Frozen Boost Heat Exchanger
05-16-2011, 01:29 PM
#26
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Thanks for the response. But I'm just gonna stick with a simpler bolt on solution for now. Price wise both are relatively the same.
that is all.
05-18-2011, 08:16 PM
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2006 E55 AMG --old cars -- E39 M5, 2.7tt Audi S4, E36 M3 **Ducati 996, 748
i would say its better than OEM for sure -- it looks way nicer -- larger surface area & larger core & Larger h2o capacity & better end caps aluminum not plastic
05-18-2011, 08:21 PM
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05-18-2011, 08:41 PM
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2006 E55 AMG --old cars -- E39 M5, 2.7tt Audi S4, E36 M3 **Ducati 996, 748
good question -- i was debating that -- After seeing the size of it and the lack of space -- I just ran it alone -- its already difficult enough to squeeze the oil cooler in there --- You probably could mount the OEM in front of the new HE-- but that would be tooooo ugly.
I never had shutdown problems with the OEM set-up - So, it was an easier decsion for me -- knowing it was a luxury upgrade for my setup
I never had shutdown problems with the OEM set-up - So, it was an easier decsion for me -- knowing it was a luxury upgrade for my setup
05-20-2011, 03:07 PM
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Whatever we're tuning!
Running another heat exchanger in conjunction with the OEM unit is the BEST option! PERIOD!!
Most of the options where you remove the OEM and replace it with a larger unit obstruct the amount of air getting to your oil cooler which is extremely detrimental to the efficiency of your oil cooler. Food for thought!
05-20-2011, 03:22 PM
#36
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Tony-
Running another heat exchanger in conjunction with the OEM unit is the BEST option! PERIOD!!
Most of the options where you remove the OEM and replace it with a larger unit obstruct the amount of air getting to your oil cooler which is extremely detrimental to the efficiency of your oil cooler. Food for thought!
Running another heat exchanger in conjunction with the OEM unit is the BEST option! PERIOD!!
Most of the options where you remove the OEM and replace it with a larger unit obstruct the amount of air getting to your oil cooler which is extremely detrimental to the efficiency of your oil cooler. Food for thought!
05-20-2011, 03:40 PM
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2003 W211 E55, 2003 W220 S600
OEM heat exchanger will not fit with another OEM heat exchanger. unless you cut the whole bumper and the steel support and choose not to run the mesh grill.
I think the pump has a lot to do with keeps IATs down. I have seen a meziere pump on a stock heat changer and the IATs are in control with a stock pulley on the car.
I think the pump has a lot to do with keeps IATs down. I have seen a meziere pump on a stock heat changer and the IATs are in control with a stock pulley on the car.
05-20-2011, 03:43 PM
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2006 E55 AMG --old cars -- E39 M5, 2.7tt Audi S4, E36 M3 **Ducati 996, 748
Hard to argue with Bruce's food for thought -- However, I believe I have enough air flow over the oil cooler -- + Dont we have 2 other oil coolers with fans behind the fog lights?
05-20-2011, 03:56 PM
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Whatever we're tuning!
You are welcome!
Michael-
I tried to run the PLM in tandem with the stock HE on an E55 but the end tanks on the OEM are just too wide and the PLM stuck out too far. Plus with the PLM the oil cooler is stuffed even lower in the bumper and it gets much less air than when it was in the factory position. While you do need to increase the capacity to aid in keeping the IAT's in check you also want to add increased surface area. While the surface area is limited, if you can run the fluid through 2 separate heat exchangers, you will get a larger decrease in fluid temperature than with only 1 heat exchanger. Piggybacking 2 OEM heat exchangers will increase capacity and surface area and will help in a very cost efficient way. It will also aid in recovery time.
I have a prototype heat exchanger design/size installed on a 06 SL55 with a split system that seems to be working awesome. We upgraded the pump to a Meziere WP136, mounted the heat exchanger in conjunction with the OEM unit , split the system(thanks Shardul for the overflow bottle) and it works. We hot lapped the car at E-town in a bracket event and it was within .05 on 3 back to back runs(the only cool down was the return road back to the water box). It helped keep the IAT's in check but the recovery was EPIC!!
