Am I the only one unimpressed with the new BMW M series?
#51
Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Brunei
Posts: 181
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Too Young To Drive
As much as I respect RennTechV12, I have to disagree with his theory, especially as stated in the very first post. According to that post, torque is the ONLY factor that determines the acceleration of a car. In that case, a Mack 16-wheeler should destroy a F1 car in a straight line race, because the truck produces enough torque to move a mountain and the F1 car, ~200lb-ft. But that doesn't happen.
Similarly if we took say, the Merc 350 engine + 7gtronic drivetrain, which produces roughly the same amount of torque as an F1 engine, and shoved it into an F1 car, it wouldn't win a race even against a Minardi.
This has been discussed FAR FAR FAR too many times, and torque isn't the only factor affecting acceleration.
Similarly if we took say, the Merc 350 engine + 7gtronic drivetrain, which produces roughly the same amount of torque as an F1 engine, and shoved it into an F1 car, it wouldn't win a race even against a Minardi.
This has been discussed FAR FAR FAR too many times, and torque isn't the only factor affecting acceleration.
#52
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Kenilworth, il usa
Posts: 2,924
Received 378 Likes
on
244 Posts
'22 Alpina B7,'21 G63 Renntech obviously (wife), Wrangler(kids)
Originally Posted by jangy
So, the E55 had too much *** so you modified it and it was worse. Then, you tried a different car, one with even more grunt and you were still not happy. You just don't find power to be practical or driveable, even after you modified the 600 too, so now you are buying a BMW. OK, I finally get it.
Next time try new tires instead of Renntech performance mods until you learn to need more. You are a classic example of overload. You spend all the money (if you really did) on adding to the one part of your cars that you have not yet learned how to use.
As another poster noted, any idiot can drive an automatic like an E55. For you to find the E55 and or SL600 as impractical or undriveable is ludicrous. Both cars are teddy bears if you choose to drive them in that way.
I guess it makes perfect sense to assume that a mid sized sedan will be much more civil with less torque. Not to mention how fun it is to constantly change gears fighting to be at or above 5000 rpm to show any life. I forgot the good old days when I had the first generation M3. Screaming four cylinder.
Next time try new tires instead of Renntech performance mods until you learn to need more. You are a classic example of overload. You spend all the money (if you really did) on adding to the one part of your cars that you have not yet learned how to use.
As another poster noted, any idiot can drive an automatic like an E55. For you to find the E55 and or SL600 as impractical or undriveable is ludicrous. Both cars are teddy bears if you choose to drive them in that way.
I guess it makes perfect sense to assume that a mid sized sedan will be much more civil with less torque. Not to mention how fun it is to constantly change gears fighting to be at or above 5000 rpm to show any life. I forgot the good old days when I had the first generation M3. Screaming four cylinder.
The car has all this wonderful power but it's inaccesible except in a straight line.
I really do hope the new 6.3 will have a better power delivery and looking at the specs it sure sounds like it.
#53
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: In my garage
Posts: 8,549
Received 1,067 Likes
on
856 Posts
E55, GLS450, GL63, GLE350
This has been discussed FAR FAR FAR too many times, and torque isn't the only factor affecting acceleration.
#54
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 1,143
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
3 Posts
2017 S63 Coupe Iridium Silver
I am getting bored ****less by this continuing comparison with the M5.
It is now bordering on paranoia, so all those who are still worried about the stinking ugly M5, and whether they've made the right choice buying the E55, should go and buy the Bangle-bungle BMW and leave us all alone to enjoy our cars in peace. Amen.
It is now bordering on paranoia, so all those who are still worried about the stinking ugly M5, and whether they've made the right choice buying the E55, should go and buy the Bangle-bungle BMW and leave us all alone to enjoy our cars in peace. Amen.
#55
Originally Posted by jangy
I forgot the good old days when I had the first generation M3. Screaming four cylinder.
