Battle of the wagons....Magnum SRT8 VS E55.
12-16-2005, 07:03 AM
#26
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I had placed my order for a 300c srt8 in jan, and was number 2 on the local dealers list, but when the time came and I ran the numbers to lease the thing, it was only $15.00 more per month to lease a 2005 e500 with amg sport and pano roof.
I know I am down on power, but this car's interior makes me forget about the loss of power.
sometimes msrp is a non issue when it comes to leasing. I understand buying is a totally different issue, but for me I am going to drive a 68k e500 any day over a srt8.
dr dave
I know I am down on power, but this car's interior makes me forget about the loss of power.
sometimes msrp is a non issue when it comes to leasing. I understand buying is a totally different issue, but for me I am going to drive a 68k e500 any day over a srt8.
dr dave
12-19-2005, 12:26 PM
#27
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Originally Posted by DRCrowder
You could not be more biased.
I have driven both the SRT-8 Wagon and 300 and while nice, I can certainly see the 50K price difference.
2. No nav, no air vent seats, no rear sunshade, no auto dim mirrors, no HID’s let alone active HID’s, not Distronic, no Parktronic, No Adaptive seats, no pana roof, no keyless go, no adjustable shocks, no 14.6 in rotors, no 8 piston calipers, no TPMS, no elec trunk closer (i could keep going...). Crummy stereo
3. E55 is quieter, and handles better (do not give me your “butt-dyno” results about body roll, look at the specs)
I have driven both the SRT-8 Wagon and 300 and while nice, I can certainly see the 50K price difference.
2. No nav, no air vent seats, no rear sunshade, no auto dim mirrors, no HID’s let alone active HID’s, not Distronic, no Parktronic, No Adaptive seats, no pana roof, no keyless go, no adjustable shocks, no 14.6 in rotors, no 8 piston calipers, no TPMS, no elec trunk closer (i could keep going...). Crummy stereo
3. E55 is quieter, and handles better (do not give me your “butt-dyno” results about body roll, look at the specs)
I used some examples supporting the Magnum's merits and gave data concerning the Magnum not being "redneck". Not one time did I critisize the E55 wagon. I only stated that I read some comments as arrogant and snobbish because it is a Dodge. How does that make me bias when I am the only one with both types of cars?
Next time 'you' do a little more research. Many of the thing you listed are options on the E55. The SRT-8 does have these options that 'you' state it does not:
Navigation
Rear Privacy Tint from factory like found on SUV's (no need for sunshade)
Rearview Day/Night Mirror
Rear Backup Sensors
Boston Acoustics System with Kicker Subwoofer option
TPMS is there
About your "butt-dyno" comment and "look at the specs" Take your own advise first. Motor Trend says the SRT8 beat the E55 in the twisties with their "600-ft slalom" test plus better braking in the "60-0 mph" test. So all those raves about 14.6" rotors and 8-Piston are moot when the stopping power of the E55 is less with 60-0 and only better by 3 feet in 100-0.
All those added extras you spewed out for the E55 does not make the Magnum SRT8 worthless for it's pricepoint and performance, regarless of what one can afford. Dodge has to make some sacrifices to meet a low price and no Mercedes car comes with forged rims from the factory.
Hey, for that sick forum member that keeps vomiting over the Magnum's interior can go to town with all the wood and leather he misses from a Mercedes from the aftermarket. A wood interior kit for the Magnum is about $250.
Last edited by E55 KEV; 12-19-2005 at 01:07 PM.
12-19-2005, 01:20 PM
#28
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E55 KEV
You're sounding way too defensive, and way too emotional to me, still. This is the MBWorld AMG E55 Forum -- get it? We don't want to spend a bunch of time talking about Chryslers, or Dodge's, or Mistusbishi's....
I see, and hope that Daimler continues to upgrade Chrysler's product-line -- good thing. But that doesn't mean that we on this forum want to discuss it ad nasuem, or that we necessarily give too much of a damn!
