Veselin89

Hello MB guys,

I'm currently driving E350 W212 CGI 4Matic M276 306 PS. It's a great car, but the power and sportage I miss regularly. So, believe E63 could be a good choice as combines a lot of comfort with a lot of sport. I found two such cars in Europe, around 50-80 000 Mileage.
So, my question is what to look after when buying such a car and where are the weak sides, and what to expect as an owner in terms of problems(i see there is such thread but for W212 facelift and this one is pre-face).


Engine
- Head bolts to be checked - 1569xx60 060658
- premature wear of the cylinder heads, at what mileage?
Gearbox - 7 Speed MCT - is it relaiable, should i expect any known issues, service internal should be 40,000 Miles?
Suspension - There are different settings, but in general could it be more comfortable than my E350 with standard magnetic suspension?
Any other issues?

Thank you.

Rehabguy

Aside from head bolts I surely do not know what else you should watch out for when looking for a M156 powered E63. However, what I can comment on is that if you are looking for a more comfortable car than your current one, you might have to look elsewhere. I have come across a few different threads where members have literally complained about the roughness of the E63 vs the non-AMG models they had previously owned. And it makes sense, the AMG is supposed to be the sports model. Sports suspension should not be plush.

PeterUbers

E350 has a magnetic suspension?

brewster411

In addition to the headbolts, the valve buckets can stick and cause damage to the camshafts, and the cam adjuster plates can wear out.

The suspension is stiff and rough roads can be harsh even with the suspension set to the softest mode. The handling is definitely dialed in for sport and not comfort. If you're looking for a comfy ride, this might not be the car for you.

Krakenjack

• Front Cross Strut - This is a lower control arm connected from the frame of the body to a ball joint on the wheel assembly. The bushing is a known failure every 30-50k
• Front rotors - OEM is 2 piece. If someone put 1 pieces on an e63 they went cheap as ****. Those save-a-lot brand rotors are likelt y crap so check for warping and lipping.
• Get last known date of transmision oil change
• Get last known date of new plugs
• Get last known date of rear diff fluid servicing
• Check passenger side diff for leaks (front)
• check pinion seal on front diff
• Do a hard launch on test drive. MANDATE it. Not race mode but S+ full gas click to WOT. If it feels like your *** hit the dirt, new trans mount. Since you're in there doing mounts, get new engines too. OEM only. If you're an idiot, get hard. youll love it then youll hate it.
• Valve cover gasket, check for leakages
• Get it on a lift and inspect the entirety of the air suspension with the wheels off.
• **** it when were the last time the brakes actually were chainged? Oil?

Longg story short - get service records. ALOT of this stuff happened to me. ALOT of this stuff did not. It's about 50/50. I have been reading these fourms and blogs and I can tell you my stupid IT guy brain has seen the "what is an issue" and "what is neglected mantinance you god damn clown".

Pay. To. Play.

It's a 50k car now.

It was 130k when it was new.

When it breaks.

IT IS 130,000.

I suckered up and bought a dealer warranty, so far... it cost me 100$ and saved me 2k worth the work (will scan in receipts when i get to my office on monday). The entirety of it was without question or issue. I have had similar experiences with Ford, but that was a Ford warranty. Chrysler is a ********** with my Alfa warranty and it's a Chrsyler warranty... So milage may vary.

either way, budget a monthly payment, increased insurance, AND the cost of living.

You can rent a house, great. Sucks if you can't turn the lights on.

PeterUbers

Don't buy a used e63

Krakenjack

But god damn - do i love this car lol...

JimFE

Buy a good one with service records and clear evidence of proper maintenance. Get a PPI. No different than any other used car. Know a good independent mechanic that uses OEM parts, it won't be cheap to service, but won't bankrupt you either.

Bahnstormer

Me too.

I.T. Guy

No it doesn’t make sense to buy a used E63. We are nuts.
It also takes someone with a screw loose to buy a $130,000 600 HP sedan / station wagon new.

Yet here we are.

Buy it! Write checks to make the bad stuff go away when it happens. And enjoy.

Or, read Consumer Reports and buy something else.

Tork?

