For those who track the E55....
07-12-2004, 12:09 PM
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For those who track the E55....
The following is an article from Autoweek. I track my E55 4-6 times per year, should I be worried about Benz not covering me?
PS-Colorchange what happen with your brakes at the dealer??
(08:30 June 30, 2004)
Warranty Woes: Whether abuse or autocrossing, most automakers are not covering it
By ANDREW LUU
MICHAEL MILLER DIDN’T know it, but the drivetrain warranty was already void on his son’s new Mitsubishi Evolution before he even took the car in for service to his local Salt Lake City dealership.
Unbeknownst to Miller, Mitsubishi placed a lifetime warranty restriction on the engine, clutch and transmission in Miller’s Evo because the company discovered the car had been entered in a Sports Car Club of America autocross event a month earlier.
Miller said that about two weeks after entering the Evo in the SCCA event he heard bad noises emanating from the engine bay and took the car in for service. “The dealer performed a vehicle service inquiry and I was told there was a restriction placed on my file,” Miller says.
Bottom line: After entering the car in one SCCA event, Miller was left with a $7,000 bill for repairing two failed connecting rods and a blown turbocharger.
“Problems related to racing or modifications are not covered under warranty,” says Mitsubishi spokeswoman Janis Little. “Autocrossing, or timed competition, is classified under the warranty terms as racing. It’s difficult for us to know if you’re out there racing, but if there is evidence of racing damage, we’re going to look into it and you may have warranty restrictions placed on certain parts of the vehicle.”
Most owners recognize that part of the cost of going racing means footing the repair bill when something goes awry. Manufacturer warranties and owner manuals typically specify that harsh use, abuse, non-factory modifications and racing can void all or part of a vehicle’s warranty intended to cover defects in materials or workmanship. Miller’s case, however, raises questions about how the company discovered his autocross involvement.
The buzz in online communities suggests Mitsubishi is cross matching names from its owner database with SCCA autocross results. Those who turn up on both lists are notified that their vehicle warranties are void, the online chatter claims. Miller says Mitsubishi wasn’t clear on how it learned of his autocrossing.
Mitsubishi adamantly denies that it uses automated web search systems to look for Evolutions involved in race events. “We don’t have people out there searching websites for names,” says Little.
No matter how racing involvement comes to the attention of an automaker, companies steadfastly stand by their right to limit warranty coverage—even if the cars they sell are clearly built for speed and marketed with flashy ads and brochures that promote enthusiastic driving. Most automakers say the same thing: Racing, track use, competition and other abuses aren’t covered.
“When it hits the track, all bets are off,” says Bob Carlson, Porsche Cars of North America spokesman.
For instance, even though Subaru pops for a one-year SCCA membership for every interested WRX buyer, and in its marketing materials appears to encourage owners to enter their cars in autocross events, the company says autocrossing is racing and racing can void warranty coverage. The WRX/SCCA application form says the SCCA “looks forward to helping you fully experience the benefits of owning this car.” But the form also includes a disclaimer that Subaru’s warranty excludes “damage or failure resulting from participation in competition or racing events.”
“If the damage looks to be racing related, you’re not going to be covered,” says Subaru spokeswoman Larkin Hill. “We don’t want to punish the person who goes out once in a while and autocrosses—and that shouldn’t cause any problems with the car anyway. However, autocross is considered competition and the warranty does not cover abusive driving or competition. If you’re out there racing every weekend, you can’t expect us to fund it.”
You’ll hear the same story at DaimlerChrysler Street and Racing Technology, where they make the Dodge SRT-4, the Viper-powered Ram SRT-10 and the supercharged Chrysler Crossfire SRT-6. “Technically, racing damage is not covered under warranty,” says SRT spokesman Dan Bodene. “If a guy autocrosses, submits a problem for warranty and the dealer suspects it is racing related, he’s going to huddle with our technicians to find out. If it is, our dealers are not obligated to cover it under warranty.”
