Anyway, just finished installing Kleeman headers on the my E63 2010. The headers had to be adapted from the W211 model and did not completely fit. The most obvious problem was rubbing on the steering column. The installer had to adjust it several times (I think by denting the header a little bit to give it enough clearance).
The car sounds significantly louder, no droning. Really good sound but a bit too loud for my taste. It seems like it is much louder than a W211 with the same headers.
Also weighed my car and was surprised to find that the car was at 4294lbs with an empty tank (P2 + pano). Full tank would add another ~110 lbs (6.4 pounds per U.S. gallon), I filled up 17 gallons after ~ 110lbs, plus me around 200lbs, so that total weight of the car with me in it and the full tank is ~4604lbs. Wow.
Performance wise -- not sure. I cant feel much of a difference. There seems to be a slight pick up mid range to the top, but I cant tell for sure. I will dyno my car next week. And even if it did gain ~20-25hp, it would be difficult to tell anyway.

Will post dyno results next week.

 

WOW!! 4294LBS is a lot of weight. My C63 with low gas is 3940lbs and I think is a pig.. that is also with floor mats removed and no spare tire

 

Pano roof alone is about 120 lbs of extra weight.... and unfortunately, it adds the weight right on top of the car - the worst place possible I would like the pano roof on a regular Mercedes but on an AMG, it takes away some handling and some power

 

I hope the dyno shows some gains. Like you, I wouldn't want my car to be any louder. I've owned the supercharged Corvettes.

 

Even at 390xx lbs the C63 seems like a light weight in the AMG group. I can't even imagine how really fast a C63 with wider tires and 400lbs less would have been...

 

Will try to do a dyno tomorrow on a dynojet (same dyno, same place as the baseline). But I already can tell that my car picked up some good power based on real world runs.

At first I thought the car was too loud, but now I like it a lot. The exhaust sounds is now very much like SLS, amazing sound throughout the whole RPM range, just intoxicating.

Very happy with the Kleeman setup, and no CEL yet after 400 miles of driving.

 

Albert did you get a new tune? You will need one with the headers to maximize the gains. Your current OE tune is not optimized for headers.

Also was the install really that "mickey mouse" where it didnt fit and parts had to be bent? I would think Kleeman would have a plug and play part.

 

Do you plan om taking it down the 1320 before seasons end?
Cough...MIR on the 20th....cough.

 

No I did no get a new tune. I exchanged some emails with Jeremy and I think the new tune turns off the O2 sensors only. But I might be mistaken? Vic can you find out, you seem to have much better access to Jeremy.

It was not completely "mickey mouse". It mostly fit, but rubbed a little on steering, so they had to adjust a bit (dent the driver side header). The installation/adjustment took around 3 days total.
I am sure Kleeman would make the final adjustment to their product when they release headers for the W212 model.

Maybe the installer can chime in and add some detail on this. The work was done at RPM North LI.

 

Unfortunately no such plans.

 

Latest update: LOST POWER after installing Kleeman headers+highflow cats. The SAE base number is 424hp, and 409 after installing Kleeman headers+highflow, that is 15hp loss vs expected 20hp gain
AF ratios are showing identical on both runs.

All dynos were done on a dynojet at the same shop.

I was surprised and disappointed to say the least. Anyone can explain how Kleeman headers can loose power on W212?

The curve is almost identical until about 6000RPM and the HP starts to fall off at top end.

So now I have to decide whether to go back to stock or not.

 

Albert like I was telling you,there is a leak in the connection. Mustve got loose. In the real world it shows you gained.

 

Well was temps the same , DA, humidity , ???? Same fuel ???

did the manifold ports match the block ??? i did the same set up on my car as well as the hi flows and i ceramic coated them . I also did the carbonio and the evo pully and thermal plenum spacers and my car with the entire package showed a gain of 32 rwhp but the tune added another 26 rwhp afterwards .

Tune the car and free up more air flow on the intake side .

 

It was actually cooler today then the first time (baseline), fuel BP-93 vs Shell-93 (baseline). Also, I thought that SAE corrects for that anyway. Also, I already have a tune from OETuning, and headers were heat treated as well.

Not sure about port matching. How would I know that? What is port matching anyway? It is the same Kleeman header that goes on W211 E63. My understanding is that there is no difference between W211 and W212 only the downpipes had to be adjusted.

How would I even determine what is wrong? Also, how can the new headers actually loose power? It is hard to believe that a leak can cause that. Since the power loss occurs up top it almost seems that the there is more back pressure then the stock setup. I will post the dyno charts on Monday.

malakasnyc, I did some math on the components you had installed on your car:
1) Carbonio air box -- advertised hp gain 20
2) Pulley -- advertised hp gain 15
3) Kleeman Headers -- advertised hp gain 20

You should have gained at least 55 rwhp. It almost seems like either Carbonio air-box or Kleeman headers produced no gains at all.