You're sounding way too defensive, and way too emotional to me, still. This is the MBWorld AMG E55 Forum -- get it? We don't want to spend a bunch of time talking about Chryslers, or Dodge's, or Mistusbishi's....
I see, and hope that Daimler continues to upgrade Chrysler's product-line -- good thing. But that doesn't mean that we on this forum want to discuss it ad nasuem, or that we necessarily give too much of a damn!
12-19-2005, 03:12 PM
#29
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'05 E55TK, '00 Brabus/Kleemann 5.8 GCab, '05 CLK DTM
Originally Posted by ClayJ
E55 KEV
You're sounding way too defensive, and way too emotional to me, still. This is the MBWorld AMG E55 Forum -- get it? We don't want to spend a bunch of time talking about Chryslers, or Dodge's, or Mistusbishi's....
I see, and hope that Daimler continues to upgrade Chrysler's product-line -- good thing. But that doesn't mean that we on this forum want to discuss it ad nasuem, or that we necessarily give too much of a damn!
You're sounding way too defensive, and way too emotional to me, still. This is the MBWorld AMG E55 Forum -- get it? We don't want to spend a bunch of time talking about Chryslers, or Dodge's, or Mistusbishi's....
I see, and hope that Daimler continues to upgrade Chrysler's product-line -- good thing. But that doesn't mean that we on this forum want to discuss it ad nasuem, or that we necessarily give too much of a damn!
Here here...let's put this to rest. Kev, you've got no winning argument on this board. Everyone is happy that you like the SRT8 but I am content to keep vomiting over it's interior. Adding $250 dollars of wood to gigantic knobs and ergonomically incorrect dashboards and steering wheels will not cure my sickness.
12-19-2005, 03:21 PM
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05 E55, 03 Z4 3.0
Originally Posted by E55 KEV
BIASED! I made no biased comments about the E55 Wagon. I made no ill-comments toward the E55 Wagon at all. Being an owner of an E55 and a Magnum can not make me biased. The bias comes from those that do not own them and those that spoke without experience before those with real experience join the thread. This is important - Of all the guys that posted before me, not one, not a single one came in to defend their position!
I used some examples supporting the Magnum's merits and gave data concerning the Magnum not being "redneck". Not one time did I critisize the E55 wagon. I only stated that I read some comments as arrogant and snobbish because it is a Dodge. How does that make me bias when I am the only one with both types of cars?
Next time 'you' do a little more research. Many of the thing you listed are options on the E55. The SRT-8 does have these options that 'you' state it does not:
Navigation
Rear Privacy Tint from factory like found on SUV's (no need for sunshade)
Rearview Day/Night Mirror
Rear Backup Sensors
Boston Acoustics System with Kicker Subwoofer option
TPMS is there
About your "butt-dyno" comment and "look at the specs" Take your own advise first. Motor Trend says the SRT8 beat the E55 in the twisties with their "600-ft slalom" test plus better braking in the "60-0 mph" test. So all those raves about 14.6" rotors and 8-Piston are moot when the stopping power of the E55 is less with 60-0 and only better by 3 feet in 100-0.
All those added extras you spewed out for the E55 does not make the Magnum SRT8 worthless for it's pricepoint and performance, regarless of what one can afford. Dodge has to make some sacrifices to meet a low price and no Mercedes car comes with forged rims from the factory.
Hey, for that sick forum member that keeps vomiting over the Magnum's interior can go to town with all the wood and leather he misses from a Mercedes from the aftermarket. A wood interior kit for the Magnum is about $250.
I used some examples supporting the Magnum's merits and gave data concerning the Magnum not being "redneck". Not one time did I critisize the E55 wagon. I only stated that I read some comments as arrogant and snobbish because it is a Dodge. How does that make me bias when I am the only one with both types of cars?
