SLVRSL55

I've recently purchased the Powerchip ECU upgrade for my SL55 and am happy with the results. A moderately noticable difference, especially in low end torque, yet the car still drives smoothly: no jitters, no stalls, no startup problems. I'm interested in pushing the power envelope just a bit further without doing anything dramatic. I am wondering about people's experience with the EVO pulley upgrade kit. (I'm told the EVO package is designed to work specifically with the Powerchip ECU.) Is it a noticable difference beyond just reprogramming the ECU? I'm not sure I want to risk my warranty on just a few more horses, but if it's a significant increase... well, you know the story.

dinko

From the information I received the Powerchip ECU / Pulley's should give you roughly about 550hp / 570tq.

I've been VERY interested in doing this, but am too worried about doing anything to the car, or any other car since I've never done any engine mods before.

SLVRSL55

The Powerchip was a no brainer. Nothing invasive and undetectable by MBZ, or so says my service advisor. And if you decide you don't like it, you can always return the settings to factory specs. (If you decide within 10 days that you don't want it, Powerchip also refunds your money.) Also, if you make any further changes (exhaust, pulley kit, etc) they will update your programming to accomodate your new aftermarket additions at no charge.

dinko

Since I live in Orlando, do I take my car / chip into a shop around here somewhere? Or do I send it straight to a Powerchip? Another idea I don't like [from what I've heard] is having to send your chip to them, which takes 3 or more days; meaning I'll be without the car for as many days as I'm without the chip. Is this true?

Trimmer2

EVO/RennTech is in West Palm Beach. Spend a couple of hours on the road and get it done by Hartmut's gang personally.

dinko

I'm actually going to West Palm this weekend. I know that Renntech is down there, but their numbers are just too high for the Chip.

I looked at Evosport's website, but don't find any information on their location in Palm Beach. Are you certain they are down there?

Trimmer2

RennTech is EVOTech USA...

Trimmer2

...and if you're spending $XXX,XXX for a car, why skimp or go cheap for an aftermarket tuner?? Do it right the first time or just don't do it at all...and then you won't have to second guess yourself. Another words, don't be penny wise and pound foolish...why are the "others" cheaper...hmmm.

I'm off the S. Box now...

dinko

It doesn't make sense to me. $2k compared to $5k is a lot of money to you?

I'm sorry, but I don't just throw money around, and I've been a penny picker ever since I was born. Everyone is different, just looking for the best deal

OzSL55

Doing this style of bolt-on modification is seriously soft-core stuff. Remember, you are doing this on a car with a 'built' engine. Apart from the extreme cost differences of the vehicles, this is no difference to what the average Cobra owner is doing on mass across the US to easily and safely boost up their car's output significantly (100hp+ in a lot of cases). By comparison in my own case, these Kompresser upgrades a extremely mild compared to the full blower swap and 21# of boost being run on my cobra's stock but 'built' motor. It is even possible to get more boost out of the same Kompressor engine on the E55, but you can't on the SL due to a lack of room for the addition pulley size needed.

There is far less demand for euro performance parts out there than the domestic stuff, so naturally you are never going to get the same cheap added performance for your Benz or Beemer. That's thing about economies of scale and mass production. There's probably a little bit of 'they can afford it' thrown in too for that matter. I bought an '03 Cobra for a cheap way to get very high performance by comparison to anything european I own or have owned. You should see the amount of money I threw at my M3 in the 6 years I owned just eek 40 or 50hp extra out of it, what joke by comparison. $4-5K for 500 RWHP is a lot of extra HP for the dollar in a Merc. Just be thankful that you don't have to go to Brabus for their insanely expensive upgrades!

Go directly to Renntech for their pulley chip upgrade. You are lucky to have a competent Benz tuner like them in not that far away. I hope you are not comparing the $2K Powerchip software only scenario to the $4K Renntech custom chip and pulley option as you are talking two different packages. Either way I'd be going to a tuner who could supply a properly matched package of chip, pulley and air filters, plus be able to fit them for you.

Trimmer2

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I don't throw money around either. I chose to do the research and ALL arrows pointed to RennTech quite clearly. How much does an engine, transmission or diffential cost to replace? Under who's warranty? No warranty?

I have almost 14k miles on my year old SL600 with RennTech's upgrades and have had absolutely ZERO problems and I use mine as an everyday spirited driver. In fact, I'm almost on my 3rd set of tires (NO track time).

Another point is that my dealerhip is now selling RennTech upgraded, brand new, untitled cars right off their showroom floor...and this is one of the largest dealerships in the country.

Bottom line, don't be penny wise and pound foolish. I'd hate to see you throw your money around on a new engine!

dinko

I appreciate the feedback. Clearly, I didn't know how big RennTech really was until I started posting on this website. Stated was that RennTech's chip's are custom? So does that mean that Powerchip's are not? If warranty is a factor, I guess I can't go wrong with RennTech then.

