Bingo, Ive been saying this, You don't want too much flow. The fluid needs time to cool your IC core, and that is where you want to keep the cool water and give it enough time to do what its intended to do… Many here think they need faster flowing pumps. My friend actually ran a restrictor and his IAT dropped dramatically on his setup.

 

I don't agree after seeing first hand results myself. I do believe a restrictor would help when your trying to cool the hot water back down thru the heat exchanger but in all out effort (1/4 miles, 1/2 and 1 mile racing) you shouldn't be running the water thru a heat exchanger. You should only be running ice water to the intercooler core and back to the tank. That's where having a lot of flow is needed because you want to keep the core as cold as possible the entire run. The colder the core is the colder the air exiting will be. It's been proven in drag racing for years.

 

Yes, he was running a giant heat exchanger on his street car. Not a drag beast. His pump was flowing too much it appeared and IAT were too hot. So, he put a restrictor and IATs were like 90 degrees WOT with methanol on a V8 Turbo setup.

For drag racing only thats different. Just IC reservoir and pump is all you need. Insulating the lines helps also. Especially if you have to run them under the car.

 

Are some of you cooling your IAT sensor so you don't pull timing so easily? Sure high IAT's need to be brought down......but pulling 6 degrees of timing at 115 degrees IAT is complete bull****?

 

Since you asked... 683whp and 774wtq on AWD mustang dyno with the old Kleemann supercharger and stock motor

 

Jesus Christ you people are ridiculous. Can't wait until real Enthusiasts buy these cars and start talking about real issues in a respectful manner and not measuring dicks.

Wow.

 

Unfortunately that time has come and gone. Before the cars were under $20k

 

Ah, you are inferring that only the peope with much bucks are the enthusiasts.

Its the opposite depending on platform. When 928s were cheap is when all the true development happened. Real engineers and wrenches came in. Now that prices creep back up, it's like it was in 1990 - "what color should I make my wheels"

That's okay. Pendulum swings.

 

Just an observation. This place has gone downhill recently. I'm all for innovation. Haven't seen any around here lately.

 

My bad. I forgot to say without nos?

With your tub and those figures on giggle......you should have already been in the 9's?

 

No blackbenzz, we have you. Your kinda like that dude in the mall that pretends to be a cop. Sure the mall cop is a douche. But you have to give him mad props for taking his "A" game to the next level when duty calls.

On that note......thank you blackbenzz?

 

relax, it's a forum. besides, this is the part in the thread where blackbenzz and I attempt to destroy each other. it's kinda amusing, actually. lol

 

I tend to agree with BC928. I have always been dumbfounded by the Mercedes community. Which has been my profession and hobby for almost 20 years. The strangest thing that I hear over and over is that you can not spend more money on modifications than the car is worth or whatever. Where as any other marque that is the whole point. Buy a car cheap and spend a lot of money making it fast. If the Mercedes logic held then there would not be any fast cars from the Big 3, Hondas, etc. But when you go to the race track there are a lot of 10,9,8,7 second cars that did not cost a lot to buy but a whole lot to build.
Also some how magically a 3 liter whipple blower sucks on Mercedes but every other Ford, Dodge or Chevy they are awesome.
I am building a car for a client right now that is an old w124 chassis diesel that is going to be around a 80k car when done. And people constantly ask why not start with something newer and more expensive. And my response is why. It is a cool car that is going to make a ton of power and you will not see yourself coming and going.

 

Problem is crossing the 17psi boost mark (for M113K) that is limited by the ECU.
All the Biturbo cars will have the same problem also (their boost limit is a bit higher)

 

It's a related argument. It's a number in the code. Why can't we change it yet?

Unless you are talking about overspinning the SC. But of course that is an air flow number not a boost Number. 17psi on a stock motor could be 13 on a molded motor with heads cams and headers.

 

The ecu must be fully cracked to see what makes it tick when that happens then the tuning can become so great.

 

The part about the map sensor I can see. But none the less a larger supercharger running more efficiently will make more power at the same boost level. It may not be enough to justify the cost.
Also a map sensor just provides a 5 vlt scale. The limit is most likely an excess of the voltage scale. So the fault set is say 4.5vlts and you go to 4.6vlts and that is a fault. If you put a higher scale sensor in and retune the entire fuel and ignition maps accordingly. The ecu does not know any better. Now there might be problems with this approach or it may just take a lot of time, which costs money. But there are solutions. They may not be the best answer but I find it hard to believe that it is really a brick wall. And if it really is then spend the money going after something like a M1 system from Motec. It is a big upfront cost but then sky is the limit. Or at least the hardware is he limit. And really if 5 people split the cost of the development for the M1 then it would not be terrible.

 

For the cost of the motec and R&D, might as well contact the guy who may have cracked the stock ecu or might make it worth his while

 

It is around 15k for the 1st one. Ground up development for your specific setup. Then you own the firmware for the application. The ecu is around 5-6k after that. So If you develop the firmware and split it 5 ways it would be around 7k each. Then no hurdles in the future.
Besides once you guys start making a bit more power you are going to have to dump some real money at the driveline to support it. By my math though at say even a bit more on the ecu plus the 3l supercharger and a built block you are in the neighborhood of 20-25k for making some real serious power. But like I said get ready to spend another 10k to 15k put it to the ground reliably. Axles will break, driveshaft will snap, differential will fail and the transmission will need to be built. All the same problems the SRT8 guys had. We put in Ford 9" rear ends with 2500 dollar axles and 1-2k driveshafts. And about 3500-4000 for a transmission. Add a bit to those numbers due to low volume.

 

So contact Oliver and see if he's willing to crack the stock ecu if he hasn't already. 25k is a good amount I would guess.

 

This is not really something I am going to do. I have other interests. And they cost just as much, if not more. My point is that as a community that these are not impossible tasks and it just takes investment. And that people in other marques spend the money and in general not in the Mercedes community.

 

Of course it takes money lol
Cars have become cheaper now so lots more will be doing nos as well

 

I've already had all this done so people should be able to copy and save some money (The diff shouldn't break until much higher power levels). Only thing I'm waiting on is cams and tuning to make even more power. I'm not one of these guys that just runs his mouth. I can only run 17PSI although a MAP clamp would solve that. My pulley setup is to run over 20PSI, I'm just making extra heat for no reason at this point. I have other cars and don't want to spend any more money on this one to go standalone

 

blackbenz,
I think that you are one of the few that is trying new things and spending money appropriately to get there. There are always exceptions. Like the customer I have right now that I am building a crazy diesel for.
Your diff will give up the ghost though at some point. The SRT8s start having problems around 7-800whp. Now that Quaife has updated the lsd and wavetrac is in the game that may be less of a problem. Your car is also a tad bit lighter than an E55 and that can make a huge difference. It is all about how much weight you are trying to get to move from a stop. But a few things are different in that people are not running higher gears which makes the r/p stronger and reduces half axle load.

 

lol Ahmad yeah right go read you own post from the past and you also say passing 17 psi is problem. you would go past 17 psi dont make excuses about heat etc etc.