Follow up - there are a couple of OEM H/E's floating around in the classifieds for $100-150. Since we're looking to add fluid to the system as opposed to increasing surface area, and since we know that the OEM one will fit in the grille area as some people have done running them in series, would that provide a pretty cheap way to expand the volume of our system, or am I missing something big here? I've got the newer bosch unit at the moment.
I tried to run the PLM in tandem with the stock HE on an E55 but the end tanks on the OEM are just too wide and the PLM stuck out too far. Plus with the PLM the oil cooler is stuffed even lower in the bumper and it gets much less air than when it was in the factory position. While you do need to increase the capacity to aid in keeping the IAT's in check you also want to add increased surface area. While the surface area is limited, if you can run the fluid through 2 separate heat exchangers, you will get a larger decrease in fluid temperature than with only 1 heat exchanger. Piggybacking 2 OEM heat exchangers will increase capacity and surface area and will help in a very cost efficient way. It will also aid in recovery time.
I have a prototype heat exchanger design/size installed on a 06 SL55 with a split system that seems to be working awesome. We upgraded the pump to a Meziere WP136, mounted the heat exchanger in conjunction with the OEM unit , split the system(thanks Shardul for the overflow bottle) and it works. We hot lapped the car at E-town in a bracket event and it was within .05 on 3 back to back runs(the only cool down was the return road back to the water box). It helped keep the IAT's in check but the recovery was EPIC!!
05-20-2011, 04:18 PM
#41
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OEM heat exchanger will not fit with another OEM heat exchanger. unless you cut the whole bumper and the steel support and choose not to run the mesh grill.
I think the pump has a lot to do with keeps IATs down. I have seen a meziere pump on a stock heat changer and the IATs are in control with a stock pulley on the car.
I think the pump has a lot to do with keeps IATs down. I have seen a meziere pump on a stock heat changer and the IATs are in control with a stock pulley on the car.
You are welcome!
Michael-
I tried to run the PLM in tandem with the stock HE on an E55 but the end tanks on the OEM are just too wide and the PLM stuck out too far. Plus with the PLM the oil cooler is stuffed even lower in the bumper and it gets much less air than when it was in the factory position. While you do need to increase the capacity to aid in keeping the IAT's in check you also want to add increased surface area. While the surface area is limited, if you can run the fluid through 2 separate heat exchangers, you will get a larger decrease in fluid temperature than with only 1 heat exchanger. Piggybacking 2 OEM heat exchangers will increase capacity and surface area and will help in a very cost efficient way. It will also aid in recovery time.
I have a prototype heat exchanger design/size installed on a 06 SL55 with a split system that seems to be working awesome. We upgraded the pump to a Meziere WP136, mounted the heat exchanger in conjunction with the OEM unit , split the system(thanks Shardul for the overflow bottle) and it works. We hot lapped the car at E-town in a bracket event and it was within .05 on 3 back to back runs(the only cool down was the return road back to the water box). It helped keep the IAT's in check but the recovery was EPIC!!
Michael-
I tried to run the PLM in tandem with the stock HE on an E55 but the end tanks on the OEM are just too wide and the PLM stuck out too far. Plus with the PLM the oil cooler is stuffed even lower in the bumper and it gets much less air than when it was in the factory position. While you do need to increase the capacity to aid in keeping the IAT's in check you also want to add increased surface area. While the surface area is limited, if you can run the fluid through 2 separate heat exchangers, you will get a larger decrease in fluid temperature than with only 1 heat exchanger. Piggybacking 2 OEM heat exchangers will increase capacity and surface area and will help in a very cost efficient way. It will also aid in recovery time.
I have a prototype heat exchanger design/size installed on a 06 SL55 with a split system that seems to be working awesome. We upgraded the pump to a Meziere WP136, mounted the heat exchanger in conjunction with the OEM unit , split the system(thanks Shardul for the overflow bottle) and it works. We hot lapped the car at E-town in a bracket event and it was within .05 on 3 back to back runs(the only cool down was the return road back to the water box). It helped keep the IAT's in check but the recovery was EPIC!!
Despite the differences in cost between the Cobalt h/e and some of our pricier options, it seems that we're actually pretty blessed price wise even with the expensive units.
