xlr8tin

Hmmm. Interesting. I learned something today about bi-turbos...makes me want to get an Audi even more

xlr8tin

I'm gonna have to go with euro on this one...An evo is no joke

msheredy

I think the proper argument here is whether or not the twin turbo setup is parallel or sequential.

Parallel= 2 turbos simultaneously feeding a common intake manifold (or in some cases like the GTR (and coincidentally the engine in discussion) the intake manifolds are separated with 2 throttle bodies).
Sequential= 2 Turbos again but a small turbo feeding into a larger turbo which then feeds a common intake manifold.

Only a handful or cars actually used this method. RX7, last gen Supras and a lot of tuner diesels (I'm sure they're more )

Judging by this pic of the F10's engine I think it's safe to say that this is a parallel setup. Both turbos are identical in size and markings (one looks larger because the other has a cutaway view.

BTW this engine is a trip! They reversed the intake and exhaust ports like the old Indy flat V8s!!!






Here's an extreme version but you get the idea.

_AMG_

Official numbers are up for the F10 M5, 552HP/501TQ, not too shaby.
BMW certainly got the power right with the M5, but will it be a match for 550HP/590TQ in the E63?

Vic55

Other factors will come into play--- CoEd, Transmission (big one), Gearing, etc.


BMW will have a DCT- it will be more efficient and the power transfer will be strong. It should be a good battle.

Centurion

Would love to see these cars on a dyno to see which is better at delivering that power to the ground.

ItalianStallion

A, this is so funny. your Evo vs ANY e55, open challenge

Anyway I saw the NEW CLS63 BITURBO. This is your next car bro. Sickest thing i've ever seen. Black CLS63 bi-turbo on route 9 in sleepy hollow. Broke necks. I had no idea the CLS was even out, let alone the biturbo!

Vic55

Its out and ABOUT putting up stupid mag numbers:

Motor Trend:

0-60 in 3.9 seconds
121 mph in the quarter trappers

skratch77

Wow I havnt been in this thread so here goes.

First my borther and cousin had s4s and 3 of my boys had s4s(all ko4s),I know what there all about.I think I have 2 blown up k03s in my basement,I will glady try to dig them up for you to SHOW YOU they are the same turbos,they look about the size of a quarter.

My cousin just sold his s4 to otto and you might know sforce from the audi forums and they have the fastest k04s in the country right now.They are tuning there own cars with winols and running meth/e85 and have taken those turbos to the absolute limit.

Second my best friend had 2 evos and one was a gt35r and the other was a gt40r and they were dogs at anything under 4500 rpms.Thats where the no displacment came from and the 6.3 would spool them at pretty much idle with all the flow that engine has,come to think about it the gt40r didnt spool till like 5k,it was a joke around town if you were in 3rd gear at anything under 4000 rpms.

3rd I ran my friends gt35r and he ran an 11.4 at 123 and I ran an 11.3 at 122
and my car is at full stock weight.Im also a k4 btw!!!



here is my cousins car that he just sold(I bought him that front mount intercooler)



please bro,like 10 of my freinds rocked S4s and if my brother didnt buy a B5 I would of had one,funny part is Im trying to buy this blue one now for 13k off the kid my cousin sold it too.

This car is on meth/e85/race with all custom tuning by the owner,no off the shelf tune,straigh up running it to the max.

ItalianStallion

Hahaha

ItalianStallion

It's a new era for AMG

Centurion

Yeah, looks like Mercedes is being generous with their performance figures AGAIN.

According to Mercedes, the Motor Trend car, with the Performance Package, should be doing 4.3 in the 0-60.

Motor Trend even stated that power was available immediately. I guess there was very minimal lag.

All I know is, I want the M157.

eurowerx

3rd I ran my friends gt35r and he ran an 11.4 at 123 and I ran an 11.3 at 122
and my car is at full stock weight.Im also a k4 btw!!!

Ok well i been around a lot of S4's and evos i have a video of my 55 with pulley and tune pull away from a stage 3 EPL tuned S4. my buddy's.

Next that 35R ur talking about must either have no idea what they are doing or just bolted a turbo kit on with no supporting mods. A heathly 35R can easily go low 10's around 132-138 mph. making close to 600 WPH .
Yea u might now get boost till 4 k but who cares when ur racing at anytime you should have your rpms high anyway. I don't get boost till about 4200 but i don't care because i keep boost till 9k so. please lets not even get this whole thing started guy.
i love the S4 and The 55 owned both but no comparison to speed of a little turbo 4.

Italians GTR destroyed a fully race ready S4 . gave him 6 cars and flew by him before the eight mile. lol

B its coming down to the CLS or New ///M waiting to see what its about when it comes out.

eurowerx

http://f10.5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=549428

New M5 set an amazing nurburgring ring time.
7:55 beating the cts-v by 4 secs

Centurion

Read about that yesterday too.
They're going crazy over at the M5Board.

skratch77

My friends evo was fully built and tuned by ics in CT by big al.It made 510whp on pump gas.A gt35r wont make 600whp on pump and they run very low 11s.He never got in the 10s with his car but never ran it with race gas.