![hammer](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/bonk.gif)
#56
Originally Posted by BlownV8
Torque and rpms are the only things that matter. Period. You can't have any hp without tq. HP is just a measure of tq at a given rpm. Torque and rpms are the main factors that affect acceleration weither it is by the engine or by torque multiplying gearing.
#57
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: In my garage
Posts: 8,549
Received 1,067 Likes
on
856 Posts
E55, GLS450, GL63, GLE350
YOU CAN HAVE HP WITHOT TORQUE BY INCREASING THE RPM
![wall](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/banghead.gif)
#58
[QUOTE=BlownV8]No, you can't have hp without torque. HP is a measure of torque at a given rpm. What do you not understand? Here is the forumula again, HP = tq * RPM/5252. It's a very simple formula and it's the way you calculate hp, period! QUOTE]
You have shown a formula with TWO variables (torque, RPM) in a direct relationship (multiplication, not division) with hp. Any of the two variables, when altered will have a direct effect on the resultant hp.
You state " you can't have hp without torque." I guess I don't understand what you are trying to say. Granted, the M5 torque of 384 ftlbs is less than the E55s 500ftlb, but the M5 is carrying MORE hp (500vs. 469) How does this fact fit in to your logic/argument?
You have shown a formula with TWO variables (torque, RPM) in a direct relationship (multiplication, not division) with hp. Any of the two variables, when altered will have a direct effect on the resultant hp.
You state " you can't have hp without torque." I guess I don't understand what you are trying to say. Granted, the M5 torque of 384 ftlbs is less than the E55s 500ftlb, but the M5 is carrying MORE hp (500vs. 469) How does this fact fit in to your logic/argument?
![wall](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/banghead.gif)
#59
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: In my garage
Posts: 8,549
Received 1,067 Likes
on
856 Posts
E55, GLS450, GL63, GLE350
You state " you can't have hp without torque." I guess I don't understand what you are trying to say. Granted, the M5 torque of 384 ftlbs is less than the E55s 500ftlb, but the M5 is carrying MORE hp (500vs. 469) How does this fact fit in to your logic/argument?
#60
Originally Posted by BlownV8
The M5 is able to keep that torque relatively high until the rev limiter kicks in. Let's say the M5 makes 351 lb-ft of tq at 7500 rpm. The engine would make (351 lb-ft * 7500 rpm)/5252 = 501.24 hp. Let's take an engine like the E55 that has around 429 lb-ft of tq at 6000 rpm. (429 lb-ft * 6,000rpm)/5252 = 490.1 hp. If the E55 could keep that 429 lb-ft of torque to 7,500 rpm, the motor would make (429 lb-ft * 7500)/5252 = 612 hp. Or conversely, if the M5 could keep the 384 lb-ft to 7500 rpm, it would make 548.36 hp.
#61
Originally Posted by RennTechV12
When will people start to understand that acceleration is all about torque.
What people are saying here, is that the torque to the rear wheels is not simply determined by the engine torque. The torque the car puts to the ground is mainly determined by the engine horsepower and the gearing.
