MJ50

i know a lot of ppl with PC tune on their cars...
don't get me wrong...

i'm just simply stating my side of the story that i experienced...
does that have to be same for everyone?

what if i had a bone stock ECU and went to PC to get tuned at the first place?
there wouldn't be a thread like this, no?




and brad, i have much respect for VRP, not so much for PowerChip for what i had to go through with them. if u want, i can post "details" of what really went on while i was at PowerChip... but i haven't all this time... u don't mind?

MJ50

sean, it was NOT dead even with mario's car when i started at 2nd gear, remember?

plus, i had SC clutch replaced under warranty soon after and now heard SC whine.... u want me to show u dealership receipt that shows actual date for proof?

nlpamg

as a non-interested party, as someone who has been browsing the forums for years, as someone who sees and hears what's going on in the car modding world, I want to chime in here...

MJ provided us with a service by telling his PERSONAL experience with the two companies. he didn't say that PC lies, cheats or steals and he didn't say that they were incompetent at their job (libel per se). he was merely telling his part and his understanding of the situation.

there is absolutely no need for flaming or for **** talking. let's cool it.

this entire thread, like every other thread on this board are open to each person's own personal interpretation. he was telling you his experience so that if someone did want to get a tune they could make their own INFORMED decision. sure, this maybe slightly pro-SI, but there are an overwhelming number of threads that are pro-PC and anti-SI. it's up to the individual person to take these threads, analyze them and make their own decision on who to choose.

MJ50

sorry, it's all my bad...
next time, i'll make sure to bring camcorder and reputable members/moderators/admins at the scene to witness the truth.... no tricks, no BS, no bias

SeaCoupe

No MJ, the guys that know you will vouch. You are a stand up guy who provide your experience.

As for some comments made here. I know that lengthy explanation was made regarding Locking ECUs. Lets say that didn't happen. Doesn't explain why MJ was given his car back with a Detune that is less than stock. Yep that fact may have escaped some.


Fact is, MJ has been a valued member of this community. His experience is relevant.

Ed

nlpamg

splinter

Appreciate your honest feedback, MJ.
Yes, you are indeed a valued and respected contributor to our forum. Straight shooter, too.

Thankful not every thread ‘round here is about license plate light bulbs and phat wheels.

Perplexing and quite discouraging, frankly, how exercising a unconditional 14 day money back guarantee refund request some six months ago - which you had every right to do as it was offered in Powerchip’s End User Agreement – could have gone so awry.

otoupalik

How can you get a refund from Powerchip for something bought from and paid to VRP - another company? Seems like Powerchip is taking the fall for MJ50 not getting his money refunded by VRP? Again, I could be missing something, but 1 + 1 still equals 2, right?

otoupalik

Phil,

The problem is it was presneted as FACT, not opinion.

He stated that PC LOCKED and DETUNED the ECU. Yet, the only facts he has on this are that a vendor (SI) stated that. He cannot prove that is what happened, yet he stated authoritatively that those are the facts.

Is it not possible that SI (a company that is very aggressive in it's anti-powerchip activities) could have mis-stated the facts or mislead MJ50 so that he would also be anti-powerchip?

That seems pretty logical to me.

And that is the problem. SI and MJ50 (most likely without realizing it) are using this site that I built to manipulate opinions into fact in an effort to harm Powerchip. That is NOT what this site is about and I will not sit around and allow it. Especially with Jesse involved, having been a personal victim of this person.

Thanks
Brad

FrankW

why are you insisting on vindicating for powerchip? on any subject that involves SI? personal vendetta?

serisouly, there is no reason for MJ to lie about anything. My C32 has also been tuned by SI few years back and I was more than happy with the result. If i've gone to Powerchip, I'd probably say the same too.

MJ has the opportunity and ability to tried both and based on his dyno experience the SI simply performed better for him.

