for MB cars? For example Renntech modifies the factory M113 airboxes by deleting the internal baffles and raising the body of the airbox by an inch. I do know that manufacturers do often times offer vehicles with hood scoops, what's the dodge redeye that has hole in the headlight. There are also quite literally hundreds of videos on youtube, from manufactures of cold air intakes to guys in their garage modifying their cars, that show HP/TQ gains with air intake mods on the dyno and the track. I know that my car certainly is running faster at the track. Finally, as I pointed out ages ago in this thread, Mercedes themselves also chooses to run a straight shot from the grill on their w220 S500.
Speaking of Camaros and not tried and true world known MB engine tuners (RENNtech, Kleeman, Brabus, etc.).
This is a funny way to get air into the intake.
What? It's not facing forward! It's just providing access to THE HIGH PRESSURE bulge at the base of the windshield. Holy Horror!
And my other, other car. Absolute madness! A rearward facing hood scoop that picks up fresh air at the base of the windshield. The physics alone are preposterous.
67 Camaro convertible SS 396 RS (few, but some options). With the hood closed and mated to the cowl induction seal air cleaner. Lest I be labeled a liar. Why all this concern from GM about fresh air as opposed to ram air coming from the front of the car? What's the deal?
Oh wait, the MB tuners just provide better access to cooler outside air not rammed air which is turbulent.
These are my cars, I actually own them. Do you really have a R129 that you would like to share pictures of, or are you just expressing an opinion on something you don't own.
Lol, so you agree that high-pressure is a good thing, as is fresh air?
That's actually precisely the theory behind the mod, idea being that removing the baffles not only gets more direct fresh air from the grill but also that at speed it creates more pressure in the intake tubes due to the ram effect. Certainly it is only at high-speeds that it works but still, every extra HP counts right?
No one ever made the claim that cowl inductions hoods don't work or that other intake mods don't work. Again, as I said, there is a million different ways to skin a cat. Although I suspect the only reason you brought up cowl hoods is to elevate your own self-worth by showing us all how much stuff you've bought.
Honestly boys, we just keep going round and round in circles, at this point I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree.
I'm sure the rest of the forum is tired of our incessant bickering by now. We're not going to admit we're wrong nor are we going to convince each other to see the other's point of view anytime soon.
I could do with an apology for the personal insults.
You know what, even though you threw the first punch. I did up the ante quite a bit on the personal insults lol. That was both childish and inappropriate and for that I do apologize.
I actually am good friends with Renntech's head engineer, who like me is also a Mechanical/Motorsports engineer with good on and off-track experience.
I paid them a visit not that long ago and I actually got to see some old Renntech SL74s at the shop among some AMG SL60s the rt 74 did not have the baffle but I believe the AMGs did, Interestingly enough my buddy was working on upgrades for the older cars including a new intake setup for the R129s. This intake setup involves modifying and adding a bigger inlet to the stock airbox (like the old RT but improved) but it also gets rid of the baffles and replaces them with something else. It actually had something resembling a fin so it directs more into the inlet. They were testing it with positive results.
From my conversations about the topic, I recall that on the bigger builds they always got rid of the baffle and that it did help, to the point that now they are even improving on the concept.
I was told they are starting a Classics division and that they plan to offer a bunch of stuff for the older cars, which is pretty neat.
Now as someone who also works in the field and designs parts professionally for automakers I can tell you guys that airflow, like aerodynamics and weight, is death by a thousand cuts, any improvement you do can help. Will it be great in the grand scheme of things? probably not but bit by bit things can be achieved.
Now I do not want to stir any problems around here, it's cool to try new things or not, so let's just enjoy our cars, no need to turn something we all enjoy into something we do not.
I actually am good friends with Renntech's head engineer, who like me is also a Mechanical/Motorsports engineer with good on and off-track experience.
