2007 E63 - A new Intake manifold in my future?
02-08-2018, 11:49 AM
#1
Newbie
Thread Starter
2007 E63 - A new Intake manifold in my future?
My first post - All help appreciated.
Check engine light came on two days ago. Code was - P0171 System too lean bank 1. I am capable of routine maintenance, but this sounded like probably out of my league. Took the car to a local independent that I generally trust. They explained that I needed a new intake manifold for $3.5k. They described some kind of plastic valves that are inside the manifold that open under hard acceleration that were worn and malfunctioning (hope this is descriptive enough). They indicated that for some cars, there are kits to replace these valves, but no such luck with my E63. This sounds reasonable enough, but before plunking down the big bucks . . .Questions: 1 - Is this something that could be confidently diagnosed without visual inspection? They only charged me 1 hour of labor so I suspect that their diagnosis was by other means. I know there are a number of other faults that could cause this CEL code (leaking gaskets, etc.) 2- Is this a common wear related problem (car has about 100k mostly gentle miles). 3- If the fault is with these valves, is there an alternative to replacing the intake manifold? Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
Check engine light came on two days ago. Code was - P0171 System too lean bank 1. I am capable of routine maintenance, but this sounded like probably out of my league. Took the car to a local independent that I generally trust. They explained that I needed a new intake manifold for $3.5k. They described some kind of plastic valves that are inside the manifold that open under hard acceleration that were worn and malfunctioning (hope this is descriptive enough). They indicated that for some cars, there are kits to replace these valves, but no such luck with my E63. This sounds reasonable enough, but before plunking down the big bucks . . .Questions: 1 - Is this something that could be confidently diagnosed without visual inspection? They only charged me 1 hour of labor so I suspect that their diagnosis was by other means. I know there are a number of other faults that could cause this CEL code (leaking gaskets, etc.) 2- Is this a common wear related problem (car has about 100k mostly gentle miles). 3- If the fault is with these valves, is there an alternative to replacing the intake manifold? Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
02-08-2018, 02:40 PM
#2
MBWorld Fanatic!
I find that needing a new intake manifold the costs $3.5K suspicious. I would definitely get a second opinion, that's my best advice. If you were in my neck of the woods, I would send you to my guys at Benz Elite Automotive.
02-08-2018, 02:47 PM
#3
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Richmond, CA
Posts: 3,250
Received 255 Likes
on
233 Posts
2001 E320 Wagon, 2006 LBZ Silverado, 2007 E63 (sold), 2001 E55 (sold)
I'm not surprised by the price seeing how a new manifold costs $2,500 from AutoHausAZ. You don't say what your shop charges per hour so the price may be pretty reasonable.
02-08-2018, 11:10 PM
#7
Junior Member
Before I jumped into a new intake manifold, I would look a little more basic. If you have or have access to a decent scan tool, look at the freeze frame data for that code. P0171 is B1 lean. See what the engine RPM was when the code set. If at or near idle it is very possible it is a vacuum leak. If one of the intake runner links break, it changes the route of the intake air (long instead of short, short instead of long or somewhere in between), put does not allow un-metered air to enter so the mixture shouldn't be affected. There are codes for the links failing but typically a position sensor code. You can also look at the fuel trims. Additive (Short term on a generic tool) is fuel added (+%) or fuel subtracted (-%) across all engine speeds. Multiplicative (Long term on a generic tool) is fuel added (+%) or fuel subtracted (-%) at all speeds above idle. Vacuum leaks have the greatest affect on additive, less so on multiplicative. Smoke testing is a good method to find vacuum leaks. Also, that engine has Left (B2) and Right (B1) MAF sensors. If your B1 additive and multiplicative are both close to +5 or more and the B2 are both near zero (which is normal/preferred) I would consider a MAF sensor.
Trending Topics
02-09-2018, 12:33 AM
#8
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: MA
Posts: 6,080
Received 1,467 Likes
on
1,148 Posts
2008 E350 4Matic, 2011 E350 4matic
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mercedes-E6...t/202099808966
02-09-2018, 05:54 AM
#9
I agree with others about getting a decent scan tool for MB (about $100 or so) and look at other parameters like MAF reading, adaptation values, etc, and see if you can do the job yourself.
If not to save money then for the love of your car?
The trade in value for our cars, 2007 E63s, is about $10k or so (+/- a few thousand depending mileage).
