SL/R230: SL500 to BMW650
09-01-2005, 01:41 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
SL500 to BMW650
I love Mercedes but I had to post this.
I have been out there for the past 3-4 months considering a new SL500 but I dont want to go and blow up $90 - 110K with changes coming up in SL engine, so many different options, so many complaints with the car and service at dealerships in your forum. With my CLK320 too, I am now fed up of hundreds of visits to the dealerships for minor issues. I have had my Acura MDX longer than the CLK but I see the dealership only for service. I dont want to even start comparing the 2 dealerships.
So now, go and check out the BMW 650 as it is now truly taking on SL in terms of looks, new 4.8 - 32 valve - 360 hp engine, decent bumper (what is this thing about paying $5K more for sports package on a $95K car), run flat tires, bluetooth, variation of benz's parktronic and keyless go, full maintenance for 4 years = all these being standard instead of silly add ons. BMW is offering a mix of everything standard (as seen in a lexus) and german enginering.
And to top this, have you seen the MSRP on 650 ? And for those who think that 650 is to be compared to CLK, go check the dimensions. And who are we to set comparison standards anyways, bmwusa website loves to compare 650 to the SL.
I have been out there for the past 3-4 months considering a new SL500 but I dont want to go and blow up $90 - 110K with changes coming up in SL engine, so many different options, so many complaints with the car and service at dealerships in your forum. With my CLK320 too, I am now fed up of hundreds of visits to the dealerships for minor issues. I have had my Acura MDX longer than the CLK but I see the dealership only for service. I dont want to even start comparing the 2 dealerships.
So now, go and check out the BMW 650 as it is now truly taking on SL in terms of looks, new 4.8 - 32 valve - 360 hp engine, decent bumper (what is this thing about paying $5K more for sports package on a $95K car), run flat tires, bluetooth, variation of benz's parktronic and keyless go, full maintenance for 4 years = all these being standard instead of silly add ons. BMW is offering a mix of everything standard (as seen in a lexus) and german enginering.
And to top this, have you seen the MSRP on 650 ? And for those who think that 650 is to be compared to CLK, go check the dimensions. And who are we to set comparison standards anyways, bmwusa website loves to compare 650 to the SL.
09-01-2005, 05:03 PM
#2
I feel the same way...
Hands down the SL is a better looking car, but if the service and quality suck why buy one?
I think the 650 is a good looking car but it has ugly interior.
There is NO comparison to a CLK.. The 6 is large and roomy, except for the back seat which is small but still usable.
What bugs me about the whole Mercedes dealership complaints is that they have been going on for a long time yet NO changes are being made.
Its as if they dont think they have a problem ?!
If my company ranked almost dead last in quality and customers were complaing on a daily basis I'd start cleaing house and re-training employees.
But... as long as we keep buying they wont change..
Hands down the SL is a better looking car, but if the service and quality suck why buy one?
I think the 650 is a good looking car but it has ugly interior.
There is NO comparison to a CLK.. The 6 is large and roomy, except for the back seat which is small but still usable.
What bugs me about the whole Mercedes dealership complaints is that they have been going on for a long time yet NO changes are being made.
Its as if they dont think they have a problem ?!
If my company ranked almost dead last in quality and customers were complaing on a daily basis I'd start cleaing house and re-training employees.
But... as long as we keep buying they wont change..
09-01-2005, 06:02 PM
#3
Who are we to compare? I think as the consumer, we can compare whatever we want.
Heck, I've seen folks compare the X5 to the RX8!
Motortrend compared a 645 vs CLK55 vs GTO once.
Heck, I've seen folks compare the X5 to the RX8!
Motortrend compared a 645 vs CLK55 vs GTO once.
09-01-2005, 11:49 PM
#4
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2004 SL55, 2005 E500 Wagon
Puranm, I compared the CL600 and the 645 in a previous thread. Here is a rewrite that compares the two cars you’re talking about.
I had a deposit in on the 645 for almost three years, and when the car came out, I couldn’t get all the goodies I wanted, so I held off for a few months. When I saw all the teething problems the car was having, I converted my deposit to an M6 deposit, and bought a Mercedes. But I didn’t buy a SL500; I didn’t even seriously consider one. I bought an SL55. I wasn’t willing to make the handling and power compromises that the SL500 would have brought.
If you get the 650, you’re going to get a car that’s got more go than a SL500, and one that handles better. Neither car has a usable back seat. I consider the 645/50 back seat useless for adults, so I figured I wasn’t giving up anything in passenger-carrying capacity by going with the SL. The SL500 is more luxurious, and the ride is plusher. The 645/50 is more involving, and the interior is austere – some would say Spartan.
