tlambert

That’s for sure. The trans shift is amazing in sport

superswiss

I don't quite get the issue with the "fake" exhaust tips. Many performance cars have "fake" exhaust tips even if they are welded to the pipes like older AMGs. They are generally oversize and visually enhanced for design. The rest of the actual exhaust is usually smaller and these tips are just welded on for show. The new AMGs still have four actual pipes going into the tips, but the tips are mounted to the bumper instead of welded on. Part of the reason for that is if you look inside, the pipes are oddly shaped to produce the AMG sound customers want. One pipe on each side is round and the other one is kinda square. Would look odd I think to have two round and two square pipes coming out the back. The exhaust stream still comes out through the tips, so they are not fake in the sense that they are just for decoration. There are much bigger offenders like even Million dollar cars. Just look at the Bugatti Chiron. The actual visible exhaust is complete decoration. Behind it are six pipes, two of them spew out through the diffuser next to the visible exhaust tips and the other four point downwards. The worst I think are exhaust tips that are closed and a 100% for show like what Audi is doing on the new Q5, or cars with quad tips, but only two are actually functional. Now that's fake. As long as they are open and the actual pipes are behind it and let the exhaust out through the tips, then I don't really care if they are welded on or mounted to the bumper. Not having them welded on actually has the nice side effect of not collecting all the exhaust soot. They stay cleaner much longer.

KAMG

Even though the older AMGs have bigger tips, at least they're connected to the rest of the exhaust. The fact that they are cut off is weird to me. I think it looks really bad on the Chiron...you look at the exhaust and you can see the real tips behind the fake tips. Do the ones pointing down push out white smoke (in winter, etc)? It'd look really odd with smoke coming from underneath the car

Reminds me of people who put those $10 vents on their hood/fenders, make me cringe

Yuille36

I checked numerous AMG's when I was at the dealership, and none of the exhaust are connected. You just have the exhaust that come from the mufflers, and then the decorative square welded on, crimped on, glued on, bolted on exhaust tips

superswiss

Yes, with the Chiron there is smoke coming from underneath the car.

Unfortunately, there are more and more regulations coming down the pike, which have one thing in common and that is killing exhaust sound. First fuel requirements leading to smaller, turbo charged engines taking most of the energy out of the exhaust stream and killing sound, now mandatory particulate filters in Europe (Luckily, it looks like they are left off US builds), and more stringent noise regulations restricting the use of valved exhausts. AMG has put a lot of sound engineering into the exhaust to make sure that despite all of this their cars remain the or some of the best sounding performance cars out there. I believe the use of "fake" exhaust tips allowed them to design the exhaust around the sound, rather than looks and still meet all the regulations. For example, did you know that noise measurements for the exhaust are taken at a certain distance from the bumper? By ending the exhaust a foot or so before the bumper, or aiming it downwards away from the microphones allows them to make the exhaust louder and still meet noise limits. It's all a game, but I take it over a car sounding like a fancy hair dryer.

IrAg166

The fake exhaust tips actually have a bit of a design rationale behind it. Say you were rear ended, and the exhaust was actually connected to the four tips. That'd be a pain in the *** to fix and replace. With the fake tips, the exhausts are now mounted further behind and have a bit of extra room which can allow it to escape damage. Now, granted, if you take a close up look, it's not the prettiest, but, I can understand the reasoning behind it. Also with regards to the 43 and 53 AMGs, they are tuned by AMG and are fantastic vehicles. Since the philosophy is One Man, One Engine, the 43 and 53 don't quite make a full AMG. If the name was somehow similar to what BMW does with their M tuned cars (like M235i) then I think everyone will be happier. That's what I wish they'd done, personally, just create a new naming scheme that somehow incorporates AMG but is different enough to show it's not a full on AMG.

Yuille36

We all know that the "One Man, One Engine" principle has been and will always be what differentiates what a true AMG is.
Now AMG will tell you that the 35/43/53 are true AMG's but for us purest, we all know better and were not buying it.
I got into a heated debate on the AMG Private Lounge over this very issue, and was banned for awhile.
The CE stated that if AMG puts it's branding on the car it's an AMG period. So there was no winning that argument.
So I took my lumps, and had to wait a month before I could access the site once again.
And I couldn't make any more statements regarding the legitimacy of these cars, or I could be permanently banned.
So I really don't access their site much anymore, because I'm not free to voice my opinions openly.

But I do think that putting AMG branding on every dam thing, is diminishing the brand. I don't agree with it, but I do understand the marketing philosophy behind it.

Yuille36

What is the future direction of Mercedes-AMG. We will see cars powered by a turbo charged I-4, powering a MGU-K, with electric traction motors at the front wheels, and a electric motor built into the transmission to boost hp/torque. We might not be that far off, probably in the next 6 years? Mercedes has already killed off the V12, what's next the V8s. We already seen displacement disappear, no more 6.3, 5.5. Just 4.0 and I bet their going to get even smaller but with bigger turbo, and MGU-K. The future will tell us Mercedes-AMG's direction. I'm just glad that, I have a truly AMG derived, developed and manufactured 6.3 liter V8, no replacement for displacement.