One could try to sell it private but it may prove to be difficult (I see the same cars on sale for a LONG time).
With that said, $3500 repair does not seem like a sound financial decision (not that buying/keeping 2007 E63 out of warranty is a good one either).
I love my 2007 E63 but the first sign of very expensive repair that I cannot do myself, I will unload it.
Also I highly recommend air oil separator for our cars (it will prob reduce chance of getting intake related issues).
Once you take the intake off, you will know why.
If not to save money then for the love of your car?
The trade in value for our cars, 2007 E63s, is about $10k or so (+/- a few thousand depending mileage).
One could try to sell it private but it may prove to be difficult (I see the same cars on sale for a LONG time).
With that said, $3500 repair does not seem like a sound financial decision (not that buying/keeping 2007 E63 out of warranty is a good one either).
I love my 2007 E63 but the first sign of very expensive repair that I cannot do myself, I will unload it.
Also I highly recommend air oil separator for our cars (it will prob reduce chance of getting intake related issues).
Once you take the intake off, you will know why.
02-09-2018, 10:49 AM
#10
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: MA
Posts: 6,080
Received 1,467 Likes
on
1,148 Posts
2008 E350 4Matic, 2011 E350 4matic
I agree with others about getting a decent scan tool for MB (about $100 or so) and look at other parameters like MAF reading, adaptation values, etc, and see if you can do the job yourself.
If not to save money then for the love of your car?
The trade in value for our cars, 2007 E63s, is about $10k or so (+/- a few thousand depending mileage).
One could try to sell it private but it may prove to be difficult (I see the same cars on sale for a LONG time).
With that said, $3500 repair does not seem like a sound financial decision (not that buying/keeping 2007 E63 out of warranty is a good one either).
I love my 2007 E63 but the first sign of very expensive repair that I cannot do myself, I will unload it.
Also I highly recommend air oil separator for our cars (it will prob reduce chance of getting intake related issues).
Once you take the intake off, you will know why.
If not to save money then for the love of your car?
The trade in value for our cars, 2007 E63s, is about $10k or so (+/- a few thousand depending mileage).
One could try to sell it private but it may prove to be difficult (I see the same cars on sale for a LONG time).
With that said, $3500 repair does not seem like a sound financial decision (not that buying/keeping 2007 E63 out of warranty is a good one either).
I love my 2007 E63 but the first sign of very expensive repair that I cannot do myself, I will unload it.
Also I highly recommend air oil separator for our cars (it will prob reduce chance of getting intake related issues).
Once you take the intake off, you will know why.
02-09-2018, 11:58 AM
#11
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Richmond, CA
Posts: 3,250
Received 255 Likes
on
233 Posts
2001 E320 Wagon, 2006 LBZ Silverado, 2007 E63 (sold), 2001 E55 (sold)
I don't think trading in is a smart idea for older vehicles either.
02-09-2018, 01:57 PM
#12
MBWorld Fanatic!
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: MA
Posts: 6,080
Received 1,467 Likes
on
1,148 Posts
2008 E350 4Matic, 2011 E350 4matic
I'd rather take a long time to sell one of these than basically give it away for $10k. The cheapest one that is not a salvage title on my local CL is $17k with the most expensive being $24k. The one salvage car they're still asking $12.5.
I don't think trading in is a smart idea for older vehicles either.
I don't think trading in is a smart idea for older vehicles either.
As for taking a long time, the problem with that is that these cars depreciate by the month, the longer it takes, the more value the car loses. So trying to net top dollar, nets you less.
02-16-2019, 10:50 AM
#13
RMT Intake Manifold!!!
You can send in the old one and get it rebuilt, it's on ebay for $577.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mercedes-E6...t/202099808966
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mercedes-E6...t/202099808966
2/16/2019
I rebuilt my engine last year and one of the first things I did was have the Intake Manifold Rebuilt by "Rebuild Master Tech" in Pomano Beach, Fl. They did a beautiful job and included their custom made beefy Intake Plenum which separates the Upper/lower chambers. It is also what both Throttle Bodies attach to. On mine, when I went to pick it up, they showed me what they actually replaced and it was stricken with holes especially in the channel where the insulated wires run governing the Throttle. I was lucky they had another top shell as the posts which hold down the air line were disintegrated!! I was so impressed with those guys I ended up bringing in both my front Airmatic shocks (one OEM was leaking and the other was an Arnott without Active Air) and bought two of their remaned Air Front Struts for less than the cost of one Arnott.