Buy a cheap scanner and plug it in at the dealer. Check for readiness factors to make sure they didn’t just clear codes and to check for any stored codes. Obviously cars with service records is reassuring. Plan on making small maintenance on a 50k+ mile car like sensors, gaskets, thermostat. It helps to keep costs down if you’re reasonably mechanically inclined. For example I bought an 83k mile 2011 and in 6 months I’ve replaced both valve cover gaskets, a couple cam sensors, and a cam solenoid. A few hundred $ in cost doing it myself vs a couple thousand $ if I took it somewhere.

PeterUbers

Scope and pressure test the cylinders

send engine oil off for testing

I mean... it never ends

i suspect the OP coming from an e350 doesn't wrench his own engines ... he will be paying an Indy to repair his car

Veselin89

Thanks for the feedback, i've collected a lot of info for the potential purchase. @Rehabguy @brewster411 @Krakenjack @JimFE @Bahnstormer @I.T. Guy @Tork? @PeterUbers

@PeterUbers yes, Independent multi-link.
@Rehabguy I've been looking to C43\C63, but doubt C class could provide the comfort of E-class. And this engine is the last of his era. Not sure which model could combine sport and comfort, facelift W212 any better?

PeterUbers

what are your overall goals? Performance? What is your budget for the purchase -- what is then your 5 year ownership budget?

let's start there.

Rehabguy

Guys, slightly off topic, but how awesome does that white M156 sound?! I love it! also, that whipple s/c!

brewster411

You might consider an E550. They had air springs all around (rather than coil springs in the front) and should be tuned for a more comfortable ride. 2012+ should be turbocharged IIRC. You can tune it for more power pretty easy and get near the power of the 6.2L.

PeterUbers

+100

you can far exceed e63S stock performance with the 4.7L - ecu and tcu tune and black boost intakes ... also some e550 had springs, I bought my two 2014 e550's with springs to avoid air tragic issues - they were sport tuned and amazing

e550 is a great recommendation, 2012+ so you get the m278 ttv8 engine

sickSVT

Gotta love cammed M156's.

6_Myles

If you do your own wrenching and have a little bit of extra disposable income, I think a M156 E63 is a great platform....for a european super sedan, they are fairly easy to work on and reliable once the known issues are addressed. They sound amazing, are plenty fast for me, and delivery a pretty timeless aesthetic at a reasonable price point.

If you do not do your own wrench and do not have disposable income, I think they are a terrible platform....lol.

Every high horsepower car has their own flavor of issues, you just need to decide if you like that flavor.

Rehabguy

I love it! I am jealous! Are there cams that make them chop harder?

sickSVT

These are the largest cams you can run without changing out valve springs or doing any head work. Tuning is required.

Rehabguy

Bahnstormer

A picture's worth a thousand words.

Veselin89

@PeterUbers I can spend around 30K Eur\40K $ for initial purchase and I am aware of the cost of support of such a car, just don't want to spend a lot of time in the maintenance garage for issues. Of course, my budget is limited, so looking to buy the most fresh car for the money. Still, I want performance and comfort - sometimes go on the track for fun(i used to have Evo X) but not a serious racer, so this is more likely to be a daily car with some regular urban rides and a desire to have fun from time to time.

Hope it doesn't go off topic as It was mentioned E550, which is also a good option, but have to check the reliability of this engine.
Also, speaking about comfort, doesn't the AirMatic be the one that provides it, I also think it gives more sportage feeling than normal springs as it can go up and down, right or wrong?

Lastly: If go for 550 models, what do you think of CLS 550, better than E550 in terms of comfort, performance(guess not)?

@Rehabguy @sickSVT whatever we say, there is nothing like M156 sound and feel, it is so amazing!

Rehabguy

This is my first car with any sort of air suspension, so, I don't know much about how full air suspension should feel. My personal opinion is that this is a waste. I think the AMGs should have come with regular spring suspension in all 4 corners. I for one would love to throw KW V3 in it and completely get rid of the air bags. In terms of how they go up and down, it's not really like they travel 5" up and down. I believe it only serves the purpose of compensating for rear sag secondary to heavy loads (I could be mistaken). I don't find the ride in the E63 luxurious in any way.
The CLS is basically the E with a sloped rear deck minus 1 seat.