rlevy

I am so jealous! Please let me know when Salt Lake City or Boise come up as possibilities.

Cylinder Head

iTrader: (1)

This is absolutely huge news. Knocking on the door of 9’s on stock turbos just shows how powerful the transmission tuning is.

billvp218

I thought the tcu tuned cars were only crediting ~ 0.15 ET and no trap speed to the TCU tune. That is certainly meaningful for ET, but it seems like the e85 tune part is getting lost in the discussion.

brutus_tx

Agreed to a degree. In the quarter, the TCU has been seen to improve times by upwards of 0.3 seconds (with one 0.4 sec), but that only affects the elapsed time. The enhanced trap speeds we are seeing are due 100% to the Ethanol tunes being run currently. We've seen an improvement in trap speed upwards of 4 to 6 mph over the quarter.

An Ethanol tune/TCU tune combination is a potent mix and represents the best return on investment for hp/performance for this platform.

billvp218

Ah, well 0.3s is even better if that's the average. That is all on the low end 0-30 part I guess. I've never really understood why a better 60ft doesn't correspond to a better trap speed, but for those looking for a holeshot advantage, that's certainly a reason to get the TCU tune. For those who most often race from a roll or care more about highway power, that 136 trap is very nice and the e85 kit & tune seems to be what they should be looking at. For those who have enough spare change, why not both.

I believe the other benefits noted of the TCU tune are firmer shifts and reducing lag off throttle. Greatly reducing lag off throttle is just about enough reason for me to pay $1800 (I have a rwd so the stock TCU limitations probably help me on street tires), although I'd like to drive someone's who has it to check the difference.

Anyone know what kind of dyno numbers it takes to get a 136mph trap?

brutus_tx

Without the benefit of having seen a dyno of this tune... I expect its solidly in the 790 to 810 AWHP range if I had to guess.

e65

full weight minus spare tire kit, 780whp superflow dyno, 3 runs
135.56mph, 137.20mph, 137.24mph. runs 2 and 3 on a cooler day.

billvp218

which car is this with?
780 on an engine dyno?

e65

2014 E63, dyno read 780 wheel, 924 engine on 98 RON tune. It wasnt engine dyno, it has a way of estimating drivetrain loss. At higher power it estimates smaller loss it's not a fixed number like 15%

billvp218

Okay, this is not the car in the thread then, but a similar car with similar trap speeds which you are using to answer my question around required power to get that trap speed. Thank you for that information.

I hadn't heard of a superflow and a quick search looked like they make engine dynos. For the other type (chassis / rolling load) of superflow, I'm not sure how they compare with the more common dynojet ... I've read some people saying around the same, some saying 25whp lower, some saying 10%-20% lower, etc., and most of the results are from over 10yrs ago so who knows how more recent software & updates to the dynos make them compare.

nota_amg

It's been proven over and over again...chassis dynos are only useful for seeing either improvements or degradation in power while tuning, nothing more. There are too many variables. An engine Dyno is the only true way to measure power output. Math(using quarter mile et, speed and vehicle weight) is a fairly good second choice.

billvp218

That is a tired argument based on old data & systems. It has been shown that dynojet numbers are repeatable at different locations and different conditions (with standard correction factors), within reason.

An engine dyno is great for comparing power on the same car, but ignores drivetrain losses which differ between cars & also is not exactly convenient. DA affects 1/4 mile times & trap speeds, etc. There's nothing perfect.

This is a tangential discussion though which is straying off-topic from the congratulatory post around the run. I just wanted to know about the power required for the trap speeds shown.

brutus_tx

I'll see if I can get a dyno, if one exists.

brutus_tx

Sorry the response took so long...
The suspension set up on this car is nothing special, just HR springs and lowering links, plus KMac camber plates in the front.
They are noisy little buggers though.

https://k-mac-camber-kits.com/produc...gory/mercedes/

Marine 1

Ok Whats the build consist of? The car mentioned in the post is running stock turbos, Stock intake and filters. Time slips, dragy and dyno sheets would help for transparency. Thx

maxknuckles

Build is nothing crazy from what I remember, talking Eurocharged e85 ECU tune and Eurocharged TCU tune and some tires

Marine 1

Not sure who your referring to but for me its E65 not ECATX.

Waiting patiently for the reply for a apple to apple comparison. Thx

e65

that car has a lot of upgrades, forged internals, ball bearing turbos, fuel system, dual intercoolers, intake, meth, full exhaust.

780whp at 20 psi getting up to 137 trap, that means Eurocharged car is comparable WHP with OEM turbos.

Marine 1

Wow that German tax hurts ouch! This platform has recently taken off so maybe the options weren't available. This speak volumes about American ingenuity versus German engineering. is your cars TCU upgraded? I would assume so to be at that level of performance minus the wasted and non performing bolt on just goes to show everyone what the M157 platform has to offer as an *** kicker. Anyway nice runs and thx for sharing.

e65

it has tcu tune and ecu tunes for 20psi and 27psi. My intent was not to compare cars - rather to answer question re how much wheel horsepower the EC car is probably making.

SAMzE63s

Sooooo when can I see your car lol

brutus_tx

E65, I appreciate you bringing your GAD build experiences into the thread. It's nice to have a build to reference against, and yours is a pretty good performance metric.

Do you have the car back yet?

maxknuckles

I'm confused how the GAD and Eurocharged car are both hitting the same trap speed when both are fuel ECU tune and TCU tuned but one has built engineer with upgraded turbos. Maybe I'm missing something

brutus_tx

The GAD build is running regular gas, the EC ATX build is running E85. That's it in a nutshell.

Ethanol is the great equalizer here.

maxknuckles

BRB ordering e85 kit 😂 hows the car holding up at this power level w/ stock internal tranny rear end Brutus?