JumpinJim

Based on my M5 I'd say it may be due to the fact that the DCT in the M5 just doesn't want to downshift if left in auto. Hit the gas and it just doesn't want to. You can use the paddles, but there's no "optimal" gear feature like in the MB where if you hold the paddle it will go down to the lowest gear for max acceleration. BMW it just goes down 1 gear no matter what you do. So you have to know what gear you want to be in and hit the paddle multiple times. Once you touch the paddle it takes it out of auto and into manual only mode. Which means no auto upshifting when it hits redline. Otherwise it shifts really quick, it's just not user friendly.

JumpinJim

I will second this. Took my M5 to the dragstrip and I've never had a car that was harder to launch.

plivac

thanks!

really surprised about the low steering feel and handling rating of E63 and Panamera - they have the lowest combined rating, but all other reviews tell exactly the opposite...

TMC M5

It is just one magazine review, take it with a grain of salt. Even though the M5 won (and I have, and love, my M5) you need to drive each car yourself and figure out if it is the right fit for you. There are so many great options out there for high performance cars. What I prefer may be different from what you prefer. So one road test editor can come to a different conclusion as another. Look at the Motor Trend test between the M5 CP and the E63 S. They loved the fact that the E63 S is AWD and they wanted to have the security of that system in putting down the power compared to the harder to drive fast M5. R&T agreed that the M5 was harder to drive fast, but placed more value on it being more rewarding. Different strokes for different folks..

HPMan

+ 1

Opinions are necessarily subjective. Case in point is my view of the MCT and BMW's DCT. I currently drive a M3 with a DCT and find it quite fussy for everyday commuter driving. It performs very well on the track and when you are driving the car 9/10, but not so well in traffic IMHO. The MCT was one of the reasons I ordered an E63.

dr. ss

Agree, I like the MCT for the same reason . It's plenty fast for me my gtr has a dct and it sucks in auto mode

cnolke

I took my E63 canyon carving a few weeks ago (yes, I took a wagon canyon carving... the Corvette was getting new tires and I wanted to try it out).

The transmission, in S+ is actually better than when you manually paddle it in M. Its quite a bit of fun. It downshifts while matching with a throttle blip and upshifts at the right time without traction robbing violence.

If you look at the dyno of a M157, the torque is MILES WIDE. There's no "keeping it on boil". Its always on-boil.

If you need the satisfaction of 3 pedals and a stick shift, like me, these turbo v8's are a silly place to try and get it. Find a NA, high spinning motor in a car with two seats (and preferably without a roof). No one *really* wants to ride along while you figure out heel-toe'ing. If monetary reality means buying a 95 Miata, then so be it... go grab a nice 95 Miata for that "drivers car" experience. But also keep an E63 in the quiver. Because when you absolutely positively must get between two places as fast as you can, the E63 is really damn good. The RS7 is also good, but practically speaking, the back seat is silly, and the price... is too much for a VW made with really nice materials. The M6 Gran Coupe I understand... I loved it but couldnt justify the extra money.

SilveRT8

My lease on a CTS-V comes up next Oct., so I also wanted to compare the E63s vs the RS7. Last week I tested an E63s and was impressed by the combo of muscular sound, comfort and power of the car. To me the car does not look great, but it's not bad either and I could live with that as long as the performance is there, it has a great stealth/ sleeper factor, and I know it has great tuning potential to unleash the beast. Today I had the chance to test an RS7 and came back with mixed feelings. Altough the car is very competent at everything, rides smoother than the E and has ample power too, I felt it's a bit too buttoned down for me, the exhaust sounds nice but it's more muted than in the E. The fun factor felt better in the AMG. I prefer a car that's more brutal than refined and that's why last summer I bought a Viper instead of a ZR1. Now that I know that I'll go for an AMG S model for the DD car, I want to test a CLS next, as to me it looks better inside and has a sexier body, also wondering what the refreshed 2015 model will have as updates.