Next time 'you' do a little more research. Many of the thing you listed are options on the E55. The SRT-8 does have these options that 'you' state it does not:
Navigation
Rear Privacy Tint from factory like found on SUV's (no need for sunshade)
Rearview Day/Night Mirror
Rear Backup Sensors
Boston Acoustics System with Kicker Subwoofer option
TPMS is there
About your "butt-dyno" comment and "look at the specs" Take your own advise first. Motor Trend says the SRT8 beat the E55 in the twisties with their "600-ft slalom" test plus better braking in the "60-0 mph" test. So all those raves about 14.6" rotors and 8-Piston are moot when the stopping power of the E55 is less with 60-0 and only better by 3 feet in 100-0.
All those added extras you spewed out for the E55 does not make the Magnum SRT8 worthless for it's pricepoint and performance, regarless of what one can afford. Dodge has to make some sacrifices to meet a low price and no Mercedes car comes with forged rims from the factory.
Hey, for that sick forum member that keeps vomiting over the Magnum's interior can go to town with all the wood and leather he misses from a Mercedes from the aftermarket. A wood interior kit for the Magnum is about $250.
I went to the dodge site for my info before i posted (build your own SRT-8), if it is incorrect ... whatever.
Good car for 43K, real gald to be in my W211 E55
Have a great day.....
12-19-2005, 03:25 PM
#31
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The discussion is not Off Topic!
Like what you just posted is going to have an impact. I have posted 3 times prior to this - You have posted 3 times and now you want to dictate the thread? BTW, I did not start this thread and I have not gone off topic. If you have something to contribute lets hear it. If not then keep your keyboard and your mouth shut.
There is plenty of other stuff for you read. You can move on and unsubscribe from the discussion if what I post is not what you want to read.
There is plenty of other stuff for you read. You can move on and unsubscribe from the discussion if what I post is not what you want to read.
12-19-2005, 03:56 PM
#33
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Originally Posted by silversurfer
Here here...let's put this to rest. Kev, you've got no winning argument on this board. Everyone is happy that you like the SRT8 but I am content to keep vomiting over it's interior. Adding $250 dollars of wood to gigantic knobs and ergonomically incorrect dashboards and steering wheels will not cure my sickness.
Sure the interior may be plain, cheap or ugly but there is nothing out of place. You can not state one example of any controls not where they should be. If you want to see a control panel mess check out the W210. Buttons all over the place.
Honestly, the HVAC controls on the Magnum are much easier to use than Mercedes. Those 2 "gigantic knobs" of which you speak are very simple design. One of the biggest Auto Journalist complaint of the W210 and W211 (when released) was too many buttons.
silversurfer, why are you still trying to defend the purchase of your E55 Wagon vs the Magnum SRT8 - you don't have to? Everyone including me agree that the E55 Wagon is one hell of a machine.
Last edited by E55 KEV; 12-19-2005 at 04:09 PM.
12-19-2005, 04:04 PM
#34
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Originally Posted by DRCrowder
Yawn....
Good car for 43K, real gald to be in my W211 E55
Have a great day.....
Good car for 43K, real gald to be in my W211 E55
Have a great day.....
12-19-2005, 04:08 PM
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05 E55, 03 Z4 3.0
Originally Posted by E55 KEV
Checked out the pics of your E55. Love the Graphite and the brown wood is a welcome change over Black Birdseye. Love it.
Thanks! I really love the car!
12-19-2005, 04:16 PM
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'05 E55TK, '00 Brabus/Kleemann 5.8 GCab, '05 CLK DTM
If you continue to defend Dodge then I will continue defend Mercedes and we will go on and on, ad infinitum. This is not defending my purchase, get it right, this is arguing against the equal comparison of two vastly different vehicles. However, if you continue to call me ignorant then I may have to verbally dismantle you. Please, watch what you type.
