Vistance

Hello all, would like your thoughts on higher mileage early E63 AMGs. Last time I was here, I was asking about the various W212 E350's and E550's, I've test driven several E350's and aside from that fading wood trim on many of them I was pretty impressed with them. However, I've always been a performance car kind of guy. Funny enough, when I was going to look at a W212 E550 and found out someone put a deposit on it I went to the local VW dealer as I heard they finally had the (then) new 2018 Golf R's in after months of being held up in customs. Sure enough they had them, I test drove an '18 with the DSG and loved it. They gave me a good trade offer on the truck which I really did not want to own anymore, and I'm now the original owner of a '18 Golf R DSG.

Anyway, I mention that because I'd like a car that did not cost $42k that I can drive to work, and not freak out about every scratch or ding (I'm still at this phase with the R and this was a reason I always wanted used over new...but the R's were so hard to come by for so long I didn't want to wait for used and wanted to be able to pick without driving all over so I broke my rule and bought new). That aside, obviously an early W212 E350 is well in the sub-$16k range which I'm much more ok with using as a "beater" (even an '11 with 93k miles for $11k which seems pretty reasonable). I found a 2010 and a 2011 E63, both with right around 90k miles on them. The '10 is listed below (this apparently was listed on this very forum back in January, and discussed a bit more here)
https://www.cars.com/vehicledetail/d...5767/overview/

The '11 is listed below, doesn't seem to have the scary buyback on its history, but is a bit more as well.
https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/invent...ting=250220152

Flipping through some threads here, besides the head bolts on the early E63 it does not seem like there is any particular worry point, besides AMG specific items being more expensive than non-AMG variants. I've long bought into the "German car scary, stay away" thing, but after what a POS my C5 Z06 was I have sworn off American cars. I see a lot of hate thrown at AMGs, BMW Ms, and various other performance German cars that I'm really not sure that all of them have truly earned. I looked at a 2015 Audi S6 and it seemed flawless in operation, no issues at all but at the time they weren't willing to deal on that Z06 I had and it had some cosmetic issues. I'm getting to where I think a lot of that diatribe comes from American car owners to justify to themselves why they don't want the performance German cars (that they can't afford). I say this full aware, I'm looking at a very used and older E63...however, it seems of the AMGs, the C63 and E63 with the M156 are pretty trouble free. And I don't know the engine code, but I thought the older supercharged E55s were also supposed to be even more reliable (not that I'm looking for one of those).

I'm ok with some more costly repairs or running costs (brakes, rotors, etc), but my question to you guys is, are there any big ticket items to be concerned with on these? I was considering an LS460 (Yes, total different spectrum as I know that's very snoozy, but I do like cruisers what can I say) and found that the AWD ones have vibration problems, the air suspension is horridly expensive and unreliable (like all of them) though particularly bad on '07-'12 460s, and they have a brake actuator problem that's $2,500 P&L to get fixed and still $1,700 if you DIY. The 460's mushy awful shifts always annoyed me, I like the aggressive shifts of my DSG and of the DCT on the E63 with that pop as it shifts. So if I'm going to be possibly fixing expensive issues, I'd far rather spend a bit more for what I'd really rather own than settling on a boring LS460.

I've seen a few on here with 140-150k+ that reported minimal issues. Some of my pipe dream cars (E60 M5) I know are basically so unreliable that unless someone has done everything absolutely perfectly, you will be in for some fairly constant pain. And even if they have you still might. The E63/C63 M156s seem far less finicky beyond the head bolt thing. And to that, if I see a fair deal on say an '09 C63, how costly is having the head bolts replaced with the proper ones that don't have issues? I keep seeing the "never out of warranty" guys, but it seems like you'd be swapping cars every few years if you did that. I don't need the latest greatest, fastest AMG and I do know the newest ones are mighty fast. I'd be content if I could address any issue areas on an E63 with the M156 and just drive it for years and years with the great sound and timeless looks. Still seems to me a great deal of people like the M156 over the newer ones for the sound and I agree. I'm well aware the gas mileage is not good, for the sound and performance I don't care about the mileage.

