SL55/63/65/R230 AMG: Waitlist?
03-16-2008, 07:33 PM
#26
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SL55, Cayenne S, Tundra, 360 spider
Just remember that since you got 20% off of the old design SL that your 50%2 year depreciation starts 20% lower. So, your 2008 SL55 should be worth about 40K in 2010/2011.
As it has been mentioned here, these cars are worth what we are willing to pay for them. If we expect huge discounts then we will get them by not paying full price.
Just don't expect incredible resale values when you expect to get 20% off sticker. It just doesn't work like that.
I remember the days when AMG's held their values very well, 99 - 2003. You could buy a 208 CLK55 or 210 E55 drive it for a year and sell it for a 5K loss. Even the 211 E55 and 230 SL55 in 2003 could be driven for a year with little depreciation.
Funny since they imported like 5000 SL55's into the US in 2003. This tells you that it is not only volumes it is peoples willingness to pay.
At 5000 units, every dealer could have had what like 15 SL55's in 2003???? Not exactly a rare car but that didn't stop everyone from buying them.
All that said, it doesn't stop me from buying cars but I agree with everyone..... don't ever buy a car at over sticker. Use the internet and your phone and never pay more than MSRP.
My .02
As it has been mentioned here, these cars are worth what we are willing to pay for them. If we expect huge discounts then we will get them by not paying full price.
Just don't expect incredible resale values when you expect to get 20% off sticker. It just doesn't work like that.
I remember the days when AMG's held their values very well, 99 - 2003. You could buy a 208 CLK55 or 210 E55 drive it for a year and sell it for a 5K loss. Even the 211 E55 and 230 SL55 in 2003 could be driven for a year with little depreciation.
Funny since they imported like 5000 SL55's into the US in 2003. This tells you that it is not only volumes it is peoples willingness to pay.
At 5000 units, every dealer could have had what like 15 SL55's in 2003???? Not exactly a rare car but that didn't stop everyone from buying them.
All that said, it doesn't stop me from buying cars but I agree with everyone..... don't ever buy a car at over sticker. Use the internet and your phone and never pay more than MSRP.
My .02
Great post but you forgot to add in the declining dollar. With that coupled to your equation....look out below.
03-16-2008, 08:14 PM
#27
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Always amusing when guys get hung up over MSRP (most guys who have relationships w/well-managed dealers get early cars at MSRP anyway
).....real question is likely 6-12mos deprec...these cars are all rapidly obsolescent tech devices that are fairly elderly/irrelevant 6-12mos post-launch....
Ferraris only have 100% MSRP one-yr trade-in value b/c of the clever Ponzi scheme F plays w/US mkt....which may collapse w/launch of this CA GT in Fall08, in volumes in a weak US economy....recall that, in ?'94-'95, my elders tell me that FoSF had several new, red/tan 355Spiders sitting on the lot looking for a home at MSRP or less....
The dollar's decline...and lack of ability of mfrs to meaningfully raise prices...only illustrates how powerful the US mkt is for any high-end car....today's new S65 only costs about as much as a mere S500 costed in '92, adjusted for inflation and interest rates, but ignoring FX....
Cars are fairly cheap, rapidly obsolescent, disposable tech commodities.....I wouldn't want them any other way....
).....real question is likely 6-12mos deprec...these cars are all rapidly obsolescent tech devices that are fairly elderly/irrelevant 6-12mos post-launch....Ferraris only have 100% MSRP one-yr trade-in value b/c of the clever Ponzi scheme F plays w/US mkt....which may collapse w/launch of this CA GT in Fall08, in volumes in a weak US economy....recall that, in ?'94-'95, my elders tell me that FoSF had several new, red/tan 355Spiders sitting on the lot looking for a home at MSRP or less....
The dollar's decline...and lack of ability of mfrs to meaningfully raise prices...only illustrates how powerful the US mkt is for any high-end car....today's new S65 only costs about as much as a mere S500 costed in '92, adjusted for inflation and interest rates, but ignoring FX....
Cars are fairly cheap, rapidly obsolescent, disposable tech commodities.....I wouldn't want them any other way....
03-16-2008, 08:16 PM
#28
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E 63S Wagon Renntech, E55 Renntech, SL65, SL 55 030, ML, bunch of old ones--they come, they go...
I have a small market dealer as a client....
if you'll PM me, I'll try to put you together. Very little smoke or BS.
03-16-2008, 10:00 PM
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'08 Audi R8, '09 SL63, '10 GLK, '10 ML550
Always amusing when guys get hung up over MSRP (most guys who have relationships w/well-managed dealers get early cars at MSRP anyway).....real question is likely 6-12mos deprec...these cars are all rapidly obsolescent tech devices that are fairly elderly/irrelevant 6-12mos post-launch....
Cars are fairly cheap, rapidly obsolescent, disposable tech commodities.....I wouldn't want them any other way....
).....real question is likely 6-12mos deprec...these cars are all rapidly obsolescent tech devices that are fairly elderly/irrelevant 6-12mos post-launch....Cars are fairly cheap, rapidly obsolescent, disposable tech commodities.....I wouldn't want them any other way....
Rapidly obsolescent, disposable tech commodities is so true! We flip our cars every two years, or so, just like a lot of other MB owners.
03-16-2008, 10:05 PM
#30
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CLS63, GLK350
LOL. You don't mince words, and I have to agree. I am a multi-repeat customer and would never pay MSRP+. Dealers charge MSRP+ to customers who don't plan ahead, or don't have dealer relationships.
Rapidly obsolescent, disposable tech commodities is so true! We flip our cars every two years, or so, just like a lot of other MB owners.
