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Just picked up a 2003 E55 99k on it, needed some work so I got it relatively cheap. I'm extremely able mechanically having owned turbo 03-04 cobras and large turbo audis. The car had a misfire from the get go, ran a scan and confirmed cyl 1,3 and 5 having misfires with cylinder 1 having low circuit input to the injector. I decided to just change the plugs and wires as there were multiple with melted wire loom and excessive oil from what I suspect to be an oil leak at the valve covers. The plugs that were removed were Bosch F8DPER which weren't on any cross reference list for the m113k motors. I bought the bosch plug wires and NGK 2309 plugs and put them all in. After start up and a few seconds the idle came down and almost stalled. Turned the car off and started in a couple more times for about 15 seconds each. On the last start up I immediately heard a loud tap in the upper end of the motor. The car has headers and resonator deletes so it's pretty loud and I didn't hear the tapping from the beginning. A couple plugs are missing the ground strap completely and about half are smashed into the electrode. Not sure what the problem with these plugs would be seeing that several use them without issue, I'm leaning toward a previous owner having some other heads put on or these heads having been milled to a point that the standard plug for this application no longer works.
It is obvious that the NGK's are about 1/2" longer than the Bosch that you had before. The impressive dent in each one of them confirms it and the banging that you heard was the pistons hitting the plugs? I doubt that the heads have been milled to the tune of 1/2". You will have to check the heads part numbers to see if they are what they should be. Maybe the early M113 versions were different. I would use an endoscope snake camera to check the damage on the pistons. Worst case, the engine is done.
The correct plug for a 2003-2006 E55 engine is a Bosch FR6MPP332; that cross-references to an NGK 3588 or ILFR6A.
NGK 2309s have a 26.5mm reach.
Bosch FR6MPP332 have a 26.5mm reach.
The NGK 2309s should not have contacted the pistons.
Bosch F8DPER have a reach of 16mm. The correct plugs for a '99 to '02 E55 engine would be a Bosch FR8DPP33 with a reach of 16mm.
I would hazard a guess that your engine is not a 2003 but could possibly be a '99 to '02 E55 transplant.
'99 E55 has a 10.5:1 compression ratio. The '03 has a 9.0:1 compression ratio. Heads, pistons, and intakes are significantly different as you discovered.
Pull the serial number off the engine and you'll have your answer. Good luck on this one.
Edit: This is gonna sound stupid but are sure you have a '03 W211 and not a '02 W210? This has me scratching my head.
The correct plug for a 2003-2006 E55 engine is a Bosch FR6MPP332; that cross-references to an NGK 3588 or ILFR6A.
NGK 2309s have a 26.5mm reach.
Bosch FR6MPP332 have a 26.5mm reach.
The NGK 2309s should not have contacted the pistons.
Bosch F8DPER have a reach of 16mm. The correct plugs for a '99 to '02 E55 engine would be a Bosch FR8DPP33 with a reach of 16mm.
I would hazard a guess that your engine is not a 2003 but could possibly be a '99 to '02 E55 transplant.
'99 E55 has a 10.5:1 compression ratio. The '03 has a 9.0:1 compression ratio. Heads, pistons, and intakes are significantly different as you discovered.
Pull the serial number off the engine and you'll have your answer. Good luck on this one.
Edit: This is gonna sound stupid but are sure you have a '03 W211 and not a '02 W210? This has me scratching my head.
It's absolutely a 2003 E55 m113k, has an upper pulley, shorty headers, full exhaust, trunk mount 5 gallon tank and johnson ic pump. This has me scratching my head as well because short of some unknown heads being on the car this shouldn't have been an issue with the number of people using these plugs successfully. I used my camera to verify there are no pieces in the cylinders, hopefully nothing is stuck in a valve or damaged one and the debris exited already.
If you post your VIN I can look up the serial number of the original engine installed in the car. You can then check that number against the number on the engine. I'm not sure where the serial number is located; might be on the back of the engine or stamped onto the engine block above one of the motor mounts.
Edit 2: Bosch FR8DPP33 with a reach of 16mm are also used in a 2003 E500.
EDIT: Mods, can one of you move this over to the W211 AMG section?
If you post your VIN I can look up the serial number of the original engine installed in the car. You can then check that number against the number on the engine. I'm not sure where the serial number is located; might be on the back of the engine or stamped onto the engine block above one of the motor mounts.
Edit 2: Bosch FR8DPP33 with a reach of 16mm are also used in a 2003 E500.