I've no need to defend my opinions on this thread any longer. It is my feeling that the dashboard is not well laid out (it is boxy and oversimplified, just like the vehicle), the knobs are clunky (for the fat hands of Americans, not overengineered like MB), and that the steering wheel looks like it came off a big wheel. My opinions...now who is taking this thread personally?
I've no need to defend my opinions on this thread any longer. It is my feeling that the dashboard is not well laid out (it is boxy and oversimplified, just like the vehicle), the knobs are clunky (for the fat hands of Americans, not overengineered like MB), and that the steering wheel looks like it came off a big wheel. My opinions...now who is taking this thread personally?
12-19-2005, 04:20 PM
#37
MBWorld Fanatic!
Originally Posted by silversurfer
Kev, you've got no winning argument on this board.
For = 9 or 60%
Against = 6 or 40%
12-19-2005, 04:23 PM
#38
MBWorld Fanatic!
Originally Posted by silversurfer
If you continue to defend Dodge then I will continue defend Mercedes and we will go on and on, ad infinitum. This is not defending my purchase, get it right, this is arguing against the equal comparison of two vastly different vehicles. However, if you continue to call me ignorant then I may have to verbally dismantle you. Please, watch what you type.
I've no need to defend my opinions on this thread any longer. It is my feeling that the dashboard is not well laid out (it is boxy and oversimplified, just like the vehicle), the knobs are clunky (for the fat hands of Americans, not overengineered like MB), and that the steering wheel looks like it came off a big wheel. My opinions...now who is taking this thread personally?
I've no need to defend my opinions on this thread any longer. It is my feeling that the dashboard is not well laid out (it is boxy and oversimplified, just like the vehicle), the knobs are clunky (for the fat hands of Americans, not overengineered like MB), and that the steering wheel looks like it came off a big wheel. My opinions...now who is taking this thread personally?
Defending Dodge is not really a bad thing. It is all part of Daimler-Chrysler. Also, these 2 performance wagons are not "vastly different vehicles". All the performance number are close. Cars are not compared based on their option list or leather or wood or finesse - just the performance and they are similar - regardless if some like it or not. The performance numbers is not about panache or style.
But fat hands need big knobs. He-He!
Last edited by E55 KEV; 12-19-2005 at 04:27 PM.
12-19-2005, 06:57 PM
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Why would someone buy a Dodge magnum, such an ugly car?
It looks terrible. Very old fashion. looks more like a truck than a car.
In a comparions of E55T and SRT. I wouldnt even read the specs. Just the look would make me skip SRT.
and another thing I dont understand . why would someone want to speed on a stationwagon? I thought stationwagons were family cars for large-mid size families or some work purpose(larger cargo room).
I dont see any meaning tryin to hit 12 seconds on a track with a stationwagen.
a E500 4 matic would be a better choice I believe. Strong enough to pull the load and 4 matic for bad weathers. more confortable ride.
If speed is necessary most of the times and sometimes you need some more cargoroom. go get a nice sport car and when you need a stationwagon, you can rent one for 40 bucks a day.
It looks terrible. Very old fashion. looks more like a truck than a car.
In a comparions of E55T and SRT. I wouldnt even read the specs. Just the look would make me skip SRT.
and another thing I dont understand . why would someone want to speed on a stationwagon? I thought stationwagons were family cars for large-mid size families or some work purpose(larger cargo room).
I dont see any meaning tryin to hit 12 seconds on a track with a stationwagen.
a E500 4 matic would be a better choice I believe. Strong enough to pull the load and 4 matic for bad weathers. more confortable ride.
If speed is necessary most of the times and sometimes you need some more cargoroom. go get a nice sport car and when you need a stationwagon, you can rent one for 40 bucks a day.
12-19-2005, 08:53 PM
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'03 G500, '13 G63, '17 GLS63,
Originally Posted by Substance
If speed is necessary most of the times and sometimes you need some more cargoroom. go get a nice sport car and when you need a stationwagon, you can rent one for 40 bucks a day.
