maxwerks

Popping the grill covers on the front and rear door speakers, I see the following, 6.5" Coaxial drivers in the front doors ( shocking if you ask me!!) , and what looks like a recessed 4.5" Mids in the rear doors ( No tweeters in the rear at all !!). Please feel free to correct me if you know more . So, there are no drivers in the dash, or the sail panel behind the mirrors in the front doors ( I am assuming as I have not removed these panels yet ) . If so, then I think it is a disgrace of an audio system! My Infiniti FX35 has much better STOCK drivers, than what comes in an AMG ?? Not to mention any Lexus out there.... I have always known MB audio to be compromised and this is no surprise! I plan a complete change of the Audio/ Nav system & I would appreciate any info from members who overhauled the entire system, .... yes i know about the Bose amps tuned to the drivers, and I plan to change everything. In Home audiophile circuits, BOSE is a joke, and while the Harmon Kardon system in my 08 E350 is MUCH better sounding then my E55, it is still doesnt compare to what comes in a new Lexus.

Waynec1980

Well in my E55 i cannot find a hint of a Bose amp and the speakers show no Bose trademark on them. Also there are 2 empty holes in the rear shelf. I dont think mine has a Bose system!!

maxwerks

I may be mistaken but I think starting the year 2000 they upgraded to a Bose system, ( Bose amps, and I think speakers ) , maybe the basic head unit was still made by Becker.

Waynec1980

Damn

I am gonna do a mean install anyway nothing stupid and too loud but all high quality equipment.
Watch this space!!

E55 KEV

I believe all US W210 used Bose speakers from 1995.

maxwerks

THats great Waynec...lets keep in touch...this is my plan of attack:

- AMP: A/D/S 850MX 8 channels ( It is 8X50 but for those of you who know these are some the best 50W ever made!) , with 4G power wire, and 4 or 8G Ground , going directly to the battery under the seat, ( short run ).
- Fronts: A/D/S PX series tweeters, and 346is drivers all with true biamping
( 4 channels) , drivers are in stock locations, and tweeters possibly under the dash grills ??
- Rear doors: Orion HCCA 5" drivers in the stock locations ( I can use coax drivers but the HCCA are that much better , and another pair of A/D/S PX Tweeters . I have to find a location for the tweeters ?? OR not use the tweeters at all in the rear and run the 5" Orions to the top of their range ( I bet their top end range is so much higher and cleaner than stock speakers) .
- Rear shelve : Two high quality 6.5 Bass drivers ( I dont want the thump the car, it is SQ I am after not SPL. I havent decided on the drivers yet, but they will be crossed over at a very low HZ, probably low passed at 130HZ. This way I keep the stock locations, no mods to any panels only mounting the ADS amp in the trunk.

I bought all the A/D/S stuff years ago and they have been stored ! With these drivers it will be a shame to use the stock speaker wires, so unfortunately I have to run new wires everywhere and remove all door panels PITA!!!

Any ideas, suggestions are welcomed and appreciated. I already have all the equipment, except for the bass drivers.

Cheers , Max

Dan_Audio Man

Max..sounds good. I do not know which 6.5'' speakers you are going to get for the rear deck, but if you're after SQ, I'd cut them off at a higher freq. like about 200Hz or so. By giving you a greater low end range, it raises the overall "realness" of the music.

Other than that, you may use good name coaxials where you have cutouts for them already. I was never a fan of the component set ups, but in your case you already have the speakers.

Tacjam

For your info,

You'll have two speakers in the dash...they are only used for the factory phone. My plan upfront is a 3 way MB quartz system....tweeters behind mirror, midrange in dash and low range in door....coaxial in the rear doors...nothing on the back panel...with a 10W7 in back. I already changed my head unit to an Alpine IVA-W205



Jim

maxwerks

Thank you audioman!! always happy to discuss audio with Audioman !!
You are right , there is nothing better than the " Right " Coaxes, but I havent found any coax drivers in the league of the ADS PX series. I havent decided on the rear drivers yet, but I will experiment with crossing them higher via the variable low pass module on the amp and see. Regards, Max

maxwerks

Dash speakers: popped the grills on either side of the dash, there are what looks like a 3.5 paper cone speakers ( CHEAP) , although wired, there no sound from them, so unless mine are disconnected somewhere else or busted, I would assume they are meant for other W210 models , and been shut down in the E55 model. I think mine are busted because I do remember somewhere, our audio system is called 8 speakers Bose, which would add up!

For good sound one doesnt need eight speakers, actually the more you have the worse the sound is in reality , too may reflections and impossible to get a decent soundstage...

Rear shelf : 2X6.5 bass drivers, but looking upward from inside the trunk, you can see extra 6.5" round holes precut into the steel, Great, looks like I will abandon the rear doors speakers all together and use the additional rear shelf holes for the rear speakers right next to bass drivers....remaining issue....location of rear tweeters! More to come.

I will plan to document all of this in pictures during the installation, hopefully that would help interested members. Cheers!

maxwerks

Jim , great to have you on board this...you just clarified why my dash speakers arent working...I am assuming that that there is nothing now behind the mirrors right? ( Those are the only panels I havent popped yet) . Your front set up is perfect, although you would have to be real careful crossing over the Mid from the Dash to the Midbass in the doors, to blend it right, since the three way MB Quart set up crosses over the Midbass at a relatively high point. What do you think about abandoning the rear doors completely and using the precut hole next to the rear shelf subs? It is two less doors panels to be removed.