Again, thanks for your feedback, I doubt I will do anything to the car just yet, but I'm sure I wont mind dropping by RennTech to check out the facility and all they offer.

P.S. What dealership are you with? I don't think my dealership is as lean on upgrades as yours is.

Trimmer2

Each Mercedes engine is individually mapped at the factory. RennTech takes your VIN, sends it to Germany and gets a custom ECU map for your engine by the company who writes the program for Mercedes engines and other car manufacturer's in Europe and US. RennTech is NOT an extreme tuner but, actually errs on the conservative side and prides themselves on reliability and stays within the car's performance envelope.

Hartmut, who owns RennTech, was head of AMG North America and was one of Mercedes head engineers in Germany before he started RennTech. His connections in Germany with Bosch and Siemans and knowledge of Mercedes engines, tuning and performance in my opinion cannot be matched by other aftermarket tuners. Most aftermarket companies are more into customizing the look of the car as opposed to performance.

RennTech's Web Site is also very informative www.renntechmercedes.com

OzSL55

Well said in all your comments Trimmer. I think you echo all that I've said and re-enforce it as an actual RennTech customer. What you said about your local and large Benz dealership selling and supporting RennTech equipped Mercs says it all to me. That's one heck of a strong vote of confidence in my book.

I know I would trust a German based ECU software tuning over a lot of other sources. The software I used in my BMWs was actually out of Wetterauer Chip Tuning in Germany via a local agent. RennTech may in fact use them or a similarly well experienced German software company.

IngenereAMG

I did a fair amount of research into the whole chip tuning thing when I wanted to mod my SL. The prices that Brabus and Renntech, et al. are charging is absolutely outrageous. We are talking about a software change...period! Whatever bull they are feeding you....this is pretty basic and uniform stuff.

I chose to go with speedtuning USA (www.speedtuningusa.com). It is an Austrian company that is just breaking into the US. Oliver is the proprieter....and is a great guy. He talked me through the process. I pulled the ECU on Mon...fedx it to him, and had it back in my car by Wed morning.

What I was looking for was the speed limiter removed...which they did....As a by-product I got another 40-50hp/40-50 lb ft of torque (or something like that). The car has been flawless, has topped out at 202/3 and embarrasses most everything at track days! And all for the grand total of $350...plus shipping. They are now offering a pulley upgrade for about $600 that'll give a bit more....but in reality.......does it really need more...........NO.

Have fun....be safe....and take a driver's school....that's probably the best auto performance investment you can make.

OzSL55

They must have cheap production method to be providing a pulley for $600. The setup I use is based on factory parts that are provided on an exchange basis and really bumps up the cost. With that said, the tuner who did the fitting for me commented that he could get his own pullies machined up to the same spec once he'd seen the kit. Personally, I do like the fact that the factory appear is retained, nothing for any Benz technician, especially the local 'genius' ones to look at.

dinko

That's where I get confused, but I'm with you. I read Renntech's profile online, and it sold me right away. I was ready to call them and make an appointment for this weekend. But when you have a chip for $350 just for a tune, that makes me think twice.

Thanks Ingenere! I'll look into the company you mentioned above when I'm ready to make the move.

IngenereAMG

The actual production costs for this stuff is pretty cheap. I have had custom machined specialty parts made for my Indycar for not that much money. The pulley is pretty basic stuff. I haven't felt the need to buy one so I haven't seen their work, but if it is as good as their ECU work...it'll be great!

OzSL55

Dinko, you are still talking two different levels of service. The speedtuning USA guys might be good, but they aren't available for you to take your car to and work on it in person unless you're going to drive to MD. Also, they're putting the onus on you to pull the ECU out and disable your car for however many days it takes. Your are then also on your own once the chip is done, no one's there to check how your car has responded to the new tune and double check everything's running right. If it wasn't a $100,000 car, I'd probably say yeah what hell, throw the chip in and be done with it too... Then there's the aspect if you go with the pulley option too, what are you going to do jack it up in your garage and change it over yourself?

In the end it's your car and it's up to you dude....

OzSL55

That does depend on where in the world you're situated too though. There's plenty of shops that can machine stuff up for you in the US cheaply However, if you compare that to down here in Oz, we are not so fortunate and there are far less shops available, so it's not going to be anywhere near as cheap. I can buy a lower pulley for my Lightning for $US215 retail, however if I tried to get same part copied here I'd be up for a lot more.

dinko

True. Blah.. I don't plan on doing this any time soon, but we'll see. Maybe after Christmas I'll get a couple days off and take the beast to West Palm.

Thanks for everyone's input, I believe I'm going to stick with RennTech for the upgrade.

IngenereAMG

The process to take out the ECU is sooooo simple...it is almost rediculous! It takes about 5 minutes...and Oliver (owner of Supertuning) will talk you through it on the phone. You pretty much CAN'T screw it up. The turn around time was extremely fast...took it out on Mon...had it back in the car on Wed morning.