The following 2 users liked this post by E63007:
almostordinary (03-12-2020),
C3Duece (02-17-2019)
03-12-2020, 08:58 AM
#14
Ulysses A
My first post - All help appreciated.
Check engine light came on two days ago. Code was - P0171 System too lean bank 1. I am capable of routine maintenance, but this sounded like probably out of my league. Took the car to a local independent that I generally trust. They explained that I needed a new intake manifold for $3.5k. They described some kind of plastic valves that are inside the manifold that open under hard acceleration that were worn and malfunctioning (hope this is descriptive enough). They indicated that for some cars, there are kits to replace these valves, but no such luck with my E63. This sounds reasonable enough, but before plunking down the big bucks . . .Questions: 1 - Is this something that could be confidently diagnosed without visual inspection? They only charged me 1 hour of labor so I suspect that their diagnosis was by other means. I know there are a number of other faults that could cause this CEL code (leaking gaskets, etc.) 2- Is this a common wear related problem (car has about 100k mostly gentle miles). 3- If the fault is with these valves, is there an alternative to replacing the intake manifold? Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
Check engine light came on two days ago. Code was - P0171 System too lean bank 1. I am capable of routine maintenance, but this sounded like probably out of my league. Took the car to a local independent that I generally trust. They explained that I needed a new intake manifold for $3.5k. They described some kind of plastic valves that are inside the manifold that open under hard acceleration that were worn and malfunctioning (hope this is descriptive enough). They indicated that for some cars, there are kits to replace these valves, but no such luck with my E63. This sounds reasonable enough, but before plunking down the big bucks . . .Questions: 1 - Is this something that could be confidently diagnosed without visual inspection? They only charged me 1 hour of labor so I suspect that their diagnosis was by other means. I know there are a number of other faults that could cause this CEL code (leaking gaskets, etc.) 2- Is this a common wear related problem (car has about 100k mostly gentle miles). 3- If the fault is with these valves, is there an alternative to replacing the intake manifold? Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
Try capping off your oil dip stick that's what I did and the code was gone
03-12-2020, 09:11 AM
#15
Ulysses A
My first post - All help appreciated.
Check engine light came on two days ago. Code was - P0171 System too lean bank 1. I am capable of routine maintenance, but this sounded like probably out of my league. Took the car to a local independent that I generally trust. They explained that I needed a new intake manifold for $3.5k. They described some kind of plastic valves that are inside the manifold that open under hard acceleration that were worn and malfunctioning (hope this is descriptive enough). They indicated that for some cars, there are kits to replace these valves, but no such luck with my E63. This sounds reasonable enough, but before plunking down the big bucks . . .Questions: 1 - Is this something that could be confidently diagnosed without visual inspection? They only charged me 1 hour of labor so I suspect that their diagnosis was by other means. I know there are a number of other faults that could cause this CEL code (leaking gaskets, etc.) 2- Is this a common wear related problem (car has about 100k mostly gentle miles). 3- If the fault is with these valves, is there an alternative to replacing the intake manifold? Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
Check engine light came on two days ago. Code was - P0171 System too lean bank 1. I am capable of routine maintenance, but this sounded like probably out of my league. Took the car to a local independent that I generally trust. They explained that I needed a new intake manifold for $3.5k. They described some kind of plastic valves that are inside the manifold that open under hard acceleration that were worn and malfunctioning (hope this is descriptive enough). They indicated that for some cars, there are kits to replace these valves, but no such luck with my E63. This sounds reasonable enough, but before plunking down the big bucks . . .Questions: 1 - Is this something that could be confidently diagnosed without visual inspection? They only charged me 1 hour of labor so I suspect that their diagnosis was by other means. I know there are a number of other faults that could cause this CEL code (leaking gaskets, etc.) 2- Is this a common wear related problem (car has about 100k mostly gentle miles). 3- If the fault is with these valves, is there an alternative to replacing the intake manifold? Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
Try capping off your oil dip stick that's what I did and the code was gone
03-12-2020, 01:53 PM
#16
Super Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: LA
Posts: 749
Received 305 Likes
on
167 Posts
1987 Porsche 911. 2008 G55
Well i can definitely empathize with you!
