Header Question - Is it worth it??
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 209
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From: San Diego, Cali
AMG 2002 E55, 1997 E320
Header Question - Is it worth it??
I am thinking about putting on AMS Style Shorty Headers without doing a Cat Delete or Res Delete / X Pipe install.
I may also do a ECU Tune, but that is about it. The headers will run $600.00 and I will do the install myself.
I know a few of you have these headers - would like to hear your thoughts if this is worth the money and time.
I am in California and do not want to deal with any smog check issues.
Thanks for your input
I may also do a ECU Tune, but that is about it. The headers will run $600.00 and I will do the install myself.
I know a few of you have these headers - would like to hear your thoughts if this is worth the money and time.
I am in California and do not want to deal with any smog check issues.
Thanks for your input
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 66
Likes: 0
From: Sumwhere in TEXAS
2005 E55 AMG....Speed is Relaxin'
I hv a pair of EVO ceramic coated shorties
w gaskets, exhaust bolts. All still in box
I'll sell ya. Won't effect CEL or emissions.
I'm going to LT headers instead.
w gaskets, exhaust bolts. All still in box
I'll sell ya. Won't effect CEL or emissions.
I'm going to LT headers instead.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,411
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From: Socal, Chino
E55 2006 / CLS55 / S450 / Jag XKR2011
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,411
Likes: 69
From: Socal, Chino
E55 2006 / CLS55 / S450 / Jag XKR2011
I am thinking about putting on AMS Style Shorty Headers without doing a Cat Delete or Res Delete / X Pipe install.
I may also do a ECU Tune, but that is about it. The headers will run $600.00 and I will do the install myself.
I know a few of you have these headers - would like to hear your thoughts if this is worth the money and time.
I am in California and do not want to deal with any smog check issues.
Thanks for your input
I may also do a ECU Tune, but that is about it. The headers will run $600.00 and I will do the install myself.
I know a few of you have these headers - would like to hear your thoughts if this is worth the money and time.
I am in California and do not want to deal with any smog check issues.
Thanks for your input
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 209
Likes: 8
From: San Diego, Cali
AMG 2002 E55, 1997 E320
If you add AMS shortie header + ECU tune for NA55 will bring you approx 40Hp top. I don't think its bad idea. your car might run 400hp 420torque with about $1200 cost. However, California is very annal about smog...... i got into trouble when i was getting my smog check few months ago but all work out. If you know the technician is OK since they have to do a visual inspection.
What do you think the breakdown is ?
How much from from the header mod and how much from the tune?
Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 90
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From: Huntington Beach, CA
2002 E55 040 2000 E320 Wagon 199 2004 Ford F550
I made the choice to go with the AMS headers, delete the resonator/add X-pipe and add the Renntech airbox. Acceleration is very smooth and the exhaust "grumble" minimal. Seriously, the car pulls hard now!
Don't worry yourself about the HP gains. Take pleasure in knowing that with the mods, you will be a little louder and a little faster than a stock E55.
Don't worry yourself about the HP gains. Take pleasure in knowing that with the mods, you will be a little louder and a little faster than a stock E55.
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 998
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From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
i can tell you that it's well worth doing the shortie headers and a tune. I think you can get away with the resonator delete and a x-pipe in place. You will still have all your 4 cats. Currently, i have not delete any of my cats and i can feel the power, especially the top end. It is the best thing to do for the NA E55. Of course if you want to smooth out the powerjband i would install a Renntech airbox. If not, i will replace the air filter with some K&N.
i took it to the indie mercedes guy to put my headers in but after taking out the wires and plugs myself, I notice how easily access you get to the headers. If I were to do it again, I will definately do it myself. That will save at minimun $400.
if you want, throw in the lighter pulley after that.....
i took it to the indie mercedes guy to put my headers in but after taking out the wires and plugs myself, I notice how easily access you get to the headers. If I were to do it again, I will definately do it myself. That will save at minimun $400.
if you want, throw in the lighter pulley after that.....
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Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 209
Likes: 8
From: San Diego, Cali
AMG 2002 E55, 1997 E320
i can tell you that it's well worth doing the shortie headers and a tune. I think you can get away with the resonator delete and a x-pipe in place. You will still have all your 4 cats. Currently, i have not delete any of my cats and i can feel the power, especially the top end. It is the best thing to do for the NA E55. Of course if you want to smooth out the powerjband i would install a Renntech airbox. If not, i will replace the air filter with some K&N.
i took it to the indie mercedes guy to put my headers in but after taking out the wires and plugs myself, I notice how easily access you get to the headers. If I were to do it again, I will definately do it myself. That will save at minimun $400.
if you want, throw in the lighter pulley after that.....
i took it to the indie mercedes guy to put my headers in but after taking out the wires and plugs myself, I notice how easily access you get to the headers. If I were to do it again, I will definately do it myself. That will save at minimun $400.
if you want, throw in the lighter pulley after that.....