EDIT: Mods, can one of you move this over to the W211 AMG section?
i recommend ordering a USB micro camera. they're like 12 dollars online. Look inside and confirm the piston type and how much damage has been done.
also you'll need to inspect that the block hasn't been changed. from the looks of it all, your piston dome came into direct contact with the spark plugs. boosted engines usually have a dish and not a domed piston.
i recommend ordering a USB micro camera. they're like 12 dollars online. Look inside and confirm the piston type and how much damage has been done.
also you'll need to inspect that the block hasn't been changed. from the looks of it all, your piston dome came into direct contact with the spark plugs. boosted engines usually have a dish and not a domed piston.
pistons have little to no "visible" damage as I have a couple of inspection cameras. I suspect the angle and length of the plug came into contact with the intake valves. I'm going to order the shorter plugs and hope for the best at this point. I'm sure the combustion chambers will have some damage but hopefully none to the valves.
Data card with original engine and transmission serial numbers attached. Yours was delivered 25 March 2003 so you have an early one.
Looking at your fender, the badging is different from later years. I've only seen the "V8 Kompressor" badges, not the "5.4" badge.
Hope this helps.
Thanks for the info. Yeah that's some aftermarket badge. This car was owned by another member on here years ago prodigymb. It seems since he owned it, this car has been through the ringer. Hoping to restore it to a reliable, fun car again.
Picture of M113K heads. No way the exhaust valve can touch the plugs
Meant Intake valves sorry I'm positive these aren't m113k heads, the pistons are dished in the same shape as oem m113k pistons so I'm assuming there was some head damage at some point and the heads were swapped for what's on there. The damage to the plugs I don't think came from piston contact, I'm hoping to turn the motor over and blow out whatever is left in the cylinders.
I'm hoping to turn the motor over and blow out whatever is left in the cylinders.
that sucks - I think I would be a bit more cautious and rig up a suction hose on a shop vac and a air nozzle on a compressor and clean them out that way - one little piece of a spark plug can ruin your day
Thanks for the info. Yeah that's some aftermarket badge. This car was owned by another member on here years ago prodigymb. It seems since he owned it, this car has been through the ringer. Hoping to restore it to a reliable, fun car again.
No wonder, he's on 6speedonline with the same screen name. You can pm him to find out
that sucks - I think I would be a bit more cautious and rig up a suction hose on a shop vac and a air nozzle on a compressor and clean them out that way - one little piece of a spark plug can ruin your day
good luck
I couldn't visually find any substantial pieces, hopefully got lucky and any large pieces exited without any damage.
I couldn't visually find any substantial pieces, hopefully got lucky and any large pieces exited without any damage.
I wouldn't be comfortable running the engine until the heads have been pulled to make sure that there's nothing in there and no damage that you can't see with the scope.
It's a pain in the ***, but at least you can be sure there's no pieces in there then.
I wouldn't be comfortable running the engine until the heads have been pulled to make sure that there's nothing in there and no damage that you can't see with the scope.
It's a pain in the ***, but at least you can be sure there's no pieces in there then.
It's not a daily and more of a toy, it was going to get an e85 tune and a good amount of spray for fun, not to mention there are a large amount of m113k engines in florida for sale so I may pick up a couple seeing how cheap they are ($1500-2000). I ran my single turbo cobra with combustion chamber damage for about 30k miles making 800+whp and it ran completely fine. If there is valve damage it'll pop up as soon as it gets into boost.
non m113k heads...that is a surprise. good luck. hopefully the engine is still usable. I am no expert on the m113k but I'd think you'd want to swap on the correct years at some point.
It's not a daily and more of a toy, it was going to get an e85 tune and a good amount of spray for fun, not to mention there are a large amount of m113k engines in florida for sale so I may pick up a couple seeing how cheap they are ($1500-2000). I ran my single turbo cobra with combustion chamber damage for about 30k miles making 800+whp and it ran completely fine. If there is valve damage it'll pop up as soon as it gets into boost.
Like Strigoi said pull the heads. I wouldn't sleep to good with that much plug damage. It takes a lot to do that to a spark plug in the thread area.
Like you said if there is damage it will "pop up" right away but.... that could be a catastrophic mess under hard boost.
Then again if you are really confident with your camera findings than try it.
$1'500 for an engine ...tha'ts a great deal/builder for that money !!
09-14-2017, 09:59 AM
I'm positive these aren't m113k heads, the pistons are dished in the same shape as oem m113k pistons so I'm assuming there was some head damage at some point and the heads were swapped for what's on there. The damage to the plugs I don't think came from piston contact, I'm hoping to turn the motor over and blow out whatever is left in the cylinders.