By this argument, I should have just bought the SL55 and rented a Taurus whenever I needed a sedan.
No thanks.
12-21-2005, 03:34 PM
#41
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Since I'm apparently the e55 wagon-owner guy under attack here...
I might as well chime back in. Hadn't realized that this thread sprang back to life under e55 Kev's hand...
First off, I don't know who called the Magnum "redneck"; all I can say is whoever it is made a moronic comment that really doesn't warrant a response; it's hardly an argument... I don't think a Magnum's any more "redneck" than an e55 is "****". How idiotic are we here?
Moving right along, I appreciate your (e55 Kev's) vociferous defense of your Magnum. However, you're all wet when it comes to your assumptions about me and/or how I researched the purchase of my e55 wagon. I don't know you, you don't know me, so lay off the intimate details of what I have or haven't test-driven, sat inside of, etc.; it's really not that interesting coming from you.
I drove the Hemi Magnum before I bought; the SRT wasn't out yet, as I noted in my initial post to which you took great objection. As I said then, what I considered to be the Magnum's shortfalls (relative to the e55) were not going to be overcome with more power or different wheels; they had to do with what I'd be looking at from behind the wheel every time I drove the car for the next 10 years.
And before you get too excited, unlike some of the more anti-Detroit types on this and other Eurocar boards, I love American cars and have very fond memories of the '68 Dodge Charger I used to own. You can find my impassioned defense of Cadillac's cars elsewhere in this forum. Biased I ain't. Opinionated, maybe
. If the financial aspect of the automotive purchase was a bigger factor in the decision, I'd likely have waited for the SRT Magnum, simply because it's more exclusive and hyper-powered than the other Magnums and it looks a lot better (it's lower, has bigger wheels, nice two-tone leather,etc.). And the price is undeniably spectacular for what you're getting.
There are some inescapable truths in the comparo between the Magnum and the e55T, though: the instrument panel, center column and steering wheel of the Dodge are comparably inferior in look and feel to the e55. Perhaps the Magnum blows away everything else "in its class"; this only confirms that it is not in the same class as the e55. I think Daimler-Chrysler is probably aware of this, wouldn't you agree? I don't think the corporate goal of DC is to create a GM-style brand-cannibalism environment, after all...
As for the interior which I've derided as against the e55, it's not only the "quality of plastics", but the design. The Dodge is clearly intended to appeal to a different aesthetic. The car looks it, in and out, and they market it the same way. If you like it, fine. I'm partial to the Merc. I think they could've made the Magnum somewhat more elegant had they wanted to, even given the materials/cost constraints, but they chose not to do so, probably in order to maintain the "machismo" of the overall design. By comparison, the Merc wagon is definitely the more "metrosexual" of the two cars! All that said, the tailgate that opens up into the roof is a nice touch and one of those "Advantage: Dodge" moments...
Anyway, in my opinion the pre-2003 Merc (even the e55) is much closer to the Magnum interior in terms of function-first design and materials quality than are the post '03s, including the e55 wagon. I looked at and test drove a couple of used '01 and '02 e55's on my way to buying this car (when a sedan was still an option), and although I still think the last-gen e class is one of the most handsome cars ever designed (particularly on the outside), I couldn't help thinking that the interior was an underwhelming "refresh"/holdover from the 1980's/90's e-class cars, which are almost brutalist by today's standards of luxury.
Now that I've shown you mine, did you drive the e55 wagon before you shared your obviously informed opinions and wise judgments (character and other) with us, or are you speaking strictly from the experience of your older Merc sedan and Magnum wagon? Not that anyone here cares; it'd nonetheless be interesting to discover if, as hypocrisy is the homage that vice pays to virtue, the accuser of "BIAS!" is himself speaking from partiality, not experience.
First off, I don't know who called the Magnum "redneck"; all I can say is whoever it is made a moronic comment that really doesn't warrant a response; it's hardly an argument... I don't think a Magnum's any more "redneck" than an e55 is "****". How idiotic are we here?