Along with an ECU tune I am on the lookout for Renntech Airbox.
Thanks for your confirmation that doing the headers would be fairly easy once you get the coils, plugs and plug wires out of the way. I changed my plugs and wires last year, and planned on removing everything again to do the headers.
Anything I should know, do or have ready when I replace my exhaust manifold with the new headers?
I am not clear on the gains you get with replacing the pully.
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Super Member
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 998
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From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
As far as the pulley goes, it does help the higher rpm....it spin faster as it is lighter....
Last edited by snooozie; Jun 8, 2012 at 03:15 PM.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 209
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From: San Diego, Cali
AMG 2002 E55, 1997 E320
When you get the headers.....make sure the flange is flat and smooth. Use a metal set rule and run it thru to see both are totally flat and smooth. With the one piece flange, you can tell at once it is not even. If it is not even, I would sand it down and smooth them out with a belt sander. I smooth out mine at one of the performance shop here locally....a machine shop should have a wide belt sander. That will prevent any leakage down the road and the gasket will fit nice and tight.
As far as the pulley goes, it does help the higher rpm....it spin faster as it is lighter....
As far as the pulley goes, it does help the higher rpm....it spin faster as it is lighter....
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 998
Likes: 4
From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
The flat side on the headers where you put the gaskets and it matches up with the exhaust on the engine block.
Super Member
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 998
Likes: 4
From: Central Connecticut
86 190D (Exported to the Nerderlands), 87 300TD (Sold), 82 Ford F150 3spd, 99 E300D (RIP), 02 E55
Just the flanges on the new headers. Don't do anything to the engine block. Be careful not to touch the engine block side too much as dirt and grimme might hinder them from having a tight seal with your new headers.
Super Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 553
Likes: 3
From: Los Angeles
W210 E55
Until I see dyno runs on a stock car, before and after, I don't know what to think. I do know that a good 100HP nitrous system is totally safe and gives you an extra 100HP when you want it, and would cost in the ball park of a header install.
I am thinking of going this order:
1. Limited slip diff
2. 150 hp nitrous
3. header/ hi-flow cats
I am thinking of going this order:
1. Limited slip diff
2. 150 hp nitrous
3. header/ hi-flow cats
Last edited by Schweinhund; Jun 10, 2012 at 10:02 AM.
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 33
Likes: 1
From: CA FL
E63
On my 210 E55 I got Kleemann header and dwn pipes, primary cats and resonator delete and Kleemann tune and I made about 20WHP on the dyno. Sure not worth the money for 20 WHP.
Super Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 553
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From: Los Angeles
W210 E55
Was that average over the RPM range or peak? If peak, what was the band more or less?
Senior Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 289
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From: Woodland Hills, CA
1999 e55 (past), 2002 CLK55 (past), 2004 E55 (present), 2008 Z06
To the original poster, you should try to find a dyno sheet or ask one of the members here advocating you can obtain 40 hp from headers and a tune to show you one. I've gone back and forth about it for years. My understanding is the AMS headers yield 5 to 10 peak hp max and the Kleeman's, which also require you to cut our your primary cats, 20-22.
I've yet to see a dyno sheet combining either with a performance tune.
IMO $1200 + for 10 to 20, hp, is not worth it
Good luck.
I've yet to see a dyno sheet combining either with a performance tune.
IMO $1200 + for 10 to 20, hp, is not worth it
Good luck.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 209
Likes: 8
From: San Diego, Cali
AMG 2002 E55, 1997 E320
To the original poster, you should try to find a dyno sheet or ask one of the members here advocating you can obtain 40 hp from headers and a tune to show you one. I've gone back and forth about it for years. My understanding is the AMS headers yield 5 to 10 peak hp max and the Kleeman's, which also require you to cut our your primary cats, 20-22.
I've yet to see a dyno sheet combining either with a performance tune.
IMO $1200 + for 10 to 20, hp, is not worth it
Good luck.
I've yet to see a dyno sheet combining either with a performance tune.
IMO $1200 + for 10 to 20, hp, is not worth it
Good luck.
This is more in line what I thought these mods would deliver as far as additional horsepower and torque + 10 to 20 lbs - was hoping to get to the 10 lbs per 1 horsepower threshold - maybe 2/10th 0 to 60 better than stock.