Chevrolet lures young buyers with the performance promise of its 2005 supercharged Cobalt SS, but the owner’s manual clearly states the warranty does not cover alterations and misuse.
“Under the misuse heading, such things like running over curbs, improper loading and competition or racing are spelled out specifically,” says Chevy spokesman Mike Stoller. “If there’s a car coming into the dealer that has been racing and that results in damage, and it’s something that is probable or obvious, that would not be something we would be compelled to cover.”
Internal investigations aren’t limited to auto-crossing, but cover any activity deemed outside normal use, such as track days and plain old aggressive driving.
“If a guy’s constantly lighting up the tires on the street, that’s not normal wear and tear,” says Chrysler’s Bodene.
Adds Mitsubishi’s Little: “You’re not going to get black-flagged just for entering an auto-cross, but if something happens we want people to be reasonable and responsible for their own actions. If you go once in a while, just like if you drive hard on the street, who’s going to really know? But if you’re coming in two or three times to replace a blown clutch, we know you’re probably testing your car’s 0-to-60 time.”
But what about all those manufacturer- and dealer-sponsored “racing” events—track days, club meets and performance driving programs that seem to encourage owners to drive competitively?
The big difference, companies note, is that manufacturer-sponsored driving programs such as Mazda’s Rev It Up or the Porsche Driving Experience provide cars and instruction, and no owner vehicles are permitted.
One rare exception is track day events organized, sponsored and sanctioned by the national Ford SVT Owners’ Association and local Ford/SVT dealers. Owners bring their cars, and the association and participating dealers agree to cover any mechanical failures brought on by normal track use.
“Owners can participate in the instructional days without automatically voiding their warranties,” says Ford Performance Vehicles spokesman Alan Hall. “Obviously if they abuse it [the car] on the track, or there’s a part that breaks due to aggressive driving, that will not be covered under warranty. But your warranty will not be voided across the board by just participating in that event. We don’t automatically void a warranty unless above-normal abuse is shown on a vehicle.”
PS-Colorchange what happen with your brakes at the dealer??
(08:30 June 30, 2004)
Warranty Woes: Whether abuse or autocrossing, most automakers are not covering it
By ANDREW LUU
MICHAEL MILLER DIDN’T know it, but the drivetrain warranty was already void on his son’s new Mitsubishi Evolution before he even took the car in for service to his local Salt Lake City dealership.
Unbeknownst to Miller, Mitsubishi placed a lifetime warranty restriction on the engine, clutch and transmission in Miller’s Evo because the company discovered the car had been entered in a Sports Car Club of America autocross event a month earlier.
Miller said that about two weeks after entering the Evo in the SCCA event he heard bad noises emanating from the engine bay and took the car in for service. “The dealer performed a vehicle service inquiry and I was told there was a restriction placed on my file,” Miller says.
Bottom line: After entering the car in one SCCA event, Miller was left with a $7,000 bill for repairing two failed connecting rods and a blown turbocharger.
“Problems related to racing or modifications are not covered under warranty,” says Mitsubishi spokeswoman Janis Little. “Autocrossing, or timed competition, is classified under the warranty terms as racing. It’s difficult for us to know if you’re out there racing, but if there is evidence of racing damage, we’re going to look into it and you may have warranty restrictions placed on certain parts of the vehicle.”
Most owners recognize that part of the cost of going racing means footing the repair bill when something goes awry. Manufacturer warranties and owner manuals typically specify that harsh use, abuse, non-factory modifications and racing can void all or part of a vehicle’s warranty intended to cover defects in materials or workmanship. Miller’s case, however, raises questions about how the company discovered his autocross involvement.
The buzz in online communities suggests Mitsubishi is cross matching names from its owner database with SCCA autocross results. Those who turn up on both lists are notified that their vehicle warranties are void, the online chatter claims. Miller says Mitsubishi wasn’t clear on how it learned of his autocrossing.
Mitsubishi adamantly denies that it uses automated web search systems to look for Evolutions involved in race events. “We don’t have people out there searching websites for names,” says Little.