Rapidly obsolescent, disposable tech commodities is so true! We flip our cars every two years, or so, just like a lot of other MB owners.
Wow it must be great to be like you and WSH, you guys are part of the elite. I've never been lucky enough to get to pay MSRP, I'm more of a below invoice guy.
03-16-2008, 10:36 PM
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'08 Audi R8, '09 SL63, '10 GLK, '10 ML550
03-17-2008, 05:01 AM
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2013 650i Coupe, 2010 IS250 AWD, 1999 S500
M
03-17-2008, 07:33 AM
#33
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E 63S Wagon Renntech, E55 Renntech, SL65, SL 55 030, ML, bunch of old ones--they come, they go...
Until the factory gets involved,
there can't be 20% off. And they won't be involved for a good long while. In the R230 chain, those numbers came after the car had been in the system for nearly 5 years. You know the Germans, they refuse to believe any model is a tough sell (look how long it took to get trunk money on the R class!). Given the status of the world economy and the state of the car biz in general, it might be a bit sooner. Like about 3 months before the R230 is completely revamped.
For the folks who don't have to think twice about buying a $150k car, it really doesn't matter. They just want whatever is the newest, latest, greatest. For those of us who do have to think about it, we'll have to wait, hang around, and see what happens. I was dissapointed when I passed on the CLK63BS that I had coming, but knew it was the right thing to do. Feel a lot better about it today, and I'm sure I"m going to feel better about it in the next 90 days.
It's not that complicated. My dad used to say that peacocks want to strut, and will pay for the privilige. In the expensive car game, that comes at the beginning (big purchase price), and at the end (awful depreciation).
For the folks who don't have to think twice about buying a $150k car, it really doesn't matter. They just want whatever is the newest, latest, greatest. For those of us who do have to think about it, we'll have to wait, hang around, and see what happens. I was dissapointed when I passed on the CLK63BS that I had coming, but knew it was the right thing to do. Feel a lot better about it today, and I'm sure I"m going to feel better about it in the next 90 days.
It's not that complicated. My dad used to say that peacocks want to strut, and will pay for the privilige. In the expensive car game, that comes at the beginning (big purchase price), and at the end (awful depreciation).
03-17-2008, 11:25 AM
#34
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2011 Porsche Carrera GTS, 2009 BMW 750Li, 2011 Ferrari 458, 2011 SLS AMG, 2012 C63 AMG BS
We pay for what we want and live with it. Sometimes I pay below invoice (certain BMW's, Porsches, etc) and sometimes I pay MSRP. Its all a perception of value. I think most here would love to pay $10K over for an R8, n0w we know how strong it is. Who would have thought that for an Audi a year ago? Or how about paying $20K over for a 430? Or even $30K over for a 599?
Like someone here said, if you buy something that every customer can get today for $20K off now, its just worth $20K less when you sell it in a few years.
I lease all my cars, so I don't care if it drops to $0 in 2 or 3 years. Not my problem then.
Like someone here said, if you buy something that every customer can get today for $20K off now, its just worth $20K less when you sell it in a few years.
I lease all my cars, so I don't care if it drops to $0 in 2 or 3 years. Not my problem then.
03-17-2008, 11:45 AM
#35
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there can't be 20% off. And they won't be involved for a good long while. In the R230 chain, those numbers came after the car had been in the system for nearly 5 years. You know the Germans, they refuse to believe any model is a tough sell (look how long it took to get trunk money on the R class!). Given the status of the world economy and the state of the car biz in general, it might be a bit sooner. Like about 3 months before the R230 is completely revamped.
For the folks who don't have to think twice about buying a $150k car, it really doesn't matter. They just want whatever is the newest, latest, greatest. For those of us who do have to think about it, we'll have to wait, hang around, and see what happens. I was dissapointed when I passed on the CLK63BS that I had coming, but knew it was the right thing to do. Feel a lot better about it today, and I'm sure I"m going to feel better about it in the next 90 days.
It's not that complicated. My dad used to say that peacocks want to strut, and will pay for the privilige. In the expensive car game, that comes at the beginning (big purchase price), and at the end (awful depreciation).
For the folks who don't have to think twice about buying a $150k car, it really doesn't matter. They just want whatever is the newest, latest, greatest. For those of us who do have to think about it, we'll have to wait, hang around, and see what happens. I was dissapointed when I passed on the CLK63BS that I had coming, but knew it was the right thing to do. Feel a lot better about it today, and I'm sure I"m going to feel better about it in the next 90 days.
It's not that complicated. My dad used to say that peacocks want to strut, and will pay for the privilige. In the expensive car game, that comes at the beginning (big purchase price), and at the end (awful depreciation).
I am constantly reminded that life it to short to second guess every decision....
03-17-2008, 12:07 PM
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2002 S430, 2004 Cobra, 2004 Tahoe
No waitlist that I am aware of...if you want one, go ahead and put your order in the bank...not that you would, but do not pay over MSRP, there should be no reason for a dealer to mark a car over MSRP.
03-17-2008, 12:39 PM
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E 63S Wagon Renntech, E55 Renntech, SL65, SL 55 030, ML, bunch of old ones--they come, they go...
Schniznick, I'm not going to miss out....
I'll just be enjoying later. You're right though, if yout wnat some "thing", and you want it now, just pay. At this stage, I would like to pay MSRP and not worry about it, or what it will bring back 12 months from now. But, I"m not at that place right now.
Remember, most people will pull the trigger when they want the thing worse than the money.
Remember, most people will pull the trigger when they want the thing worse than the money.