On his setting up the appointment with SI, dyno on the spot, tune on the spot and getting his result is by far better than what we've seen a lot of time from other tuners.

just FIY for everyone that when I had the C32 tuned, I was physically watching SI do the work and talked to me about de-limit, rev limiter, etc. he was more than willing to discuss how everthing works, etc. As well as telling me that the dealership had performed a ECU update prior to getting it tuned (which I know for fact since I brought it to the dealer just before getting the car tuned) and he will revert it to using the original file. I'm pretty sure MJ had the same treatment from SI.

otoupalik

I have a HUGE issue with people posting opinion or hearsay as fact. Especially if it slanders or libels good people and or companies in the process. That is my problem, plain and simple.

People do this with far too less thought and good people trying to earn a living are harmed. Most of the people that do this don't think or try to realize that while modifying their car is a hobby, those they are talking about live and breathe and eat based upon sales, and often threads that have little fact but are full of hearsay and opinion seriously harm that ability to live/breathe/eat.

How would any of you like it if someone went on a forum for your industry and slandered/libeled/defamed you based on nothing more then pure hearsay or opinion (posted as FACT)? I know the answer, it is "I would not like it" or maybe "I would sue them" - people need to consider this before posting. While being a passion or hobby for the consumer, it is a REAL business to those that are selling these parts, and 99% of these businesses are small (1-10 people) and threads like this DO have a REAL impact on the bottom line.

That is the power of the internet, good and bad. Sadly it is used for bad far more then good.

Thanks
Brad

Vadim @ FD

As someone who was involved in this from the beginning let me try to make sense of what you are trying to say here....

MJ, you are posting an opinion that was expressed to you by Jesse from SI. Now, as we all know Jesse from SI was a former Powerchip employee who stole their files and crashed their server to hide his actions.

So now he is telling you that PC did -"all this horrible stuff...... blah, blah,blah and we are suppose to believe this...............................

Come on MJ, he is playing you..........................

MJ50

here's the graph of SI's custom dyno tune (in red)



their dyno is off by 10% which needed to be added to the numbers on the graph
doubt me? ask pshek and tenjinx2

Thericker

MJ, I know you're a good guy etc.. But I have know idea about your SC'r clutch replacement or it causing a problem during runs vs Mario's 335i J3. The 1st time you ran him he pulled on your stg 2 E55 by a length or 2, it is written-up on this board, then you guys met the next wknd & reported running even, after members told you how to properly dowshift before flooring it. Both times you reported your E55 was in perfect running order, Danny's E55 was the 1 running poorly w/bad IC pump.

Secondly I'm not doubting you've got a dyno that reads 522 rwhp, but I'm telling you from yrs of reading/studying the perf of these cars it's flat-out impossible to run these #'s w/current mod list, hell nearly every educated exp forum member here has told you the same info.

Dyno's can easily be tweaked higher or lower due to operator error or manipulation, there's 1 guy on here w/dyno of Bone Stock E55 that reads near identical #'s to your stage 2, do you think it's a fact freak? or possible Dyno operator error?

Do you think your e55 was putting down 480+ RWHP? when you ran (Mario's 12.50 @ 113-114mph J3 335i) E55's w/#'s your throwing around run low 11's IE 11.3x-11.4x @ 124-126 mph you would've pulled multi-bus lengths on his 335i if your E55 had anywhere close to 480 rwhp, you didn't.

Powerchip is used by all the top tuners from this board, their longevity/professionalism in this business speaks volumes over other entities....enuff said...

MJ50

renntech pulley, k&n filters, magnaflow mufflers and ECU tune is stage 2???