No matter how racing involvement comes to the attention of an automaker, companies steadfastly stand by their right to limit warranty coverage—even if the cars they sell are clearly built for speed and marketed with flashy ads and brochures that promote enthusiastic driving. Most automakers say the same thing: Racing, track use, competition and other abuses aren’t covered.
“When it hits the track, all bets are off,” says Bob Carlson, Porsche Cars of North America spokesman.
For instance, even though Subaru pops for a one-year SCCA membership for every interested WRX buyer, and in its marketing materials appears to encourage owners to enter their cars in autocross events, the company says autocrossing is racing and racing can void warranty coverage. The WRX/SCCA application form says the SCCA “looks forward to helping you fully experience the benefits of owning this car.” But the form also includes a disclaimer that Subaru’s warranty excludes “damage or failure resulting from participation in competition or racing events.”
“If the damage looks to be racing related, you’re not going to be covered,” says Subaru spokeswoman Larkin Hill. “We don’t want to punish the person who goes out once in a while and autocrosses—and that shouldn’t cause any problems with the car anyway. However, autocross is considered competition and the warranty does not cover abusive driving or competition. If you’re out there racing every weekend, you can’t expect us to fund it.”
You’ll hear the same story at DaimlerChrysler Street and Racing Technology, where they make the Dodge SRT-4, the Viper-powered Ram SRT-10 and the supercharged Chrysler Crossfire SRT-6. “Technically, racing damage is not covered under warranty,” says SRT spokesman Dan Bodene. “If a guy autocrosses, submits a problem for warranty and the dealer suspects it is racing related, he’s going to huddle with our technicians to find out. If it is, our dealers are not obligated to cover it under warranty.”
Chevrolet lures young buyers with the performance promise of its 2005 supercharged Cobalt SS, but the owner’s manual clearly states the warranty does not cover alterations and misuse.
“Under the misuse heading, such things like running over curbs, improper loading and competition or racing are spelled out specifically,” says Chevy spokesman Mike Stoller. “If there’s a car coming into the dealer that has been racing and that results in damage, and it’s something that is probable or obvious, that would not be something we would be compelled to cover.”
Internal investigations aren’t limited to auto-crossing, but cover any activity deemed outside normal use, such as track days and plain old aggressive driving.
“If a guy’s constantly lighting up the tires on the street, that’s not normal wear and tear,” says Chrysler’s Bodene.
Adds Mitsubishi’s Little: “You’re not going to get black-flagged just for entering an auto-cross, but if something happens we want people to be reasonable and responsible for their own actions. If you go once in a while, just like if you drive hard on the street, who’s going to really know? But if you’re coming in two or three times to replace a blown clutch, we know you’re probably testing your car’s 0-to-60 time.”
But what about all those manufacturer- and dealer-sponsored “racing” events—track days, club meets and performance driving programs that seem to encourage owners to drive competitively?
The big difference, companies note, is that manufacturer-sponsored driving programs such as Mazda’s Rev It Up or the Porsche Driving Experience provide cars and instruction, and no owner vehicles are permitted.
One rare exception is track day events organized, sponsored and sanctioned by the national Ford SVT Owners’ Association and local Ford/SVT dealers. Owners bring their cars, and the association and participating dealers agree to cover any mechanical failures brought on by normal track use.
“Owners can participate in the instructional days without automatically voiding their warranties,” says Ford Performance Vehicles spokesman Alan Hall. “Obviously if they abuse it [the car] on the track, or there’s a part that breaks due to aggressive driving, that will not be covered under warranty. But your warranty will not be voided across the board by just participating in that event. We don’t automatically void a warranty unless above-normal abuse is shown on a vehicle.”
07-12-2004, 07:59 PM
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Porcelain Bus
My brakes and rotors were replaced under warranty after some initial hesitancy. They changed their tune when I said to put the wheels back on because I intended to take the car elsewhere for the brakework.