 

everyone advertises Crank HP not RWHP . If i told you i was selling the Brooklyn Bridge would u believe me too ?

I also removed a pair of 2ndry cats and the car really woke up and after the OE tune i did manage another 11 RWHP from the last dyno .

tune the car and if you want the best bang for your buck get a set of Long tubes and spend 10k on some super light Dyna mag wheels .

Or get a true sports car .

 

Run 003 is the base line, run 005 is with headers. Did 3 pulls with headers all with the same result. Any one has any clue as to why this happened?

 

Unless you retune your car you will continue to have a loss in power. The new tune will maximize the gains for the new headers.

 

how much was the primary dented to fit? that might have a lot to do with it

 

Really? Is the power loss expected and normal in this case? I understand if there were no gain, but a loss?

Not much, just a slight dent. Kleeman and RPM are looking into this and so far the dent/installation has been ruled out. I think they want to re-dyno the car and monitor timing advance to see if the ECU is pulling back the timing.

Anyone can tell if my AFRs are normal during the run (see previous charts)?

 

it's possible. with such a large lost of back pressure, the engine runs differently, timing is affected and that ultimately could easily affect HP.

i don't think that sort of match works in these situations. Those HP gains are usually max gains. meaning they could potentially install all the parts, make it fixed up, then dyno, then swap that 1 part out, then dyno again to see how much that 1 piece holds back or restricts HP. Then they claim that lost is a gain in that it can achieve.

Basically, it's a best case scenario. With those "55" gains, i would estimate it to only be about 35-45 in real life crank gain. Then factor in RWHP and it will probably only equate to 20-30 HP.

Also FYI, port match is when they match up the shape and size of the port (in this case it's the exaust port) to the shape and size of the matching pipe or piece going onto it. So it's completely flush internally. Helps air flow.

but I can't imagine that being a problem for you, unless there is some significant issues with alignment or fit

 

Here is the latest update on the Kleemann header power loss on W212 E63.

Last week I went to Bruce @ TTM for a second opinion on this whole power loss issue. Bruce put my car on a lift and we both examined the headers, cats and the downpipes. What did we find:
1) Driver side header was dented to clear the steering shaft (about 3 inches long and 1.5 inches wide, not sure how deep but seemed a bit deeper then 2mm claimed by RPM)
2) Cats were connected at a very steep angle and welding job looked really bad, really really bad.

Frankly I was so fed up with the whole setup that I asked Bruce to put the stock manifolds back. It was becoming clear that even though Kleemann headers fit the engine, they clearly did not fit the chassis. Bruce took the headers and the cats out. As it turned out the both Kleemann cats were blown and loose inside. I am not sure how that happened after 2 weeks of driving with this setup. So anyway, long story short, Bruce @TTM put my stock manifolds back and fabricated the pipes connecting from the manifolds to the secondary cats (primary cats out).

Bruce @TTM did a clean, high quality job in a single shot: clean welds, perfect fit, no leaks, and the car sounds like a monster, absolutely sick.

Conclusions: RPM shouldn't have installed the W211 Kleemann header on the W212 as soon as they saw a fitment problem, instead they just forced them on: by adjusting, bending, welding at the wrong angles. The power loss was most likely a combination of header installation+shot Kleemann hf primary cats and how the cats were welded to the rest of the exhaust.

The only reason I started doing this, is because the RPM promised that the install will only happen if the headers fit 100%. In reality, W211 Kleemann headers DO NOT fit W212 100%. It was basically a hack and a really bad one at best. It cost me time, money and many sleepless nights over the various warranty issues that may pop up.

I would like to thank Bruce @ TTM for helping me out on this and correcting the problem. I can't even imagine what would have happened if I did not dyno my car, or dig deeper after my Kleemann header install. Imagine what a disaster this could have been.

I hope this post does not offend anyone. I am simply stating my experience.

 

Thanks Albert, sorry it had to come to this.

I guess my "mickey mouse" comment several posts above was a bit appropriate. And its not geared towards you in any way but moreso to anyone who would try to install a set of headers that are not actually made for the car they are trying to install them on. (the shop)

Im glad your car is now running good again. Can you tell the difference?

 

Well, it is hard to tell but it does feel stronger uptop. I am planning to do another final dyno run later this week. Numbers will tell the story.

 

Wow, Im sorry to hear about your headers incident but Im glad your car is back to running like she should be. It's shocking to me to hear RPM forced through with the installation.

 

geez... that really sucks. Sorry about that.