If all you are talking about engine torque and horsepower, then acceleration is actually best determined using the horsepower. Any formula that estimates acceleration times will use horsepower, not torque as the primary variable. If you want to estimate your quarter mile times and trapspeeds, a reasonable formula is:
MPH = 225 (hp/weight)1/3 and ET = 6.290 (weight/hp)1/3
(1/3 indicates the cubed root)
This is a decent website with more detailed information:
http://www.stealth316.com/2-calc-hp-et-mph.htm
#62
In Sport auto magazine a few months back there are some numbers posted for the Mercedes CLS55 AMG and the M5 tested in a shoot-out, so a side-by-side comparo on the same day:
0 - 40 km/h: CLS55: 1.5 sec / M5: 1.5 sec
0 - 60 km/h: CLS55: 2.3 sec / M5: 2.3 sec
0 - 80 km/h: CLS55: 3.2 sec / M5: 3.5 sec
0 - 100 km/h: CLS55: 4.7 sec / M5: 4.5 sec
0 - 120 km/h: CLS55: 6.0 sec / M5: 5.9 sec
0 - 140 km/h: CLS55: 7.9 sec / M5: 7.4 sec
0 - 160 km/h: CLS55: 10.2 sec / M5: 9.2 sec
0 - 180 km/h: CLS55: 12.3 sec / M5: 11.6 sec
0 - 200 km/h: CLS55: 15.4 sec / M5: 13.8 sec
Acceleration in 4th/5th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.1 / 4.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 / 8.7 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 9.0 / 12.8 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 12.0 / 16.8 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 15.8 / - sec
Acceleration in 4th/5th/6th/7th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 2.2 / 3.2 / 3.6 / 4.7 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 4.5 / 5.9 / 6.9 / 9.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 6.9 / 8.7 / 10.2 / 14.6 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 8.8 / 11.7 / 13.5 / 19.0 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 10.8 / 14.4 / 17.3 / 23.9 sec
Note M5 one gear higher still pulls the 55 from as low as 50mph. But of course in a racing situation bot driver are gonna stomp it or flick the paddles & get the lowest gear possible & then the M5 will win as it is a revver with high rpm power & more than enough torque for its gearing.
But as my post has proven, even in a low rev lugging contest the M5 pulls the 55 due to gearing.
Hey Impro, how you doing man? I'm postin this from an Internet Cafe in Italy bud!
0 - 40 km/h: CLS55: 1.5 sec / M5: 1.5 sec
0 - 60 km/h: CLS55: 2.3 sec / M5: 2.3 sec
0 - 80 km/h: CLS55: 3.2 sec / M5: 3.5 sec
0 - 100 km/h: CLS55: 4.7 sec / M5: 4.5 sec
0 - 120 km/h: CLS55: 6.0 sec / M5: 5.9 sec
0 - 140 km/h: CLS55: 7.9 sec / M5: 7.4 sec
0 - 160 km/h: CLS55: 10.2 sec / M5: 9.2 sec
0 - 180 km/h: CLS55: 12.3 sec / M5: 11.6 sec
0 - 200 km/h: CLS55: 15.4 sec / M5: 13.8 sec
Acceleration in 4th/5th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.1 / 4.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 / 8.7 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 9.0 / 12.8 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 12.0 / 16.8 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 15.8 / - sec
Acceleration in 4th/5th/6th/7th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 2.2 / 3.2 / 3.6 / 4.7 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 4.5 / 5.9 / 6.9 / 9.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 6.9 / 8.7 / 10.2 / 14.6 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 8.8 / 11.7 / 13.5 / 19.0 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 10.8 / 14.4 / 17.3 / 23.9 sec
Note M5 one gear higher still pulls the 55 from as low as 50mph. But of course in a racing situation bot driver are gonna stomp it or flick the paddles & get the lowest gear possible & then the M5 will win as it is a revver with high rpm power & more than enough torque for its gearing.
But as my post has proven, even in a low rev lugging contest the M5 pulls the 55 due to gearing.
Hey Impro, how you doing man? I'm postin this from an Internet Cafe in Italy bud!
#63
Super Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: South Florida
Posts: 527
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
'10 Panamera S, '06 AMG CLS55, '07 Miata MX5, '02 MB SPRINTER, '99 Spec Miata Race Car (2X)
In Response to Zumbalak
Zumbalak - There are some of us who live in places like South Florida where there is an absolute ABUNDANCE of short straights between stop lights and stop signs, and an absolute ABSENCE of any turns or twisties. For us, a BMW M5 would still be a wonderful car to own, make no mistake, but every E55 would still spank it on a daily basis.
For us to have any fun on the streets, and ability to stomp and squirt it from the lights and get up to speed instantly before hitting the brakes, is just about the only fun we are ever going to have with our cars, without leaving our state or taking it to the track.
I firmly beleive that the new M5 will be an ABSOLUTELY AWESOME car, but a bit wasted on me here in S. FL. And yes, if the videos are anything to go by, it will pull away from my E55 at higher speeds, but generally our bragging rights in S FL are won at speeds under 80 mph.