I was at the speed shop here in town that we use for the family race car [broken CV-Shaft/CV-Axle/Half-shaft? it seems] and was talking to the owner about the external oil coolers that cup cars et al put in front of their bumpers...he quoted $1500 + install just to run a carrera oil cooler. I knew about the porsche markup beforehand, but damn
05-20-2011, 04:22 PM
#42
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Katie's been dailying my car to work every day since she moved in. All I know is that the wheels haven't been curbed yet, and the front lip is still intact. Knock on wood. She is looking at another 335 tomorrow listed for $800 more than she offered on the last one she looked at, hopefully she'll give me my car back soon. You don't have any black kidney grilles lying around to sell to me cheap do you?
Are you pulling the manifold pressure with a datalogger or do you have a boost gauge set up?
05-20-2011, 04:33 PM
#43
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Its all in the belt and pulley prep
VHT track bite on the belt, brush it on thick and rub any any excess off. Brake cleaner on the pulley groves to clean any oil off.
Belt WILL NOT SLIP.
http://www.jegs.com/i/VHT/870/SP162/10002/-1?CT=999
05-20-2011, 04:35 PM
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Whatever we're tuning!
I was at the speed shop here in town that we use for the family race car [broken CV-Shaft/CV-Axle/Half-shaft? it seems] and was talking to the owner about the external oil coolers that cup cars et al put in front of their bumpers...he quoted $1500 + install just to run a carrera oil cooler. I knew about the porsche markup beforehand, but damn
05-20-2011, 04:40 PM
#45
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Whatever we're tuning!
19 to 20 psi no slip
Its all in the belt and pulley prep
VHT track bite on the belt, brush it on thick and rub any any excess off. Brake cleaner on the pulley groves to clean any oil off.
Belt WILL NOT SLIP.
http://www.jegs.com/i/VHT/870/SP162/10002/-1?CT=999
Its all in the belt and pulley prep
VHT track bite on the belt, brush it on thick and rub any any excess off. Brake cleaner on the pulley groves to clean any oil off.
Belt WILL NOT SLIP.
http://www.jegs.com/i/VHT/870/SP162/10002/-1?CT=999
PS Should have the new polyurethane M113k motor mounts this weekend!!
05-20-2011, 05:43 PM
#46
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The price of the oil cooler is part of a bigger equation. A buddy put his 996 narrowbody gutted race car into the wall at the last club race and hasn't decided whether he's going to transplant his 3.4 into his next race car. In the event that engine becomes available, I want to know the out the door price including peripherals in order to shoe-horn it into this guy.
05-20-2011, 06:25 PM
#47
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Thank you Bruce for chiming in
I dont think their will be enough room to run the stock HE with the ZZP HE??
Also I wonder how it would clear my e63 bumper...
Would the new bosch pump do, or would say a cm90 be better for 2 HE's?
I dont think their will be enough room to run the stock HE with the ZZP HE??
Also I wonder how it would clear my e63 bumper...Would the new bosch pump do, or would say a cm90 be better for 2 HE's?
05-20-2011, 06:42 PM
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Whatever we're tuning!
The Bosch pump is fine but if you wanted an upgrade(it is a huge upgrade in quality/performance from the CM90) use a Meziere WP136. You will have to fab a bracket for the Meziere but that pump is killa! Split that system too while you are at it!
Let me know if you need any help.
05-20-2011, 10:24 PM
#49
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Bruce this one http://zzperformance.com/cobalt_ion/...=895&catid=178
Can the Bosch handle the 2 HE's? Will it fit? Lol so many questions.
Last but not least is their any significant difference in the split system? Which parts are req. for that? I keep hearing it's a pita to bleed the split system?
Again thanks Bruce!
Can the Bosch handle the 2 HE's? Will it fit? Lol so many questions.
Last but not least is their any significant difference in the split system? Which parts are req. for that? I keep hearing it's a pita to bleed the split system?
Again thanks Bruce!
05-21-2011, 04:10 AM
#50
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I decided not to split the system...
Although at this point my dilemma is whether to run the stock HE in conjunction with the ZZP one, or to run just the ZZP one...
My concern, because the ZZP HE would be in front of the oem one, how effect would cooling be on the oem he as it wouldn't be seeing much air?
Confused, Bruce? Shardul? lol
Although at this point my dilemma is whether to run the stock HE in conjunction with the ZZP one, or to run just the ZZP one...
My concern, because the ZZP HE would be in front of the oem one, how effect would cooling be on the oem he as it wouldn't be seeing much air?
Confused, Bruce? Shardul? lol
