BlackHammer

Guys,

I need some advice on troubleshooting. I will try to make this brief (not my strong-suit). Something is not right...

A/C works terrible after the car runs for a while and/or I am in stop and go traffic or driving around town at low speeds.

At startup it blows ice cold air. This seems to be opposite of what others experience as it takes a while to cool then stays cold.

Checked the freon levels, calibrated the system to 2.6 ambient, and the radiator coolant is full per suggestions in some PM's.

Add to all this (and most troublesome) if I just drive around side streets (speed limit 30 or so) for 10-15 minutes to run an errand when I get home, pop the hood, my engine bay tank is actually very warm and sometimes hot.

I recognize in stop and go traffic or city driving the revs are down so this must be a common thread.

Again, something ain't right!

Thanks,
TK

BlackHammer

Guys,

Hold on, hold on...

I was able to find some links with this topic on this forum and the SVT Forum. The description in the MB Forum appears to be exactly the same is mine but the final responder suggested the problem was due to the H/E (which was removed and problem solved).

******My H/E has already been removed from the car****

https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...g-c-temps.html

http://www.svtperformance.com/forums...iller-problems

Thanks for any suggestions.

TK

jcjmw

I have had the KC for awhile now and yes, in the summer, it takes extra time before it blows cold or colder. It blows colder when the car is moving. But, my tank water is always below ambient or warm. But, I have never had that tank water hot to the touch with the KC operating.

Is there a way you can bypass the water lines to the KC, so that the AC is no longer used to cool your tank water? If you can, do it and see if your cold or colder air returns.

ItalianJoe1

Sounds like you have an a/c side issue if the KC isn't cooling your tank. What are the pressures like at idle/2500 rpms?

vioilio

Is your AUX fan working? What are your EXACT pressures (LOW and HIGH side)? When reading those I would need you to note your exact outside air temperature as well.

Hulk

Is the ac in the car cold? If it is then it is probably the expansion block for the KC is faulty which happens

BlackHammer

Thanks for the replies.

The KC worked awesome right away. It was installed about a month ago and when I got home after running the car hard the engine bay tank was cold to the touch! Somewhat of a downhill spiral since then as I noticed the tank was less and less cool when I would check it. Here we are...

Thanks - I have never done the work. I will investigate.

Thanks - at idle the liquid in the tank hardly moves. When the engine gets aggressively tacked up it does circulate but never held the throttle steady at 2,500 rpm. Investigating.

Thanks - I am not sure. I don't have the -10 degree mod and the fan has only come on 1 time that I recall. I will investigate exact pressures.

Thanks - This is actually interesting question and there is detail I left out.

As stated the ac in the car blows cold air (ice cold) almost immediately on start up.

If I immediately get on the freeway it continues to blow cold but gradually gets warmer. When this occurs it isn't as warm as in "stop and go" but it is indeed warmer.

Finally, after stop and go (and the car blowing warm air) the A/C never really ever gets cold again.

jcjmw

Is your pump working? Even if the KC is working, the tank water will warm up if the pump is not working,

vioilio

AUX fan should work always and all the time when the a/c is on.

ItalianJoe1

Good call. If the pump is out the KC could be freezing up as the system cools down, I don't know how much the expansion valve on it relies on warm water coming in.

Hulk

I had the ic pump go bad and although on wot I would get hot water but in stop and go traffic it would be fine unless it's totally dead but here the ac stops working, check the expansion block. Kincaid knows those go bad

BlackHammer

The pump is a new Mez that is 4 months old (2,500 miles on it) but as we know things break...
Hulk, help me on this, from a mechanical standpoint I am a mental midget. Where is the "expansion block"? What do I check to see if the pump is working?

Thanks,
TK

Hulk

Look in the tank is the water flowing?