My friends s4s are tuning there own cars,they are running way more boost and timing than epl will ever run.

one of them ran an 11 flat with a full weight s4 on k04s pushing 26psi and meth on top of e85.

here is the evo vs s4 before he really started teaking his car.We dont have the races on video but after with the agessive tune on the s4 it walked the evo by 1-1.5 cars and we raced like 5 times with the same result.

http://www.youtube.com/user/killabla.../1/vGXjtCajwG4

eurowerx

im not gonna get started but u cant compare the two cars. i owned both cars there is no comparison in performance. the s4 is a great daily driver that is very fast and fun but the eve is a all out beast if u want performance .

Big al is trash to me . i cant stand him or george (ICS). there Rep is finished anyway. al blew up many cars and he thinks he's the ****. (BRO) AMS and Busher have had over 600 hp pulled out of the 35R, yes some on race gas. but the S4 u mentioned is not running straight pump gas either. and there are many evos w the 35 in the 10's my friend . Marc S4 ran a 132 trap, thats a evo 35R trap speed... Bushur bad bish was straight pump gas making insane power and doing 9's in the quarter. so you think they cant go 10's on a 35 r?

Swit
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8NwF...eature=related

Jakpro1

As long as we even come into the ballpark on handling against the new M5, I will be happy. Win in handling would of course be "The Giants Win the Pennant" but as long as we finally are competitve, I will be happy.

To have the M5 out 1/4 us AND out handle will be humiliating.

You listening AMG!!!????

Cylinder Head

iTrader: (1)

The E63 is going to need the P30 just to compete on an even playing field, and that transmission still doesn't have the advantage over the DCT.

220S

Comfort with power has always been AMG's mantra. They even said it recently in a new promo for the CLS. They need to really differentiate the chassis of a non-AMG and an AMG a lot more, imho. That's what BMW does with the M division. But I kinda don't see that happening. Handling will be improved like it has with the W212 E63, but it won't be in the "ultimate driving machine" mindset and tradition that BMW and the M has always had. AMG is still primarily catering to rich folk with fragile bones and bad backs. Even their 'super car' the SLS is built on the comfort chassis end of the spectrum.

I have a feeling that the F10 M5 will still be the Nurburgring champ in the end. And if the new AMGs are quicker in the 1/4, we'll still get that old "yeah, well I can beat you easy in the twisties" response from M5 owners. And AMG will always (and forever) be known as the 'old man's performance car.'

skratch77

of course they can go 10s,Im talking pump gas with a street tune not a ballz out race map for a 10 second pass.

marks cars are gutted and he is running his own tune,same as my friends.

most 35rs are doing 500-530whp on pump,my friend had 2 of them and even at 500whp the transfer case blew up on him on both his cars,first on the gt40r that was making 600whp and he sold it and built a 35r evo and then that pos started going also.

his gt40r was a joke on the street,it had NOTHING under 4500 rpms and you can even here him on the video that he was brake boosting just to build up boost with his 35r.

Its a 2.0 inline 4,how much grunt do you think it can make under the curve?

all this started from me saying that a 5.5 wont have that problem down low since it makes more torque than the evo wothout any boost.

The S4 is a nice platform but its getting dated now.

I guess Im used to 600+rwt in my e55 at under 2500rpms

ERC4

I test drove the 2012 GT-R. It has plenty of turbo lag (at least in straight automatic mode). It's one reason I'm looking at the E63 instead of the GT-R. If the 2012 TT has turbo lag I'd rather have the slower 2011 NA 6.3.

skratch77

first those are 2 different cars so I would test drive both before getting into a heavy 4 door sedan.

the gtr has a smaller engine with less CC,the E63 5.5 will make almost 400 fllbs on its own with the turbos not even making boost so it wont feel laggy at all.

If you want zero lag buy a sl65 with the v12 twin turbo,that monster makes boost at like 1,000rpm

Centurion

Agreed.
Torque in the M157 motor of the '12 CLS63 (same as in the '12 E63) is optimal in the 1,700 - 5,000 rpm range.

Like you said, the 2012 E63 won't feel laggy.

E55_GT3wheels

I am not sure I agree. The new transmission is pretty solid and super quick. In S+ it awlawys selects and holds the right gear. As far as handling wise, same thing...the W212 AMG is a big step up from the W211 AMG. The handling and transmission are the 2 biggest reasons I own the car. As far as the new lap times for the F10 M5, those are pretty amazing. No doubt. If the new F10 is that good (handling wise) while still being livable in every day situations, I may be a buyer. At the same time, the 2010 E63 handles extremely well while still being very comfortable day to day.