Schweinhund

I agree with you on backwards compatibility in general but this is what I think you should at least be aware of:

"Get the codes reas, probably will not be major-major, please remeber on any tranny service with your cars mileage use MB 722.6 fluid ONLY do not use newer MB 722.9 tranny fluid - the supposed backwards capatible spec for the new fluid is BOGUS for your tranny."

From:

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w210...ml#post4577034

and from a very knowledgeable board member on BW,

My view is based on the experience of indies both in AR and CA, each who has over 20 yrs expereince and service quite a extended stable in their respective areas.

Now that MB dealers has stopped carrying 23-10, there are actually (2) questions:

1) what happens when mix the new 722.9 (MB 98-10) fluid with the old 722.6 (MB 23-10) fluid ?
This is a valid question when the tranny service is a pan-pull-fluid change, for models without a torque converter drain plug will leave 50%-55% of the old fluid still in the tranny.

Answer - As "backwards compatible" the MB approval for the 722.9 (98-10) fluid means its compatible for that 722.6 tranny. There is notrhing from MB that says the 722.9 is compatible to mix with the 722.6 fluid, nowhere do they say the fluids can be mixed.
Both my indies report that they have seen premature transmission failure on tranny's that got this "old/new" mix from MB dealer pan-pull-tranny service.


2) Is the new fluid 722.9 (MB 68-10) fluid as good as the original 722.6 (MB 23-10) ?

Answer - Possibly not. From my side both of my indies, as well as several experienced members of the forum have exeprienced harsher shifting (G-AMG, ohlord), although there are same or more who have rep[orted no problem.
Both my indies will not use 722.9 (68-10) in 722.6 trannies with over 80K miles, period.

As you did nearly a full replacement, you will probably be fine. I did a 722.14 change with eight quarts last year and seem to be OK (but I have only gone 8,000 miles since then).

dfreret

https://mbworld.org/forums/clk-class...722-6-atf.html

Glyn Ruck is very well versed with this topic across many threads. Says it is okay to mix the old and new fluids.

By backwards compatible, I believe it is implied by MB that it is safe to mix. If it were not, then I believe a directive would have been issued to flush out all old remaining 236.10/.12 fluid and replace with 236.14.

Saying old/new fluid mixed is what caused full transmission failure can be bit of a reach. There are too many other unknown factors.

Food for thought.....If 236.10 fluid is superior to .14, why is it not produced any more ?? Even the likes of G-AMG have (recently) changed their tune and moved onto the .14 spec fluid.

desired_speeds

722.6 fluid is just dextron 3. It's not even synthetic. ATF 134 (for 722.9) is synthetic and is safe to use, mix, or whatever with the 722.6 fluid. Honestly, you can go to your local auto parts store and buy a few bottles of valvoline +4 ATF for chrysler vehicles and it'll be fine to use.

saintz

The Shell ATF I linked is approved by MB and safe to use. It is actually recommended in Sprinter trucks, which are Mercedes built. I am **** about oil, and I use this, Fuchs, and OEM. They are all approved. You may see slightly stiffer shifting, due to friction modifier differences in the 722.6 vs. 722.9 oil, but it should not be harmful.

You can topside extract if you want to get roughly half the fluid out. A pan drop will get a little more out, but still about half. You can repeat the flush process several times to get most of it out, or disconnect the cooling line and actually flush it, but that takes a lot more work.

Schweinhund

I would love to know if anyone has actually disconnected the return line and pumped out the fluid using a running transmission. I've done this before on other cars and it uses about twice the capacity in new oil, but it gets it all out, including the torque converter.

saintz

That will work. You just need about 6 hands or some careful planning to keep it sucking new fluid and spitting old.

dfreret

I did this exact method. Picture shows return line on 1999 E55. I think actually slightly different on 2000-2002 models, but easily identifiable.

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/3530240-post53.html

Pan and Filter drop. Filled car up with 4 Liters.
Disconnect the return AT line.
Need 2nd person to start/stop car.
Pump out 2 Liters with car running for about 10-15 seconds while going through gears.
Put in 2 new liters of ATF.
Repeat 3 more times. (total 12 L needed)

Last pump out was nice red fluid. Worked like a charm.

EDIT: Watched the entire video. I don't think you would be able to fill the E55 with new ATF as fast as the trans line pumps out old ATF.

Schweinhund

Thanks! Your engine is very clean, looks nearly brand new. That is truly a great way to get all the old oil out. Good to know. 12 liters should do it.

One question, did you let the discharge sputter out or were you limited in some other way to two liters in between start/stop/refill?

Neanicu888

I wonder....can you suck out the fluid from the torque converter thru the transmission filler hole,using a marine oil pump? This is how even some dealers change the engine oil.
I don't know if it works,but if it does,to me that would be the easiest method.
I'm lucky,my '99 E55 has a torque converter drain plug.

Schweinhund

No.

dfreret

You do not want to sputter as that means you might not have enough fluid in the transmission. I just chose to do 2 L at a time since that's what others have done in the past. (Total 12 L)

MB recommends flushing 3 L out at a time.(MB procedure requires 14 L of fluid as noted in the PDF.)

This post refers to the WIS procedure for flushing 722.6xx transmissions. (I also uploaded the PDF here for your reference.)
http://www.benzworld.org/forums/4779994-post121.html

saintz

The filler hole goes into the pan, not the torque converter.

The easy way is to drain using a topsider from the filler tube, (if you need to change the filter, drop the pan and do it now, then reattach), refill, run the car around the block, drain again from the filler tube, and refill again. This will get 75% of the fluid out, roughly. I've never had a problem with this method.

The drain line method being discussed will be more thorough, but also more complicated and use more fluid potentially.

Neanicu888

If the filler goes into the pan,how come in my case(my car has a torque coverter drain plug),after draining all the fluid from the pan and torque converter,I just refilled everything through the filler tube...all 9 quarts? The pan only holds about 3 quarts. Where did all the rest of 6 quarts go?

RobertG

The transmission pump pumps it into the torque converter and all other internal cavties.

Schweinhund

I would guess between the pan and the torque converter, you are getting most of the total capacity. The valve body and cooler probably wouldn't hold more than a quart/liter.