Still haven't decided - will most likely do headers (cannot get over that restrictive stock manifold) and see if I can feel a difference - then move onto a possible tune - and be happy with a faster than stock E55 W 210
Which would be a better performance upgrade for the money - a Renntech Airbox or AMS style shorty headers?
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,856
Likes: 7
From: Socal
07E63, 12E350, 08997TT, 16SiennaSE
This is more in line what I thought these mods would deliver as far as additional horsepower and torque + 10 to 20 lbs - was hoping to get to the 10 lbs per 1 horsepower threshold - maybe 2/10th 0 to 60 better than stock.
Still haven't decided - will most likely do headers (cannot get over that restrictive stock manifold) and see if I can feel a difference - then move onto a possible tune - and be happy with a faster than stock E55 W 210
Which would be a better performance upgrade for the money - a Renntech Airbox or AMS style shorty headers?
Still haven't decided - will most likely do headers (cannot get over that restrictive stock manifold) and see if I can feel a difference - then move onto a possible tune - and be happy with a faster than stock E55 W 210
Which would be a better performance upgrade for the money - a Renntech Airbox or AMS style shorty headers?
Kleemann SC, smaller SC pulley, ECU, headers, dwn pipes, primary cats and resonator delete. You deceide.
Dynojet Baseline 302whp/311Tq. (pretty health car)
POST
348whp/349wtq (same dynojet)
362.4whp/434.2 tq (Mustang dyno)
367whp/ 400tq (different dyno jet)
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 209
Likes: 8
From: San Diego, Cali
AMG 2002 E55, 1997 E320
If I tell you how much HP my E55 make for $18K+ in engine mod you would cry.
Kleemann SC, smaller SC pulley, ECU, headers, dwn pipes, primary cats and resonator delete. You deceide.
Dynojet Baseline 302whp/311Tq. (pretty health car)
POST
348whp/349wtq (same dynojet)
362.4whp/434.2 tq (Mustang dyno)
367whp/ 400tq (different dyno jet)
Kleemann SC, smaller SC pulley, ECU, headers, dwn pipes, primary cats and resonator delete. You deceide.
Dynojet Baseline 302whp/311Tq. (pretty health car)
POST
348whp/349wtq (same dynojet)
362.4whp/434.2 tq (Mustang dyno)
367whp/ 400tq (different dyno jet)
The numbers you hear for engine mods are all over the place - based on your numbers I would be lucky to see 5 extra horsepower for my headers
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,856
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From: Socal
07E63, 12E350, 08997TT, 16SiennaSE
Thank you for the hard numbers - before you did these mods, what were your expectations for horsepower gains? Did these mods transform the car to your expectations? Knowing what you know now, would you still have done them, or what would you have done differently?
The numbers you hear for engine mods are all over the place - based on your numbers I would be lucky to see 5 extra horsepower for my headers
The numbers you hear for engine mods are all over the place - based on your numbers I would be lucky to see 5 extra horsepower for my headers
If I knew I wouldn't have done it i would buy a W211 E55/E63
Member
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 84
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From: Las Vegas Nevada
2005 c55 AMG, 2006 Kleemann E50 K, 1997 Acura-CL Custom
Kleemann Questions Answered
I have a 2006 Fully Kleemannized e500 sport...all the goodies..white gauges, IPOD controls
The whp is closer to 400 than 485 (according to Kleemanns specs)
I have the Kleemann Supercharger and radiator, ECU, Headers, Big (HUGE)Brakes, Lowering Module. Renntech Catless Exhaust with X pipe . (yes it passes smog) AMG rims etc.
The Car pulls well with ESP off and in sport thru til about 130 then levels off at 155 due to the limiter.
I can tune the 5.0 to about 430 whp with some tweaking. BTW leave Nitrous and Mercedes out of the same sentence. The damage you can do isnt worth the 5-second rush.
The Headers and exhaust definitely make a difference and if tuned right will be well worth the investment.
The whp is closer to 400 than 485 (according to Kleemanns specs)
I have the Kleemann Supercharger and radiator, ECU, Headers, Big (HUGE)Brakes, Lowering Module. Renntech Catless Exhaust with X pipe . (yes it passes smog) AMG rims etc.
The Car pulls well with ESP off and in sport thru til about 130 then levels off at 155 due to the limiter.
I can tune the 5.0 to about 430 whp with some tweaking. BTW leave Nitrous and Mercedes out of the same sentence. The damage you can do isnt worth the 5-second rush.
The Headers and exhaust definitely make a difference and if tuned right will be well worth the investment.