TMC M5

I had an '09 GT-R for 2 1/2 years before the M5. The M5's DCT is SO much better than the GT-R's. I even had the Cobb LC4/5 updates and it was still very clunky compared to the M5's DCT. As JumpinJim alluded to, the DCT can be annoying when it holds a gear way too long before downshifting in auto mode in the highest sport shift setting. Other than that it is a very smooth and quick tranny. But like I said, people need to drive these cars and see for themselves and not take some magazine editor's word.

dr. ss

I have lc5 on my gtr also..I agree with what ur saying but like I said in another thread...tuned this car has so much fkn torque it really does not matter. It's a sledgehammer in whatever gear u are in. After work to release stress I do 2 things , go to the gym and drive my sledgehammer , preferably to the gym.

For what I use my amg for I don't need a DCT, it up shifts and downshifts fast enough for me in sport plus, and I hardly ever use manual, in my gtr I drive only on manual mode.

I looked at M5 but didn't get one bc they are hard to mod and tune and are not available in awd. It's a great car otherwise and I think aesthetically nicer btw the 2.

EDgineered

The E63S can still kick the tail if you want it to. If you like to have a little fun from time to time the E63S is the way to go. After that its a coin flip.

dr. ss

Yup it sure can

plivac

is there any way to get the whole review - cannot find it on R&T and not looking to subscribe () - thanks!

Patric

I went to my local grocery store and bought the magazine issue there. No subscription needed. Simple.

TMC M5

http://f10.m5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=951130

nstanford99

the review is awesome, not sure i agree with the end result though :/

JumpinJim

Thanks for the link. I agree with everything they said about the M5. About it being hard to launch, too powerful for it's chassis, wanting to go sideways all the time, and being a chore to take around a road course. Though I found it just annoying on the road course instead of rewarding, but I'm not a pro either. However, it's the best sedan I've got behind the wheel of as it has so much character.

dr. ss

Y do theg think the e63 is so frumpy or Korean rental car like. I think it looks pretty bad *** on 20's and slightly lowered

mainly

so mercedes was the fastest, followed closely by the M5.

and the m5 was best overall.

yeah, go home audi.

mainly

i think the E63S with blacked out option and a drop would look pretty sick in person. but it needs dirfferent/wider wheels to give it a more mean stance.

of course it would still disappear next to a black cls.

what is it about mercedes AMG, in any other color but black, it looks like it was made for an 82 year old man?

richardaz

I like the "sleeper" aspect of the E63S. Let the police follow cars with big spoilers and other "attractants". We have driven high performance station wagons for 15+ years and the police ignore our wagon to follow "more obvious" cars. Only the wheels on her new E63S wagon tend to indicate that it is more than an E350 (and it certainly doesn't look like a Korean rental car!).

plivac

thanks!!! I did get the subscription (c&D + R&T for $20.... 2 yrs), but probably will not get this issue.

So a couple of observations:

1. E63 styling gets 2 while BMW a 4.5 - styling is subjective so I would just count that out

2. handling/steering feel - not consistent with other reviews re MB and Porsche

3. "the five door not only looks better, but handles more neutrally"

4. I can't seem to think that there is something wrong with the Panamera Turbo review... no fan of it, but I would rate it higher than they did for sure

finally, they should have done a review in different conditions... ex. rain....

I am tickled... my wagon will be in last week of March.. getting very excited

Vic55

Just drove this one the other day.... car looks pretty good and sits nicely but the front end is an acquired taste for me

plivac

this looks like diamond white?

Also, I see you have a '13 M6 - what is your view on this vs. the m6?

Vic55

The M6 is strong at speed with the DCT but my short test drive with the 63S clearly tells me whats better from a dig (as expected)....a tuned E63S would be faster than a stock M6 from a roll. The M6 to me, looks great but Im all about change and getting something different and the M157 is so attractive due to tuning and sound... I guess Id probably say the reverse if the E63S was the car Ive had for a while.


Both are great car for different reasons.