I recently went to do a pretty routine job of replacing my PCV Valve in the rear of the intake manifold. While I was there I decided to replace everything, hoses, gaskets, bolts, etc.
When taking out the intake manifold I could hear something rattling around inside. I took it too a few local LA shops, one was a total disgrace, and the other said buy a new one.
I reached out to RMT and they were amazing. I sent them my intake manifold with rush shipping there and back.
I had a newly rebuilt intake manifold with a new metal center mounting plate and all external sensors replaced.
https://rebuildmastertech.com/merced...et-1561400801/
I would definitely go this route instead of spending 3k on a new unit with plastic internals.
The only thing I was initially miffed at is they spray painted the intake manifold, mine was pristine, but the thing looks new and has all new components.
I've put 250 miles on mine since the rebuild and it's been flawless.
I recently went to do a pretty routine job of replacing my PCV Valve in the rear of the intake manifold. While I was there I decided to replace everything, hoses, gaskets, bolts, etc.
When taking out the intake manifold I could hear something rattling around inside. I took it too a few local LA shops, one was a total disgrace, and the other said buy a new one.
I reached out to RMT and they were amazing. I sent them my intake manifold with rush shipping there and back.
I had a newly rebuilt intake manifold with a new metal center mounting plate and all external sensors replaced.
https://rebuildmastertech.com/merced...et-1561400801/
I would definitely go this route instead of spending 3k on a new unit with plastic internals.
The only thing I was initially miffed at is they spray painted the intake manifold, mine was pristine, but the thing looks new and has all new components.
I've put 250 miles on mine since the rebuild and it's been flawless.
03-12-2020, 01:57 PM
#17
Super Member
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: LA
Posts: 749
Received 305 Likes
on
167 Posts
1987 Porsche 911. 2008 G55
2/16/2019
I rebuilt my engine last year and one of the first things I did was have the Intake Manifold Rebuilt by "Rebuild Master Tech" in Pomano Beach, Fl. They did a beautiful job and included their custom made beefy Intake Plenum which separates the Upper/lower chambers. It is also what both Throttle Bodies attach to. On mine, when I went to pick it up, they showed me what they actually replaced and it was stricken with holes especially in the channel where the insulated wires run governing the Throttle. I was lucky they had another top shell as the posts which hold down the air line were disintegrated!! I was so impressed with those guys I ended up bringing in both my front Airmatic shocks (one OEM was leaking and the other was an Arnott without Active Air) and bought two of their remaned Air Front Struts for less than the cost of one Arnott.
How have the rebuilt units been so far? If I go Bilstein with FCP Euro I get the lifetime warranty, but if it's 1/3 the cost rebuilt it may be worth it if they are a good solution.
03-13-2020, 08:55 AM
#19
Sorry to hi-jack, seems that you and I had great results wth RMT with our Intakes... I just posted about getting new suspension, and was considering Arnott over the Bilsteins. https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...-bilstein.html
How have the rebuilt units been so far? If I go Bilstein with FCP Euro I get the lifetime warranty, but if it's 1/3 the cost rebuilt it may be worth it if they are a good solution.
How have the rebuilt units been so far? If I go Bilstein with FCP Euro I get the lifetime warranty, but if it's 1/3 the cost rebuilt it may be worth it if they are a good solution.
I am very pleased with my RMT Intake as well as the 2 front Strut AirSpring Shocks I bought from them. At speed on the highway, I can definitely feel the difference between the Shock Settings "0" "1" "2" where "0" is most plush, "1" is a bit more responsive but very subtle, and "2" is so sensitive (i.e.-stiffer!) where you feel every little bump in the road!
Ulysses A, after I had my Intake rebuilt by RMT, although that solved my high idle speed issue I had from day 1, I still was registering similar codes as you suggesting "System too lean Bank 1 & 2". What ended up being the culprit was my not having replaced the PCV Valve when I added a Oil Vapour Catch Can upon installation of the Intake Manifold, bear in mind this was after I had both Heads rebuilt where it was determined that 8 of 16 Intake Valves were bent! Nevertheless, I was getting brief moments of idle hiking up just tad and then immediately returning to normal. It had no effect on driving at speed, but was "un-healthy" so I went ahead and replaced the PCV at the same time I swapped out to a better Catch Can and that symptom was resolved!! She purrs like a dragon now!!!
Last edited by E63007; 03-13-2020 at 09:16 AM.