TL;DR: What are big ticket repair items on an out of warranty M156 E63? Given the two I linked, are there any huge red flags - or any in general - to look out for if I look at them that would tell me I'm best to stay away? If this truly is beyond a bad idea, please let me hear it as well. I was quite impressed with the E350s I've driven, though invariably each had some niggles like a very ticky sounding engine, a strange wooshing noise from the rear end, or other things that steered me from the particular ones I drove (holding out for the one that just drives great and clearly needed nothing). I am wanting to spend no more than $22k on the car itself (additional for repairs, as to be expected), I could indeed spend much much more but then I've defeated the whole purpose of this endeavor for a more inexpensive beater than my $42k Golf R - even if it is just a tarted up Golf .

homeofstone

The silver one has more options. Also silver is easier to maintain than black. check both carefully for accidents and how bad they were.

Vistance

So I looked at the gray '11 today, it seemed pretty solid as I was testing things out but I noticed the steering wheel would not adjust up or down only in or out. Wrote that off as odd, but I took it for a drive. Shifted good, drove fine, however one time I went to floor it and as soon as I did it dinged at me and said ESP Inoperative Read Owners Manual and then it severely cut power and caused the check engine light to come on and to show both the ESP Off light on the gauge and the triangle for ESP on the upper dash between the gauges. If I turned the car off and then restarted it, this seemed to go away and was totally fine again - until I floored it. Did not matter what setting or mode, nor if I was stopped or moving. When mashing the throttle, it did this every time and in fact the harder you push the throttle the more it felt slower and slower. Once it entered this "limp mode" it didn't stop until I turned it off and started again. I gave about 3/4 throttle and it went quite well and didn't have any issues.

The dealer is going to look into that issue and get back to me, but without pulling any error codes I'm wondering if that sounds like an issue related to the gas pedal position sensor, where the pedal needs to be replaced. But I saw something that also mentioned the column sensor position being related? It certainly did not move up and down like it should only telescoping. Besides that, it ran great and did not seem to have any issues. There was a slight roughness when it very first started, but it smoothed out after a second or two and didn't come back. My old inclination would've been to be scared of this, but I'm thinking this is not as major of an issue as the symptoms would lead to believe. Thoughts on that '11 E63 and that particular issue?

homeofstone

First sounds like not using premium gas. also wheel bearing seal brake sensors that are damaged can give the esp and other codes. Steering wheel is an expensive fix.

Vistance

The car actually had low gas, I put a few bucks in it and used 93 grade so shouldn't be that. No clue what code it is actually throwing since I didn't have an OBDII with me. What is the root cause on the steering wheel/cost? It seems so peculiar that can work for telescoping but not for the other, and I'm confused how that could be costly. But I know these are complex machines so I guess I'm underestimating the mechanics of it.

homeofstone

When I purchased mine back in 2014 the ventilated seat on driver seat bottom did not work and it had only one key fob. so my deal included at no extra cost to me, fixing the seat with a 1 year warranty on the seat ventilation repair and an additional key fob. The seat repair took the Chevy dealer's tech two days and cost over 2000.00 to fix and the fob cost over 300.00.

Vistance

Ok, so I've read and watched even more on M156 and the 2011 I'm looking at is past the head bolt revision so that should be good. For the tappet/buckets, I don't recall hearing any ticking noise from it so don't think that is an issue on this one. The camshaft adjusters, I can't remember now if I heard that sound when it first started up. Is that an issue that one could expect to recur? How frequently? Any way to remediate or prolong the need for that to be done?

I've not seen as much about the transmission though, or just general electronic gremlins on the early W212. Are there special electrical things to be wary of on the E63 compared to a standard E-class, or is it pretty much the same issues for all E-class that can also effect the E63? I'm definitely having mixed thoughts here, the E63 seems rather robust but I want to know if some of these issues can be somewhat permanently fixed or if I'll be replacing certain things regularly at some interval.

homeofstone

Check the console knob for the Navi infotainment system. Its a common problem. Mine went bad after about a month and was a 600.00 repair. Also since it has sold tappets I add 6 ounces of Lucas Zinc additive with each oil change and use 5w40 euro spec oil. Transmission service every 40k miles is necessary and so is rear diff. service. I have no issues with oil consumption, mine uses about a quart every 2000 miles(normal) and I change oil every 5000 miles. W212 Pano roofs have a plastic part that breaks in the mechanism and is about a 1000.00 repair.