MB_Forever

Having met and talked to MJ in person a couple of times, I can attest to his honest and straight-forward personality, and I for one believe he is telling the truth. I do not know Jessie nor am I associated with anybody from SI (who may or may not be deceiving MJ), but I honestly do believe MJ is not here to bash or demean anybody; he is merely relaying back some of his experiences with Powerchip. Obviously, not everyone has had good experiences with Powerchip: some had bad experiences, some good, and some were neutral. In this case, Powerchip tuned MJ's car; he was disappointing with the tune, he was disappointed with it's performance, he was disappointed with the way it made his car behave; he was disappointed with its dyno results. Furthermore, he compared his Powerchip tune to SI's tune (and possibly even other tunes) using the same exact dyno machine, same operator, same conditions, and it performed very poorly. In addition, he is not very happy with the way he was treated by Powerchip or the way they handled this entire situation. In the end, MJ has experienced an overall bad episode with Powerchip and is simply not happy with their products or customer service. This is his own experience and own opinion, which he should be entitled to without so many attacks, and I hope people later appreciate what he was trying to do here.

In regards to dyno numbers, I think MJ should dyno his car at an independent dyno shop that has no affiliation or connection to neither companies (Powerchip or SI) what so ever, and then re-post the results for confirmation. This should be sufficient to put the "inflated numbers" argument to rest.

MJ50

john, what happened to ur link?
i saw it on my email notification but don't see it here?

MJ50

i can also post dyno chart with PC tune (before header mod) if people are interested...

bassn_07

Why was the dyno off by 10% and if that's the case people don't usually add it on. Point and case of how numbers get influenced. I just recently dynode in a 100 degree weather and I ended up pulling 466 rwhp on a Land and Sea dyno which proves to be 10-15% lower than a dynojet. If you add the heat factor and the 10-15% I could easily say I was running 500+ rwhp but I didn't. Just as I was saying before dyno numbers are just that and could easily be influenced by a number of factors.

Do you plan on running at Famoso this year? It would be great to meet you and see your beast run down the track. I also would like to see all the other mods besides engine stuff done to your car. It seems like you have a ton!!! .

MJ, I give you big props for posting up your experience with a supporting vendor. I think more people should do this to inform other members of what's going on, both good and bad. This will force vendors to answer and resolve possible known issues with their products. Once this starts to happen on a more frequent basis people could take that information and make a educated decision on who they would choose. From what I hear and experienced there are way too many things being kept off this site in order to protect vendors. From here on out I WILL post good or bad no matter what the outcome is. I'll also post after the fact on how things were handled, once again good or bad.

MJ50

because everyone during the dyno day (10+ cars including 3 AMGs) were off by 10%... it's even easier to calculate for those who had bone stock cars as a good comparison...

if u don't add 10%, then 412.4rwhp with RENNtech pulley, K&N filters and PowerChip tune is reasonable #?

bassn_07

During my session with LET a stock E55 dynode 335, a stage 1 380, and a stage 2 407 rwhp...all after LET's custom tune. They all posted their actual numbers they got that day.... Everyone could have easily added on a 20% increase given the current conditions and dyno used in comparison to a dynojet but they didn't. I'm just saying. THis is just my outlook on dyno numbers and how they could easily be influence for people that want to see higher numbers. Than again I'm still a newbie and have a lot to learn...who knows.

MJ50

ok, let's go by dyno #s only then without even adding 10%
my latest custom tune was 470.4rwhp
my headerless setup with PowerChip tune was 412.4rwhp
shorty headers give about 20~25rwhp??
that's still 33~35rwhp more gain with SI tune over PowerChip, wouldn't u agree?

bassn_07

In your other thread you mentioned SI putting your ECU back to stock? Was it a stock tune or a PC tune. Just looking for clarification or maybe I just misunderstood what I read...it wouldn't be the first time .

BTW...that's more what I would be looking for, the delta instead of overall hp numbers. I'm sure if you would have posted your gains over the stock/PC tune there would've been less question regarding your numbers. JMHO.

SeaCoupe

Ricker, I may be mistaken, was it you that had spoken about a car that people were mislead about?

SeaCoupe

when I looked at 7 pm there was no link, and no post edited link either.