07-12-2004, 08:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Dr Chill
My brakes and rotors were replaced under warranty after some initial hesitancy. They changed their tune when I said to put the wheels back on because I intended to take the car elsewhere for the brakework.
07-13-2004, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by BenzoBoi
Dr Chill...how many miles did you have before they replaced the brakes? I think I might have to get my rotor replaced because they are beginning to crack.
About 9400. My rotors were cracked too.
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07-14-2004, 01:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Dr Chill
About 9400. My rotors were cracked too.
07-14-2004, 11:14 AM
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MB E55 2004
Hello:
The dealer changed my rotors and pads when I rechead the 6,000mi. FYI, I went to the autocross the weekend before and both rotors cracked, this was changed under warranty since the car had such low milage
.
Regards,
E55 POWER
The dealer changed my rotors and pads when I rechead the 6,000mi. FYI, I went to the autocross the weekend before and both rotors cracked, this was changed under warranty since the car had such low milage
.Regards,
E55 POWER
07-14-2004, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by BenzoBoi
I am gonna go in for maintenance can I ask them to jus replace them? How long did it take if you don't mind me askin?
07-14-2004, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Dr Chill
B service and brakes-2 days.
07-14-2004, 11:10 PM
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Porcelain Bus
Just tell them you think the brakes are cooked. Tell them you drive the car hard but don't tell them you took it to the track. If they tell you they won't cover the brakes under warranty, tell them not to change them because you want to take the car to another shop or dealer. I think they will reconsider if they know that they will lose the repair if it's not covered.
07-14-2004, 11:50 PM
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E 63S Wagon Renntech, E55 Renntech, SL65, SL 55 030, ML, bunch of old ones--they come, they go...
You guys are crackin me up....
as I haven't seen any Benz dealer take any responsibility for brakes of ANY kind in months. The last straw for me was trying to get some rear pads replaced that another Benz store had previously replaced under 10k miles ago. The service writer called me during some warranty repairs to tell me I needed rear pads. I told him to replace them, they should be covered under the MB 12/12 parts warranty and I had a receipt. The tune then changed, and I told them to get the regional service guy to give me a call. I had them replaced at our best local independent and kept the 9k mile pads to show the regional. Still waiting for his call. And you think they're gonna give you some pads/rotors for some AMG brakes? BTW, I am a second generation, nearly 20 year, MB customer. Just typical of the new DC.
07-16-2004, 07:32 AM
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E 63S Wagon Renntech, E55 Renntech, SL65, SL 55 030, ML, bunch of old ones--they come, they go...
Chill...I'm not sure..
ifyou were adressing me or not, but just FYI, the rear brakes WERE replaced under warranty at a Benz dealer, just not the same one where it appeared for the second claim. Given the strange editing of the posts on this board, I'm not really sure if you were adressing my comments or not..thanks.
07-16-2004, 03:08 PM
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Porcelain Bus
I was addressing you and edited my post after rereading yours. I misinterpreted what you were saying the first time I read it. Funny how you saw my original post since I edited it within minutes of submitting it.
07-16-2004, 03:57 PM
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A bucket on wheels
unfortunatly i do not have an AMG but i know for my c coupe they wouldn't cover my brakes and rotors under warranty and wanted over $600 to change the front rotors and pads all around.
07-16-2004, 11:59 PM
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A bucket on wheels
i know the first time i change the brake pads were before 12k which is why i believe they were free however the second time was at 18k and that was about a week ago.
07-18-2004, 08:18 PM
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E500 2003
My rotors were worn out after 27,000 miles, only the funny thing is I was still running on the first set of brake pads. I went in for new pads as the 'pads low' light came on, then the dealer told me I needed new rotors. I called MB USA (oh boy were they rude... the customer service rep would not hand me over to her supervisor when I asked for the next level up) and they would only tell me to see my dealer. I can understand needing new rotors if I were on the 3rd set of pads due to hard braking habits but I never heard of rotors being replaced on the first set of pads. Should I expect a new set of rotors each time I take my car in for a set of pads, I mean c'mon!
