C32owner

If you run your car on let's say 93 octane fuel and add additives or these octane boosters to let's say 96 or 97 octane does the ecu compensate automatically to the higher octane and you gain straight away (well adapts after some miles first) or does one have to be retuned to gain from the higher octane fuel? Also if you don't retune the car as you only want to run octane booster on let's say track days then what is the highest octane rating one can go before needing to get a new tune?
Asking as from the research I have dug up is guys running 100octane race fuel always talk about switching maps...

ajm55

Craig, my 2 cents worth:

Our 95 octane is apparently the equivalent of 91 octane in the US - real crappy fuel. So to get anywhere close to 100 octane you'd probably need as much octane booster as fuel

My logs show that with a strong enough fuel / octane booster ratio, my ECU will pull no timing or will pull less timing than would be the case without octane booster. You don't need a re-tune for your purposes - unless your looking to run a mixture that yields an effective (US standard) 100 octane. Then you'd want (but would not necessarily need) a tune that runs more aggressive timing than your current tune so that you can extract the full benefit of the added octane.

compaddict

iTrader: (1)

Octane boost in a can is snake oil.

C32owner

Thanks Anthony, appreciate it.. Need to come over and compare my logs with your setup.. I don't quite understand my timing as it seems all over the place throughout the rev range. Have done a ton of data logs now staying in 3rd gear from 60-200 and some interesting stuff is seen.. Would love to compare to your tune.
Would like to try this octane booster to prevent timing being pulled and make our engines run stronger with the higher "normal" octane the rest of the world runs.. Should help a bit in the power as well.

Blue Blitz

Hi guys

Fellow South African based in Cape Town.

I did a dyno run with NF ultra mixed to the strongest concentration and actually lost power compared to a previous run on same dyno with a weaker NF mix.

So it seems that cars do not like a too aggressive Octane level for some reason.

Chhers

ajm55

Small collection of South Africans here

Blue Blitz, hard to understand but interesting to know. On my car, higher octane definitely reduces the degree to which timing is pulled (which makes sense as there is less detonation) - and that should translate into more power. Craig, let me know when you're in the area so that we can hook up

C32owner

Awesome thanks Anthony, will do. Blueblitz howsit man. Any idea at what octane level you started to loose power or what you estimate your mix was at?

Blue Blitz

Hi again

Mix according to the NF Ultra ratio should have been 104 RON.

Tuners all say that the M113K responds well to extra octane but there might be a limit say 100 RON where it is optimum.

On my Volvo we had the same issue with a too aggresive Octane booster mix giving less output as compared to a milder mix.

Blue Blitz

Dyno printout from last dyno on pump fuel -Flywheel figures



DYNO printout on pump fuel Flywheel figures

C32owner

Interesting hells I think 104Ron is rather crazy higher and to be expected to loose... What was your dunno numbers after adding nf ultra to let's say 98Ron if you have anything like that to see the gains from your pump fuel only run

Blue Blitz

Will have to dig around for the dyno printout.
Figures iirc was 372Kw 720Nm so quite a bit higher on kw's and a bit up on torque taking into account the timing adjustment of the ECU.

C32owner

Cool thanks man. BTW are you modded at all, or was that stock numbers?

Blue Blitz

Car has secondary cat delete,custom exhaust back boxes and tune from a tuner here in Cape Town.
Other than that she is stock.I am awaiting my TNT branches to be completed and delivered for fitment soon then i wana see what power we can get.
Hoping to get close to the 400kw mark with octane booster but we will see

C32owner

Good stuff man! Looking forward to your results bud. Hope you get what you after

Blue Blitz

I hope so too.......otherwise just get a E63 Biturbo and make POWWWWEERR

Blue Blitz

Quick question on the CLS55 what sort of power are you making?I see 409WHp/696nm which equates to about 304wkw after all your mods if my maths is correct.
Did the headers make a huge difference in power output or was the Pulley upgrade the big difference?

C32owner

Hard to say what the headers did as I did an upper pulley upgrade at the same time. I went from 363whp to 409whp with new exhaust and upgrading from 84mm upper to the 77mm and then obviously a retune.. Sucks being at altitude man!

Oh ya, when your exhaust arrives, do your engine mounts at the same time! I reckon the exhaust though will make a bigger difference than the pulley to answer your previous question.