KAMG

That makes sense, never thought of that

I find it funny how on the Private Lounge, under engine creations they only list the actual hand built motors (M178, M178, M156, M113k, M113, M275 etc), yet they include all the 43 cars (and probably the 53s eventually) in the models section

diamondblak05

I lusted over the AMG principal of one man one engine thing since I was a kid and know there's only one AMG in each class. Now, there's 35/43/53 AMG and the stamp on the rear is reversed from ML63 AMG to AMG GLE63, I'm all lost here!

Yuille36

The correct layout should be the name ML63 then AMG, I believe that AMG knows these new cars aren't the real McCoy, so they opted for AMG first then the name GLE43/53.

tw2

I have a tiny bit of brand loyalty but would probably still buy a newer amg despite all of these changes if I was in the market unless there was an obviously better car from a competitor. The alfa romeo giulia quadrifoglio would be hard to walk by.

IrAg166

They changed the badging to AMG on the left and model on the right because the brand name itself was changed to Mercedes-AMG from Mercedes-Benz AMG. AMG basically replaced the Benz bit so that's the rationale behind the name swap. It has nothing to do with whether it's a 63 or not. It's just co-branding, like Mercedes-McLaren back in the SLR days.

PieRat

The alfas are nice, but they are like x3 the price of a 2012 turbo cls/e class...I have been looking at a supra or a Porsche if I ditch the merc...Keento get something that costs a bit more but appreciates...

PieRat

Probably will keep the merc for driving around the baby that is on its way and get a supra garage/track/fun times car

Strigoi

This thread just makes me want to keep my E63 that much more. Been thinking about selling it for quite awhile now too.

I love the car. I couldn't tell you how many hours I've spent in the garage with a beer in hand just looking at it.

tw2

A bit off topic but I was thinking the new supra would make a great weekend car. Unfortunately I think the side view is the only one I find appealing, the front looks like a vacuum cleaner and the back is a bit too crazy. Also the digital dash. Looks like a very well engineered car though and I couldn't care less about the BMW engine, it is a fantastic tuning engine in it's own right. I really like the 370z Nismo which I doubt anyone would agree with.
I wouldn't sell. They are great cars and they have fantastic performance. The new models are faster but it's not like the E55/E63 are slow.

maw1124

All of this is why I’m happy to have a few “old school” German muscle cars, from before the emissions rules forced everything to smaller engines and multiple turbos. MB AMG, BWM M, Audi S/RS, all “suffer” the same fate. The AMG 45 book for me signaled the end of a dying breed. So for now, I’m straight. Agreed that the W221/222 TT 63 cars look interesting, as do the R230 63s. After that, well you have to stick with the E, S, SL and G classes (and now I guess that includes the CLS and GT, but my jury is still out). Not to offend anyone here, but AMG C, CLK and SLK classes were never my thing anyway (that’s what BMW M and Porsche are for), so staying with the big boys is no issue. Yes, they cost more to keep on the road. But they can save the gadgets and bling for someone else. I’ve been thinking to debadge my S55 like the 500E — if you don’t know what it is you probably don’t deserve to know.

And totally agreed on the M156 love. The first SLS I heard, I was ready to trade everything for it. Cooler heads prevailed.

Cheers,

maw

Yuille36

The M156 gets a lot of criticism for headbolts, cams, lifters but these things can be fixed. Sure it will cost you money.
But other then that this is a great engine, the last of a dying breed.
Never to be made again, as the trend is smaller cubic inch and turbo charged, soon to be electric motors.
I would consider buying another AMG if I was in the market, but there just to dam expensive.
I looked at a 2019 E63s, a few days ago $132k. And that's is why, I would purchase a used one after the depreciation.

maw1124

New just doesn’t make any sense at all for me. Never has. I only want the ones that are proven great, which by definition means I won’t be the first owner. It took MB AMG from ‘04 to ‘14 to get that TT V12 right, and it needed a wholly rethought ignition system to get there. Just like it took BMW M until the E46M to get that straight 6 right. I want them only after they’re correct, not on the way there. The 500E was right out of the box, only needed larger brakes and first gear start. When you add that to the depreciation, I’ll probably never buy a new one. Life is too short for car headaches. I want proven best in breed, no drama,

maw

AMGFreek

Just read this:

https://apple.news/AwiLlSBA8QRy7vR9x8ZJlhw

Yuille36

Dam........Not another AMG. Really how many AMG models do they have now?

tw2

What if I want a A25 or A65? Maybe you can pick whatever number you want and they will give you the corresponding amount of power and brake/suspension level.

Yuille36

AMG is morphing into providing a AMG for everyone's preference.

slownrusty

Great thread and first post by the OP. I agree with your sentiment. When marketing trumps engineering, the results will never be good.