The Bimmer active steering is controversial; it isolates you from what the tires are doing, but means that you really never have to take your hands away from the 9 and 3 position. I consider the BMW dynamic suspension to be a real winner, but the Mercedes ABC system is also quite good. There’s a great list of gizmos: HUD, Bluetooth, etc.
The iDrive system is sort of like COMAND once you get to going through on-screen menus, but COMAND uses buttons instead of the knob to get at the first screen (A minus from my perspective, since there’s no tactile differentiation of the buttons), and COMAND has more direct access buttons, like radio, zoom in and out, mute, NAV info, that avoid your having to look at the screen (A plus from my perspective).
The 645 had more than its share of electronic gremlins. I would expect that most, but by no means all, of the bugs are worked out by now, and there shouldn’t be too many new ones since the 650 is substantially the same except for the engine, and the engine was used in the X5. I think most of the bugs have been worked out of the SL500 as well.
The top on the SL500 has no competition from the 650. You either get the coupe, and have the quiet of the SL500 when the top’s up, or you get the cab, and have all the soft top noise and other comfort compromises. The 650 has a huge trunk, and the SL500 a small one.
I don’t think there’s an objective clear winner here.
Jim
I had a deposit in on the 645 for almost three years, and when the car came out, I couldn’t get all the goodies I wanted, so I held off for a few months. When I saw all the teething problems the car was having, I converted my deposit to an M6 deposit, and bought a Mercedes. But I didn’t buy a SL500; I didn’t even seriously consider one. I bought an SL55. I wasn’t willing to make the handling and power compromises that the SL500 would have brought.
If you get the 650, you’re going to get a car that’s got more go than a SL500, and one that handles better. Neither car has a usable back seat. I consider the 645/50 back seat useless for adults, so I figured I wasn’t giving up anything in passenger-carrying capacity by going with the SL. The SL500 is more luxurious, and the ride is plusher. The 645/50 is more involving, and the interior is austere – some would say Spartan.
The Bimmer active steering is controversial; it isolates you from what the tires are doing, but means that you really never have to take your hands away from the 9 and 3 position. I consider the BMW dynamic suspension to be a real winner, but the Mercedes ABC system is also quite good. There’s a great list of gizmos: HUD, Bluetooth, etc.
The iDrive system is sort of like COMAND once you get to going through on-screen menus, but COMAND uses buttons instead of the knob to get at the first screen (A minus from my perspective, since there’s no tactile differentiation of the buttons), and COMAND has more direct access buttons, like radio, zoom in and out, mute, NAV info, that avoid your having to look at the screen (A plus from my perspective).
The 645 had more than its share of electronic gremlins. I would expect that most, but by no means all, of the bugs are worked out by now, and there shouldn’t be too many new ones since the 650 is substantially the same except for the engine, and the engine was used in the X5. I think most of the bugs have been worked out of the SL500 as well.
The top on the SL500 has no competition from the 650. You either get the coupe, and have the quiet of the SL500 when the top’s up, or you get the cab, and have all the soft top noise and other comfort compromises. The 650 has a huge trunk, and the SL500 a small one.
I don’t think there’s an objective clear winner here.
Jim
09-02-2005, 01:43 AM
#5
Member
Thread Starter
I agree with lorinserbenz about the 650 interior and the Benz service.
Thanks Jim for the rewrite.
I am looking for daily drive, so I will be happy with a 650 coupe. I will sacrifice the cab feel in 650 coupe but I intend keeping my CLK Cab.
It has been tough dealing with the Benz service team. This time, I feel like giving BMW a chance. But I love the SL too, so it is a tough call right now.
Also SL is way overpriced and takes a huge depreciation hit. This is what makes the choice harder. Plush interior with COMMAND is 20-25K more than the ugly interior with iDrive. Tough choice - we will see - maybe flip a coin - heads or tails.
Thanks Jim for the rewrite.
I am looking for daily drive, so I will be happy with a 650 coupe. I will sacrifice the cab feel in 650 coupe but I intend keeping my CLK Cab.
It has been tough dealing with the Benz service team. This time, I feel like giving BMW a chance. But I love the SL too, so it is a tough call right now.
Also SL is way overpriced and takes a huge depreciation hit. This is what makes the choice harder. Plush interior with COMMAND is 20-25K more than the ugly interior with iDrive. Tough choice - we will see - maybe flip a coin - heads or tails.