And as for tracking my car, this is something I have done, but it is not what I bought my E55 for, and while it is still a car than can be tracked, if tracking is what you really want to do with your car, you are not going to be buying an E55 or an M5 - just my $0.02!
Sisati
Why do people care that much about 0-60 times?
Those who enjoy driving a car throught the curves, the turns, the apexes will not be bothered too much with 0-60 times or 1/4ml times too much I would think.
Straight line driving with an automatic does not require much of a skill, majority of people can drive a monster HP car from a roll and get the same results, they all can outrun many cars without a difference. But for those people the results would be so much different on a track.
Those who enjoy driving a car throught the curves, the turns, the apexes will not be bothered too much with 0-60 times or 1/4ml times too much I would think.
Straight line driving with an automatic does not require much of a skill, majority of people can drive a monster HP car from a roll and get the same results, they all can outrun many cars without a difference. But for those people the results would be so much different on a track.
For us to have any fun on the streets, and ability to stomp and squirt it from the lights and get up to speed instantly before hitting the brakes, is just about the only fun we are ever going to have with our cars, without leaving our state or taking it to the track.
I firmly beleive that the new M5 will be an ABSOLUTELY AWESOME car, but a bit wasted on me here in S. FL. And yes, if the videos are anything to go by, it will pull away from my E55 at higher speeds, but generally our bragging rights in S FL are won at speeds under 80 mph.
And as for tracking my car, this is something I have done, but it is not what I bought my E55 for, and while it is still a car than can be tracked, if tracking is what you really want to do with your car, you are not going to be buying an E55 or an M5 - just my $0.02!
Sisati
#64
Originally Posted by BlownV8
The M5 is able to keep that torque relatively high until the rev limiter kicks in. Let's say the M5 makes 351 lb-ft of tq at 7500 rpm. The engine would make (351 lb-ft * 7500 rpm)/5252 = 501.24 hp. Let's take an engine like the E55 that has around 429 lb-ft of tq at 6000 rpm. (429 lb-ft * 6,000rpm)/5252 = 490.1 hp. If the E55 could keep that 429 lb-ft of torque to 7,500 rpm, the motor would make (429 lb-ft * 7500)/5252 = 612 hp. Or conversely, if the M5 could keep the 384 lb-ft to 7500 rpm, it would make 548.36 hp.
It should be interesting to see the results. I assume it's easier to race with more torque because if you're caught in the wrong gear, it won't slow you down too much because of the low-end torque. Whereas, if you're in the wrong gear with the v10, you're left in the dust. With the bmw SMG, it's hard to screw up and put yourself in the wrong hear, but it's possible. I could be wrong, but that's what I've been reading.
#65
Super Member
Originally Posted by krispykrme
M requires a better driver than someone that only knows to step on the gas and stay there.
Being that the AMG cars are (possibly excepting the SLK and C) monumentally heavy, fairly ponderous (by comparison, taking your p.o.v.) cars, I'd suggest it takes a better driver to harness and shepherd all that power, as opposed to the BMW, which I've never driven but which is said to be all about killer handling; wouldn't it be tougher by yours and others' logic (and therefore require the better driver) to handle with aplomb the car that "anyone can drive in a straight line"?
![drive](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/driving.gif)
Last edited by vixapphire; 09-10-2005 at 02:29 PM.
#67
Super Member
Originally Posted by siswati
In Response to Zumbalak
Zumbalak - There are some of us who live in places like South Florida where there is an absolute ABUNDANCE of short straights between stop lights and stop signs, and an absolute ABSENCE of any turns or twisties. For us, a BMW M5 would still be a wonderful car to own, make no mistake, but every E55 would still spank it on a daily basis.
For us to have any fun on the streets, and ability to stomp and squirt it from the lights and get up to speed instantly before hitting the brakes, is just about the only fun we are ever going to have with our cars, without leaving our state or taking it to the track.
