pullejo

The XKR-S was my favorite car car during my press tour at the NYC autoshow. Thing is absolutely beastly looking and just gorgeous. Would DEFINITELY love one.

Hammer Down

what part of my post did you not understand when I said 2007??? The SLS wasn't even produced yet. MB missed the boat when they made the W211 E63 that was their shot to make that a kick a$$ car which would've made way for an incredible W212 E63.

220S

The specs for the SLS started in the fall of 2005 and was formally announced in January of 2006 at a board meeting with Zetsche and Mornhinweg. (You do realize it takes a lot of lead time to develop a new platform, and then there's the actual production; the public was able to see the car for the very first time at the 2009 International Motor Show in Frankfurt.)

The W212 is an evolution of the W211. The company carefully decides how to spec and market each platform to be careful not to cannibalize its own sales. The E Class is just an E Class, AMG or not. They have other platforms that cost a lot more and so everything needs to be positioned correctly to actually sell cars and be profitable. Selling cars is the whole point of their existence.

And so what part of Auto Manufacturing and Marketing 101 don't you understand?

diggo

'Nuff said. Hammer down is delusional

tbal

Really? I thought a modded car liek yours would dust them...

Hammer Down

I agree with what you are saying, my point is that in 2003 when the 55k started and they knew it was only going to run for 4yrs you mean ( not you personally) to tell me all they could come up with is 507hp 470ftlbs and slow shifting 7 (yet quicker than the 5speed) trans. I look at BMW and the jump they made from the M5 with 6speed 384hp V8 to the 500hp V10 with SMG which has now led to their latest M5 not sure of the exact specs but isn't it something like 560hp 500+ftlbs with DCT? Those are the types of improvements I am talking about and if you can't see what I'm talking then that's cool.

I would however love to see a 1/4 & a 1 mile race between a 2012 AMG performance packaged E63/CLS63 vs a SLS.....

Hammer Down

Thanks peanut gallery for your input. 220 & I were having a discussion.

grane

So the new s/c engines no longer Hand grenade at 50k miles?

GT-ER

I know two CTS-V with only pulleys, tune, intercoolers and intake ( stock headers and exhaust ) putting down down 550+whp and they pulled 1-1.5 cars on me. One of them ran 11.2@122mph before the larger intercooler. Stock exhaust!

Hammer Down

GT have you had a chance to run your car yet?

GT-ER

Nope, not as I sit now. I just spin spin spin so I want to get some DR's before I go.

Hammer Down

What are you going to go with 16,17 or 18?'s did you race the V from a stop or a roll?

GT-ER

I raced the V's from a 40mph roll. I also raced one that only had a tune and intake a pulled on him pretty good, but the others were beastly.

I may go with 17's to tuck in as wide of a tire are possible. It's easier to get a 17x9.5 wheel then a 16" wheel that's remotely as wide.

Hammer Down

Yeah they're pretty lethal from a roll

220S

After a car comes out, we all get to armchair quarterback the 'what ifs' and 'should haves.' I certainly do and you obviously do.
I wish a lot of things about all models and brands out there. I know precisely what you are saying, but I'm also being realistic as to how AMG/Mercedes and Daimler operates.

None of us know why a car is introduced with a certain spec. There are a multitude of reasons and not all will seem logical to us. There are regulations, safety rules, certification around the world (note that in Europe the hp and torque is always different than here in the US), costs, vendor requirements, warranty/reliability factors, production logistics, material availability, different market demands, the list goes on...

The 7-G Tronic was built with mpg and CAFE rules in mind. It was also a tranny that they needed to use across the board and not only in an AMG version. There are development and production costs involved. So they tuned it slightly with the E63 (also giving the car a full manual mode over non-AMG cars.) It's just what they did given all the factors mentioned above. And then with the W212 E63 they decided to use the MCT. But the MCT came out first in the SL63, then it went to the E Class AMG. We may very well (and I'm sure we will) see the DCT in other models soon. As far as the 6.2 motor, this was their very first in-house AMG motor. The 55 motor was developed by Mercedes and tuned (with the SC) by AMG. When the 6.2 was developed, it was done so with the idea of using it in more then one platform. It had to be tuned to fit the proper class/price category.

AMG and BMW's M division operate a lot differently. And remember that Mercedes just recently became full owners of AMG. In 1999, they had 51% share which gave them control at board meetings. It wasn't until 2005 when Aufrecht sold all the rest of his shares to Mercedes and it became solely owned by them. They are relatively new to the game. BMWs philosophy is to treat the M division as something very distinct. They don't introduce a M-Technik platform every year like their non-M cars. There is no 7 series M car (except for Alpina, which isn't an official M car although they do have a partnership with BMW. If any company has similarities, it's really AMG and Alpina. Their history and philosophy is very similar.) AMG offers an AMG version in all their cars, even SUVs. (Note that BMW is seeing this now as profitable and doing so with their SUVs.)

Mercedes is learning the "tuning division business" and is slowly but surely developing their AMG line. The AMG perfomance packages are bigger and better now (and $$ and profitable.) But: BMW M has a considerably different philosophy than Mercedes-AMG. And the M-Sport division doesn't consistently release models every year (e.g., there was no F10 M5 for sale when the new F10 platform was produced and made available.)

Mercedes has always been luxury and comfort first. And that agenda hasn't changed after acquiring AMG. Even the SLS is considered a "softer" super car than its competitors. This all may change and AMG may go in another direction if the competition dictates (i.e., if there is profit to be made.) But they (and BMW) still need to make their own signature and positioning in the auto markets. You can't "become" just like your competitor in any business, because then you've eliminated competition altogether.

And a lot depends on market demands. You can't profitably build a car that suits the tastes of a few unless you can charge appropriately (even the Veyron was not a for-profit venture but more of an active R+D project with an actual product for VAG.) The emerging markets are Brazil, India, Russia, and China (BRIC.) Those factors also dictate specs and production. We may see BMW M "softening up" and maybe AMG going a different direction, who knows. And then there's the "green" hybrid/electric direction which BMW, AMG, and Porsche are all heavily invested.

The only thing I know are Nikasil related issues with the AJ26, etc.. But that's been resolved for a while now. What issues did the 410hp SC motor have? I was interested in the new XKR for a while and checked the UK Jag forums for a while. There didn't seem to be any specific issues and not any more problems than you read about here with Mercedes. Tata says they becoming profitable with Jaguar and plan on a big billion dollar development investment coming up, so I'm guessing things will get better with Jaguar reliability but who knows.

AgSilver

The Prince Of Darkness

pearlpower

Can't knock the car as it is impressive all around. But for me, the stereotype sticks hard in that Jags are are for women and the men drive a Benz o Porsche.
I know I know

grane

There was a known timing chain issue. However, replacement of same was not mentioned or required as a maintenance item in the service schedule. If the TC was not replaced before 50k miles it tended to fail unexpectedly and with regularity with summary judgement against the engine. I do not know if J offered an update, covered lunched engines under goodwill or not I'm just glad i bought the AMG.

In spite of its foibles.

OK55

Hear, hear...!