09-02-2005, 10:06 AM
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2004 SL55, 2005 E500 Wagon
With respect to service, I think the local situation is the long pole in the tent. My local Mercedes dealer, Stahl in Monterey, has fantantic service, where the BMW dealer in Seaside (who has also serviced my Porsches) is just OK (Neither are bad).
From what I've seen, the support the dealers get from MBUSA and BMWNA is about the same.
Jim
From what I've seen, the support the dealers get from MBUSA and BMWNA is about the same.
Jim
Last edited by CASL55; 09-02-2005 at 10:09 AM.
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09-02-2005, 12:34 PM
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Wait for the SL with the new 388 hp engine...
The BMW interior looks cheap and the top is not in the same league as the SL's folding hard top. The SL is also a better looking car, both top up and down.
The BMW interior looks cheap and the top is not in the same league as the SL's folding hard top. The SL is also a better looking car, both top up and down.
Last edited by RJC; 09-02-2005 at 12:40 PM.
09-03-2005, 10:52 AM
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Mercedes C400, BMW X3
Different strokes
Both of these cars are top of the heap for V8 luxury GT's under $100K in my book. I have owned both and feel both are flawed.
I have owned four SL's- 2003 and 2004 SL500, 2003 SL55 and now a 2005 SL600. Each one of them has suffered from varying degrees of the same basic problem: the brakes are noisy and quirky and the top can make noise periodically. I find both problems annoying but not serious enough to keep taking the cars in for service all the time.
I truly believe that the build quality on BMW is better than Mercedes- the tolerances are superior, the number of interior rattles are fewer. But it seems like the materials are more plasticky in the BMW these days, at the very least, they seem less luxurious than Benz. The biggest problem I had with my 645 was the run flat tires, and I did not even have the sports suspension. The ride quality made me crazy- the vibrations from these tires gave me a headache. I had the same problem in the 545 and recently in a 330. I am picking up a 750 next week, which do not have run flats, the only car in BMW's line which doesn't.
I have owned four SL's- 2003 and 2004 SL500, 2003 SL55 and now a 2005 SL600. Each one of them has suffered from varying degrees of the same basic problem: the brakes are noisy and quirky and the top can make noise periodically. I find both problems annoying but not serious enough to keep taking the cars in for service all the time.
I truly believe that the build quality on BMW is better than Mercedes- the tolerances are superior, the number of interior rattles are fewer. But it seems like the materials are more plasticky in the BMW these days, at the very least, they seem less luxurious than Benz. The biggest problem I had with my 645 was the run flat tires, and I did not even have the sports suspension. The ride quality made me crazy- the vibrations from these tires gave me a headache. I had the same problem in the 545 and recently in a 330. I am picking up a 750 next week, which do not have run flats, the only car in BMW's line which doesn't.
09-07-2005, 12:54 PM
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2002 BMW 745Li Black/beige, 2006 SL600 Capri Blue/Black still on order
Originally Posted by shoes
Both of these cars are top of the heap for V8 luxury GT's under $100K in my book. I have owned both and feel both are flawed.
I have owned four SL's- 2003 and 2004 SL500, 2003 SL55 and now a 2005 SL600. Each one of them has suffered from varying degrees of the same basic problem: the brakes are noisy and quirky and the top can make noise periodically. I find both problems annoying but not serious enough to keep taking the cars in for service all the time.
I truly believe that the build quality on BMW is better than Mercedes- the tolerances are superior, the number of interior rattles are fewer. But it seems like the materials are more plasticky in the BMW these days, at the very least, they seem less luxurious than Benz. The biggest problem I had with my 645 was the run flat tires, and I did not even have the sports suspension. The ride quality made me crazy- the vibrations from these tires gave me a headache. I had the same problem in the 545 and recently in a 330. I am picking up a 750 next week, which do not have run flats, the only car in BMW's line which doesn't.
I have owned four SL's- 2003 and 2004 SL500, 2003 SL55 and now a 2005 SL600. Each one of them has suffered from varying degrees of the same basic problem: the brakes are noisy and quirky and the top can make noise periodically. I find both problems annoying but not serious enough to keep taking the cars in for service all the time.
I truly believe that the build quality on BMW is better than Mercedes- the tolerances are superior, the number of interior rattles are fewer. But it seems like the materials are more plasticky in the BMW these days, at the very least, they seem less luxurious than Benz. The biggest problem I had with my 645 was the run flat tires, and I did not even have the sports suspension. The ride quality made me crazy- the vibrations from these tires gave me a headache. I had the same problem in the 545 and recently in a 330. I am picking up a 750 next week, which do not have run flats, the only car in BMW's line which doesn't.