Sisati
Zumbalak - There are some of us who live in places like South Florida where there is an absolute ABUNDANCE of short straights between stop lights and stop signs, and an absolute ABSENCE of any turns or twisties. For us, a BMW M5 would still be a wonderful car to own, make no mistake, but every E55 would still spank it on a daily basis.
For us to have any fun on the streets, and ability to stomp and squirt it from the lights and get up to speed instantly before hitting the brakes, is just about the only fun we are ever going to have with our cars, without leaving our state or taking it to the track.
Sisati
It sounds like a taste and application-specific thing to me, and more "apples to oranges" each time i think about it.
That said, for as bizarrely "off" as the 5-series' interior looks, I checked out the wagon a couple of months ago and was surprised at how well thought-out it is: everything (arm rests, etc.) looks edgy and odd, but fits right under your body like the car was designed around a mannequin. Quite impressive, in a "she's not the best-looking so she tries harder" kind of way.
v
#68
Originally Posted by M&M
Apparently not, huh.
Last edited by a_ok2me; 09-10-2005 at 03:14 PM.
#69
Apparently not huh?
Exhibit A:
Acceleration in 4th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.1 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 9.0 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 12.0 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 15.8 sec
Acceleration in 5th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.2 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 8.7 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 11.7 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 14.4 sec
Exhibit B:
Acceleration in 5th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 4.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 8.7 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 12.8 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 16.8 sec
80 - 180 km/h: - sec
Acceleration in 6th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 6.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 10.2 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 13.5 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 17.3 sec
Exhibit A:
Acceleration in 4th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.1 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 9.0 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 12.0 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 15.8 sec
Acceleration in 5th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.2 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 8.7 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 11.7 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 14.4 sec
Exhibit B:
Acceleration in 5th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 4.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 8.7 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 12.8 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 16.8 sec
80 - 180 km/h: - sec
Acceleration in 6th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 6.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 10.2 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 13.5 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 17.3 sec
Last edited by M&M; 09-10-2005 at 03:36 PM.
#70
MBWorld Fanatic!
Originally Posted by M&M
Apparently not huh?
Exhibit A:
Acceleration in 4th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.1 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 9.0 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 12.0 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 15.8 sec
Acceleration in 5th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.2 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 8.7 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 11.7 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 14.4 sec
Exhibit B:
Acceleration in 5th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 4.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 8.7 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 12.8 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 16.8 sec
80 - 180 km/h: - sec
Acceleration in 6th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 6.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 10.2 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 13.5 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 17.3 sec
Exhibit A:
Acceleration in 4th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.1 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 9.0 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 12.0 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 15.8 sec
Acceleration in 5th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.2 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 5.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 8.7 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 11.7 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 14.4 sec
Exhibit B:
Acceleration in 5th gear (CLS55):
80 - 100 km/h: 4.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 8.7 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 12.8 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 16.8 sec
80 - 180 km/h: - sec
Acceleration in 6th gear (M5):
80 - 100 km/h: 3.6 sec
80 - 120 km/h: 6.9 sec
80 - 140 km/h: 10.2 sec
80 - 160 km/h: 13.5 sec
80 - 180 km/h: 17.3 sec
Great, Mr. Magazine is back.
![Roll Eyes (Sarcastic)](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
![nix](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/nixweiss.gif)
Still waiting for them to show up at a track stateside. Any month now.
Out of curiosity, (seriously) what RPM is an M5 running in 4th gear at 80 kph? 5,000?
#71
YEah Enzom, you sound like a typical sore loser. See plenty of them at the track. Catch a wake up or go back to school. A car with more HP that weighs less will SURPRISE SURPRISE be faster. If you can't comprehend that then there's no need for any further discussion from your part. Just sit in the corner & tell everyoen how good you are at kicking butt.
#72
[QUOTE=enzom]Magazines mean squat.
[QUOTE]
And another thing. Great to say magazines mean squat when the results aren'tin your favour. I bet if the results were the other way around you'd change your tune.