Blue Blitz

Altitude power loss does affect the cars but not to the same extent as NA due to the charger.Who did the tune for you?Where can i get the engine mounts for reasonable prices or should i just get them remade in Polyurethane.

C32owner

Motronix did the tune. Not sure if there is aftermarket mounts available... So I guess the stealership themselves.

Blue Blitz

Cool bud.Any guestimates on cost of these mounts?

C32owner

Flip don't recall exact amounts man.. If I had to guess think it was around R2500 for the set.

Max.H

Yes it adapts. Ive used it and I can feel the difference. Octane booster with MMT seems to work well. VP octane booster works very well. Ive seen boosted cars pickup a lot of power just by switching to fuels no changes to the map.

compaddict

iTrader: (1)

That's like UP to .80 point of octane rating for ten gallons. Thaz a lot of money for very little gain.

EREBUS

Agreed, but there are a few additives you can add that ACTUALLY raises your octane. Many can be bought at your local hardware store or paint supply store. (this was pulled from a dsm forum that has been shared for over a decade. Hence the prices being a little lower than they are today)



Formula #1 - Toulene
R+M/2.........114
Cost...........$2.50/gal
Mixtures with 92 Octane Premium
10%...........94.2 Octane
20%...........96.4 Octane
30%...........98.6 Octane
Notes: Common ingredient in Octane Boosters in a can. 12-16 ounces will
only raise octane 2-3 *points*, i.e. from 92 to 92.3. Often costs $3-5
for 12-16 ounces, when it can be purchased for less than $3/gal at
chemical supply houses or paint stores.


Formula #2 - Xylene
R+M/2.........117
Cost...........$2.75/gal
Mixtures with 92 Octane Premium
10%...........94.5 Octane
20%...........97.0 Octane
30%...........99.5 Octane
Notes: Similar to Toulene. 12-16 ounces will only raise octane 2-3
*points*, i.e. from 92 to 92.3. Usually mixed with Toulene and
advertised as *race formula*.


Formula #3 - Methyl-tertiary-butyl-ether (MTBE)
R+M/2.........118
Cost...........$3.50/gal
Mixtures with 92 Octane Premium
10%...........94.6 Octane
20%...........97.2 Octane
30%...........99.8 Octane
Notes: Oxygenate. Very common in octane booster products. Has lower BTU
content than toulene or xylene, but oxygenate effect makes the gasoline
burn better and produce more energy.


Formula #4 - Methanol or Ethanol
R+M/2.........101
Cost...........$0.60 - $1.75/gal
Mixtures with 92 Octane Premium
10%...........94.3 Octane (Methanol)
10%...........94.7 Octane (Ethanol)
20%...........Not Recommended
Notes: Methanol is wood alcohol. Ethanol is grain alcohol and found in
Gasohol in 10% ratios. Both alcohols are mildly corrosive and will eat
gas tank linings, rubber and aluminum if used in excessive ratios. Main
ingredient in "Gas Dryers", combine with water.


Formula #5 -
Isopropyl Alcohol and Tertiary Butyl Alcohol
R+M/2.........101
Cost...........$0.60-$1.50/gal
Mixtures with 92 Octane Premium
10%...........94.5 Octane
20%...........Not Recommended
30%...........Not Recommended
Notes: Similar to Methanol/Ethanol. Isopropyl Alcohol is simply rubbing
alcohol. Sample Mixture To make your own octane booster, it is easiest
to make up a large batch, and then bottle it up in "dosage-size" uses.


Below is the basic formula of one of the popular octane booster products.
To make eight 16 ounce bottles (128 oz = 1 gal):
100 oz of toulene for octane boost
25 oz of mineral spirits (cleaning agent)
3 oz of transmission fluid (lubricating agent)
This product is advertised as "octane booster with cleaning agent *and*
lubricating agent!". Diesel fuel or kerosene can be substituted for
mineral spirits and light turbine oil can be substituted for
transmission fluid. Color can be added with petroleum dyes.


I run a quart of pure Xylene every full tank to remove farm truck smell from running cat-less and add a little safety from detonation

compaddict

iTrader: (1)

Been there, done that.
Used Q16 for the longest time with great results, could really stretch out high RPM advance.
Then E85 came around in USA. Same results one tenth the cost.