Moving right along, I appreciate your (e55 Kev's) vociferous defense of your Magnum. However, you're all wet when it comes to your assumptions about me and/or how I researched the purchase of my e55 wagon. I don't know you, you don't know me, so lay off the intimate details of what I have or haven't test-driven, sat inside of, etc.; it's really not that interesting coming from you.
I drove the Hemi Magnum before I bought; the SRT wasn't out yet, as I noted in my initial post to which you took great objection. As I said then, what I considered to be the Magnum's shortfalls (relative to the e55) were not going to be overcome with more power or different wheels; they had to do with what I'd be looking at from behind the wheel every time I drove the car for the next 10 years.
And before you get too excited, unlike some of the more anti-Detroit types on this and other Eurocar boards, I love American cars and have very fond memories of the '68 Dodge Charger I used to own. You can find my impassioned defense of Cadillac's cars elsewhere in this forum. Biased I ain't. Opinionated, maybe
. If the financial aspect of the automotive purchase was a bigger factor in the decision, I'd likely have waited for the SRT Magnum, simply because it's more exclusive and hyper-powered than the other Magnums and it looks a lot better (it's lower, has bigger wheels, nice two-tone leather,etc.). And the price is undeniably spectacular for what you're getting.There are some inescapable truths in the comparo between the Magnum and the e55T, though: the instrument panel, center column and steering wheel of the Dodge are comparably inferior in look and feel to the e55. Perhaps the Magnum blows away everything else "in its class"; this only confirms that it is not in the same class as the e55. I think Daimler-Chrysler is probably aware of this, wouldn't you agree? I don't think the corporate goal of DC is to create a GM-style brand-cannibalism environment, after all...
As for the interior which I've derided as against the e55, it's not only the "quality of plastics", but the design. The Dodge is clearly intended to appeal to a different aesthetic. The car looks it, in and out, and they market it the same way. If you like it, fine. I'm partial to the Merc. I think they could've made the Magnum somewhat more elegant had they wanted to, even given the materials/cost constraints, but they chose not to do so, probably in order to maintain the "machismo" of the overall design. By comparison, the Merc wagon is definitely the more "metrosexual" of the two cars! All that said, the tailgate that opens up into the roof is a nice touch and one of those "Advantage: Dodge" moments...
Anyway, in my opinion the pre-2003 Merc (even the e55) is much closer to the Magnum interior in terms of function-first design and materials quality than are the post '03s, including the e55 wagon. I looked at and test drove a couple of used '01 and '02 e55's on my way to buying this car (when a sedan was still an option), and although I still think the last-gen e class is one of the most handsome cars ever designed (particularly on the outside), I couldn't help thinking that the interior was an underwhelming "refresh"/holdover from the 1980's/90's e-class cars, which are almost brutalist by today's standards of luxury.
Now that I've shown you mine, did you drive the e55 wagon before you shared your obviously informed opinions and wise judgments (character and other) with us, or are you speaking strictly from the experience of your older Merc sedan and Magnum wagon? Not that anyone here cares; it'd nonetheless be interesting to discover if, as hypocrisy is the homage that vice pays to virtue, the accuser of "BIAS!" is himself speaking from partiality, not experience.
12-21-2005, 03:40 PM
#42
Super Member
Originally Posted by Substance
and another thing I dont understand . why would someone want to speed on a stationwagon? I thought stationwagons were family cars for large-mid size families or some work purpose(larger cargo room).
For someone like me who's always had a soft-spot for wagons, and loves the thrill of high-performance (including the thrill of knowing I've got monster brakes onboard to keep me safe in a pinch), and who's only got room for a single car, the e55, SRT, v70R, etc. are a dream come true. These are the "leatherman tools" of automobilia.
If you believe the e55 4matic is a better choice, you're free to make that choice as you see fit. Isn't the free world a great place to be?