So instead of magazines you think on the road encounters are more scientific? Hell anything can happen on the road man. Doesn't mean jack. But if you want on the road encounters I can post some videos of M5's whooping E55's. There's even a video of a stock M5 running away from a chipped E55. There's also videos of M5's passing 575 Ferrair's, 911 turbos, etc. PLEASE tell me you want the link wiseguy.
[QUOTE]
And another thing. Great to say magazines mean squat when the results aren'tin your favour. I bet if the results were the other way around you'd change your tune.
So instead of magazines you think on the road encounters are more scientific? Hell anything can happen on the road man. Doesn't mean jack. But if you want on the road encounters I can post some videos of M5's whooping E55's. There's even a video of a stock M5 running away from a chipped E55. There's also videos of M5's passing 575 Ferrair's, 911 turbos, etc. PLEASE tell me you want the link wiseguy.
#73
Super Member
Originally Posted by BlownV8
The M5 is able to keep that torque relatively high until the rev limiter kicks in. Let's say the M5 makes 351 lb-ft of tq at 7500 rpm. The engine would make (351 lb-ft * 7500 rpm)/5252 = 501.24 hp. Let's take an engine like the E55 that has around 429 lb-ft of tq at 6000 rpm. (429 lb-ft * 6,000rpm)/5252 = 490.1 hp. If the E55 could keep that 429 lb-ft of torque to 7,500 rpm, the motor would make (429 lb-ft * 7500)/5252 = 612 hp. Or conversely, if the M5 could keep the 384 lb-ft to 7500 rpm, it would make 548.36 hp.
You are talking about mathmatical calculation then actual performance of the engine, which is complete a$$ talk.
#74
Super Member
Originally Posted by vixapphire
Actually, I'm not so sure about your implicit characterization of AMG drivers...
Being that the AMG cars are (possibly excepting the SLK and C) monumentally heavy, fairly ponderous (by comparison, taking your p.o.v.) cars, I'd suggest it takes a better driver to harness and shepherd all that power, as opposed to the BMW, which I've never driven but which is said to be all about killer handling; wouldn't it be tougher by yours and others' logic (and therefore require the better driver) to handle with aplomb the car that "anyone can drive in a straight line"?![drive](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/driving.gif)
Being that the AMG cars are (possibly excepting the SLK and C) monumentally heavy, fairly ponderous (by comparison, taking your p.o.v.) cars, I'd suggest it takes a better driver to harness and shepherd all that power, as opposed to the BMW, which I've never driven but which is said to be all about killer handling; wouldn't it be tougher by yours and others' logic (and therefore require the better driver) to handle with aplomb the car that "anyone can drive in a straight line"?
![drive](https://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/driving.gif)
Plus, with M5 you have to be good with gearing selection and timing of gas pedal. Even though there is SMG, it is still a manual car. Hence selection of gear timing is very critical in getting more out of M5.
That's why M5 will require more skilled driver to max its potential than the E55.
The E55 is never designed to be a sports sedan. It is a great cruiser with insane straightline power, which really does not require an excellent driver.
#75
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: El Paso, TX
Posts: 1,764
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
2 Posts
'03 G500, '13 G63, '17 GLS63,
Originally Posted by krispykrme
No. AMG is so soft with agressive ESP, you will never approach the limit that BMW M provides you in base car. For example, the M5 allows you to pull over 1G on skidpad, the E55 only pulls mid 0.8.
Plus, with M5 you have to be good with gearing selection and timing of gas pedal. Even though there is SMG, it is still a manual car. Hence selection of gear timing is very critical in getting more out of M5.
That's why M5 will require more skilled driver to max its potential than the E55.
The E55 is never designed to be a sports sedan. It is a great cruiser with insane straightline power, which really does not require an excellent driver.
Plus, with M5 you have to be good with gearing selection and timing of gas pedal. Even though there is SMG, it is still a manual car. Hence selection of gear timing is very critical in getting more out of M5.
That's why M5 will require more skilled driver to max its potential than the E55.
The E55 is never designed to be a sports sedan. It is a great cruiser with insane straightline power, which really does not require an excellent driver.