Tacjam

I dunno, the back is only for rear fill, the shelf speakers are 6 1/2 speakers...while the door speakers are only 4" speakers. I'll have to see what MB Quartz has in that range. Your correct that nothing is behind the mirror. The front Bose speakers in the doors are coaxial. I'm picking up my JL audio 300/4 on saturday, it's stable to 1.5 ohms. I know I'm going to change all the speakers but before I change out all the bose speakers I'm going to hook them up to the JL audio amp which is hooked to my Alpine head unit (all the wiring is in the trunk already) You really don't need rear tweeters...a quality set of coaxial speakers will do the trick for rear fill.

Waynec1980

Hey Maxwerks,

What is the performance of the standard bass drivers like as I dont actualy have them. Also is it possible you could post a photo of them (or someone else) as I am just curious what they look like.

Thanks

By the way I wont be starting my project for a few weeks yet but am just starting to do the research.

Wayne

maxwerks

Jim,

By the way, do you happen to know where the speakers wires are routed exactly? I havent removed any carpeting yet... and are you changing your wires or using whats there?

You are right about the rear speakers, they are fill in and one can probably d well without a tweeter at all. I happen to think that using the rear deck instead of the doors would sound better even for rear fill , I am suggesting 6.5 rears 1st because I already have a lot of drivers I bought before and second, maybe using a 6.5 will take care of a good chunk of the midbass hopefully finding the right 6.5 bass driver to handle only the low range ( I havent found the right driver yet,I wish I had 8 or 10" to deal with, 6.5 is small) . Another option is to have reduced rings in MDF, and mount a 4 or 5" full range driver in the 6" existing hole next to the subs...just a thought. at any rate, I know you are on the right track also...cheers.
Max

Tacjam

The wiring runs to your amp in the trunk on the left side. I suspect the wire routing is under your sill, you'll have input and output at the amp. (head unit/to speakers) I'll first use the factory wiring with the bose speakers, then when I install my new speaker's I'll run new heavier gauge speaker wiring. Using speakers in the rear doors will give me a reason to take off the door pannels...hence install sound deadening material. Unless I cut something in the rear deck I honestly think my JL audio 10w7 will distort anything I put in the rear deck....let me tell you, that thing hits like no other! What I do need to do is something about the head liner, when my sub hits...the only rattle I have in the car is my headliner...which rattles and makes some seriously bad noises. I might just pull the back half down, then use some type of sealant to seal the headliner to those tracks that cause the headliner noise. MB did a VERY poor job securing the headliner to the car....you can read all the complaints about headliner rattle...I just compounded that with my sub, 10w7 is overkill (I found that out, but got a good deal on a used set of them) When I had both hooked up in the trunk...my quarter pannel would flex when the base hit, so I disconnected one, I just got a ported enclosure for the 1 now, my plan was to fiberglass one into the cubby where the cd changer was (this cubby is bigger and you can use a little trunk space as the spare sits to the right) Now I dunno if I can make a strong enough encloser to keep those things from flexing. If you can get the steering wheel controller, the Alpine IVA-W205 is awesome...the new 505 is coming out so I expect the prices for the 205 to dip into the $5XX range.

maxwerks

I hope these pics help someone who is looking into upgrading the speakers, more to come, as my project moves.
1- Pop grill on the driver door to expose the 6.5 Coax driver.
2- Remove fuse cover on dash side .
3- Remove screw as shown ( attaching the dash speakers grill)
4- Pop grill.
5- Dash speakers ( 3.5" ?? Only connected to phone, Thanks Jim)
6- Looking from the trunk onto the underside of the shlef, showing the 6" Sub and the extra 6" opening in the steel adjacent to it.

maxwerks

6" Bose Sub on both sides of the rear shelf / deck.

JamE55

Max,

Did you upgrade the Bose 6" subs? If so what did you upgrade them with?

maxwerks

JamE55,
Of course getting a larger Sub would be better, but I dont want to loose any space in the trunk, nor build a box there, nor cut the rear deck, so I think this is what I am going with:

http://www.edesignaudio.com/product_...products_id=33

I have done a lot of research, it is not easy finding a good bass driver in that size. I am also not after getting the car thumping, loud bass is one thing and good clean bass in another ( LOL ) I hooked it up outside the car, and it sounds great even in open air, ( dont let the price fool you, it is actually a great driver) I know it is going to need an MDF ring or two so that it will fit through the existing hole without cutting but that should be easy. Also one can cover the steel deck with Dynamat then put the spacer rings for a true upgrade.

JamE55

Do you need to do any modifications when you add that sub or is it pretty much plug and play? I'm asking because that sub looks like it has more than twice the power of the stock bose.

maxwerks

I am not sure how much power can the stock Bose driver can handle, but I know as all bose systems, it is selected to be in sync with the Bose amplifer driving it. If you are asking what would the ED driver be like being driven by the stock Bose amp, I am not really sure but I wouldnt recommend that. I think two new drivers being driven by their dedicated amp or dedicated channels will always sound better. Just always remember, what power drivers can handle has nothing to do with what that power sound like, it is first and foremost dependant on the amp supplying that power, how clean, how stable into lower impedance, how high the current and so forth. A whole lot of amps out there are better than any amp Bose would supply as part of a kit. Thats my opinion. Cheers, Max

JamE55

Got it. Thanks for the clarification.

maxwerks

No problem JamE55, I am redoing everything audio in my car, so if there is anything I can help with dont hesitate to ask me, or if you want me to try something while I have everything dismantled I will be glad to.
Max

JamE55

Will do. Thanks again!

woowmen

Thank you for sharing I am happy to be here. Thanks admin