With modern cars (like the SL55)...there really is no chip exchange...they 'flash' your ECU with the updated information and away you go. When I did my 348 Ferrari years ago, Superchips sent me chips and instructions. There were 2 ECU's on that car....the first one took me 2 hours to do as I was a liitle scared and the second took 20 minutes!! The Merc job is virtually idiot proof. But I guess if you can barely find the gas tank it might be a tough job.....However, if you can figure out where the engine cover release is....you are halfway home.

I know that my car feels faster....and best of all the speedlimiter is gone....and all undetactable by MB!....that was worth $350...........but it wasn't worth $2-5K. But I guess if you can't find the engine cover release and use a screw driver and a fedx box it's best to pay the big bucks. I stuck the extra money that I saved into some AMG 19" (SL65 wheels) and some tires that can handle 200mph.

I still think that the best place you can spend your performance dollar is at a performance driving school and some track days....after all what good is 500+hp if you can't handle it....unless you are like PRChris and want the fastest car in the valet lot. I just prefer to goooo! Have fun!

dinko

This crap doesn't stop. Ingenere, I'm on your side once again. I am so oblivious to this situation, and it does feel rediculous to change minds back and forth from Renntech's $5k upgrade to a simple $350 upgrade. True to the fact you could buy 65 wheels, I think that statement just sold me to stay away from high priced tuners, such as Renntech.

I'll stay away from this thread, and when I make adjustments to the car, I'll let you all know. Thanks!

PS, Ingenere who could I say referred me?

RU_MATRX

Dinko:

I have SpeedtuningUSA's ECU re-flash and have made numerous positive comments based on my own experience and research (also see Power/performance section on ECUs). It's just a firmware-type reflash and for a STOCK SL55 AMG, there's not much to optimizing the fuel/air mix, shift points relative to stock gearing, timing advance/retard @ a given RPM, etc. I've seen several articles on how a "tuner" like Vishnu of Vishnu performance started with one of the first ECU flashes on the new Evo VIII. You can see and manage the entire ECU map optimization from the laptop and see exactly how they "optimize." There's practically no room for error and variation on proper ECU remaps on a STOCK setup. Trust me, it's well worth it and like IngenereAMG stated, you can go buy a set of Authentic 19" AMG Type IV wheels/tires with MB lowering links for the price difference going Renntech. I've been a bit slow on the 19" AMGs/links but should have them done before the end of this year. How's this price sound? $3800 for the 19" Type IVs with any tires I want (trade-in of my perfect, stock Type III 18" AMGs/tires with only 2500 miles) balanced, mounted, and installed. $600 for the MB lowering links installed. No tax, paying cash and will purchase them from one reputable high-profile shop in Southern, CA. which has done work on my other vehicle. I like negotiating the deals and getting true value for my money as much as completing the projects.

There will always be comments about dyno results and such, but I chose the ECU upgrade more for better driveability at all RPMs, idle quality and revvability, VMAX removal as much as the increase in power/tq. I'm sure Oliver can obtain detailed dyno charts from the HQ in Austria.

Also, I briefly spoke with Oliver last week on the Kompressor overdrive pulley set. They may end up to be significantly more expensive than $600 (initial target price) though it's just CNC machined pieces. Once a set is created, replication is easy for any competent performance machine shop. I'm going to check with Oliver again tomorrow as he mentioned that his negotiations with a supplier from Germany has made considerable progress. They will have dyno charts available on the combination pulley set/ECU as well.

Btw, the process of removing/re-installing your ECU is simple and idiot-proof. The turn-around time is standard as well. You'll have your ECU insured and back to you 2 days after you send it away. I've done this several times including an Upsolute upgrade on my previous 2002 996TT. There shouldn't be
a significant difference in cost for an ECU upgrade between a $140000 European vehicle vs. say, a VW Beetle. Same process, same "R&D," just different marketing and consumer financial expectations.

Great Luck and have fun with the easy mods!

OzSL55

Yeah the ECU removal is incredibly simple, I've taken out all my cars ECU's no big deal at all, 2 min job on the SL. What I was referring to in my post was that you are disabling your car while the ECU goes interstate for at least a couple of days and then one you put it back in you've got no one there beside your own good self to be sure the car has responded correctly to the new software.
Also, we are still talking 2 distinct types of tuning when you start to talk 'reflash' jobs. Mine is a full chip replacement not a reflash. My understanding is that you cannot reprogram all of the desired variables simply through a reflash. It's also why it so mucher cheaper for a reflash, no circuit board work needed at all. I used to use a Powerchip reflash in my M3 which to be honest was complete garbage, made stuff all difference to the car. On the other hand when I had the full custom ECU work done the car started to feel significantly stronger.

I'm going to be speaking to my tuning guy in the next week or so I'm sure I'll have some more to add about reflash vs. chip replacement...

With costs, I know if I had to make back what the programming costs, it's going to a lot easier on a mass produced car with lots of people wanting a chip or 'reflash'. I see cost recovery as a big part of why the more expensive marques cost more to chip than Vdubs.