I paid them a visit not that long ago and I actually got to see some old Renntech SL74s at the shop among some AMG SL60s the rt 74 did not have the baffle but I believe the AMGs did, Interestingly enough my buddy was working on upgrades for the older cars including a new intake setup for the R129s. This intake setup involves modifying and adding a bigger inlet to the stock airbox (like the old RT but improved) but it also gets rid of the baffles and replaces them with something else. It actually had something resembling a fin so it directs more into the inlet. They were testing it with positive results.
From my conversations about the topic, I recall that on the bigger builds they always got rid of the baffle and that it did help, to the point that now they are even improving on the concept.
I was told they are starting a Classics division and that they plan to offer a bunch of stuff for the older cars, which is pretty neat.
Now as someone who also works in the field and designs parts professionally for automakers I can tell you guys that airflow, like aerodynamics and weight, is death by a thousand cuts, any improvement you do can help. Will it be great in the grand scheme of things? probably not but bit by bit things can be achieved.
Now I do not want to stir any problems around here, it's cool to try new things or not, so let's just enjoy our cars, no need to turn something we all enjoy into something we do not.
Godspeed everyone.
Damn man, where were you 5 days ago when I needed you lol.
Renntech should just give up on the intake with the inlet fin replacing the baffle. Even if they're showing positive results, it's been proven by the Home Depot HVAC theory that it won't work LMAO. Ok I'll stop now. I wonder if I'll ever get an apology from anyone, or even an acknowledgment that I wasn't talking complete bullocks. Probably not, o well.
Great post, that's pretty cool to hear that their opening a classic division. I can't speak for anyone else, but since you do have the ear of the head engineer at Renntech....headers would be pretty nice....
OR
A manual swap conversion. I would pay a premium to have my car professionally converted to a 6 speed.
If I remove both front air inlet baffles on my 97 SL600 that already has RENNtech airboxes and the resonator delete, what sort of improvement could I expect to see? Five, ten, twenty HP? I won't hold you to any numbers, just a guess will do.
I'm from FL too and have run the 1/8 mile at Sunshine Speedway before any improvements shown above. The weather is starting to turn cooler somewhat and I was thinking of going down the strip again. The first time down the strip resulted in wiping out both rear tires (ate clean through the tread into the cords) due to poor tire location control (rear caster, camber, toe) because of tired links.
Wondering where are all these dyno sheets, from these 389hp renntech engines. My e55 made 370whp that’s easily in the 450hp crank range.
Your comment makes it seem like you don’t know much about cars, Crank hp Vs horsepower to the wheels. Last time I checked renntechs just been ripping people off since the late 90s.
do you have actual dyno sheet posted? Cannot find it anywhere
Can anyone tell, how can i connect MAF with the Y pipe used on M113K Engine Intake? I am going to install M113K airbox stuff on my N/A M113 and can't figure out how to connect Y pipe with MAF.
I didn’t think wavetrac had a lsd for this size diff. Quaife defiantly does. Great mod for the cost. I will try and dyno my car this week. Seems like 5.0 113s usually make 255 to 260whp. Will see if my intake and removing the secondary cats made any improvements.
Also at the time I installed the 80mm throttle body on my 210 E55. Every calculation I did said 74mm was more than enough for making 350whp. But when I dynoed it after the 80mm tb is gained 20whp. I really need to find a 5.4 and swap it. I think also buying a new intake manifold will make some more power. Also hit up Speed43 for one of his MAF to intake manifold elbows. They seem to work well.
Stay away from OE tuning, people have reported really bad experiences with them. Eurocharged has indicated that they would be able to provide a tune for my 99' SL, but I never pulled the trigger.
My first mod to the SL was remove the intake baffles on the radiator so that the intake is getting "ram" air from the grill.
The second thing I did was to replace the airbox with m113k airboxes and Y pipe. Again, same thing, "ram" air directly into the intake manifold.
Right now I'm looking into an exhaust, I'm probably going to go the CKS route for the muffler and possibly a custom x-pipe to replace the resonators in the middle of the car.
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