Expansion block is part of the KC which Kincaid has in his kit. Mine was faulty and had to be changed out. Almost the same situation I had. Make sure with a mb tech if the compressor is engaging as you also can have an ac compressor going out

BlackHammer

Thanks, I just went out and took a look (video'd the engine bay tank). No movement at idle or when I revved the engine and held it at various RPM and then tacked it up.

Car was stone cold on startup and within 5-6 minutes the liquid in the engine bay tank was warm (steam coming from the engine bay tank) and the temp outside is 75 degrees. Does all this lead to IC pump?

ItalianJoe1

No movement in the tank is a pretty clear sign, yes. You could also try opening the bleeder valves on the intercoolers, if the pump works the coolant will shoot out of there.

N/M, forgot it's not a v12 here lol

Try to feel the pump, it should be buzzing noticably when running. I am not 100% sure if it runs all the time on the E55, I know on the V12 it isn't on until in boost/high rpms. Maybe jump the relay and see what happens.

Hulk

Is the ac working inside the cabin?
You may have 2 issues if so, one the pump obviously and if no ac in the cabin then the compressor

1ForcedBenz

Now how could anyone look at the AC compressor and know if it's engaged??

Hulk

You can check with star or look if the clutch is engaged while the car is running

BlackHammer

hulk, thanks for the detailed response. Greatly appreciated. I will check it out to the best of my ability. I spoke to the tech who did the work today (best mechanic in the upper Midwest) and he agrees we are in "funky town"....

1ForcedBenz

Even with the star it doesn't show if its truly engaged. It shows what its commanded to be doing and at what %.

Why check all these things when since the system was just worked on / opened up to recover and check the charge weight and make sure there's been no leaks. And also more helpful direction would be to check the evap temp sensor via sds. And if you check the wire down to the compressor and find voltage with your gauges hooked up you'll know if its engaged.

But to the OP, if this guy is the best tech around he should be able to spend 20 mins with the car and have it figured out. Or since he worked on it should be the only one that knows what he did and what exactly to be checking -- Not everyone over the internet.

Hulk

With ac turned on you can see if the clutch is engaged. The tech should easily find if there's a problem with the ac itself.

BlackHammer

1ForedBenz,

Appreciate your thoughts and perspective (as well as Hulks). What are your credentials on the topic? Do you have a KC in a 113K?

As far as "everyone over the internet" let's not forget this is a user/technical Forum where we look for advice from others. My original post was less than 48 hours ago. IMHO, a pretty basic first step is to do some research, get feedback from others who have a similar set-up, see if anyone has experienced similar issues, and then bring the matter to the attention of the technician who did the work (who is a friend that is about 45 minutes from where I am at). This fellow had an E55 but never a KC install for all it matters...

IMHO this is way better than calling him and simply saying "there is a problem with the KC" and all the suggestions in this thread (which he has likely seen) will help him with his troubleshooting.

At any rate, I appreciate everyone's help and suggestions on this topic.

TK

jcjmw

good luck! and report back what happens. I am curious as to the solution.

CerBErusM113

Hate to bring up recharging it but the KC could be leaking. When I installed mine I had to retighten the fittings into the KC to get it to not leak freon, also bought some AC o-rings for the Temp Exchange Valve (TXV) fitting and used some silicone calk on it for good measure. Mine doesn't leak anymore.

Also from what I understand, if your AC is leaking freon that means air is able to get in the system (don't quote me but makes sense) With air comes moisture and it will eventually stop cooling as much as it did when first charged. I went through a few attempted recharges before I figured out where the leaks were. Also, I replaced my TXV and had to wrap it around the coolant line fitting again. Still playing with it on whether I want to wrap it tighter or loser to see how much freon is let into the KC. But that's my .02

In slightly related developments I'm going to pull the H/X out of the system again tonight and just use the KC as cooling. See how my AC runs because with the H/X in, the AC has been running great so very interested to see if it can maintain that while being my primary cooling source as well.

BlackHammer

If your A/C is working well and the Killer Chiller is working to your satisfaction I would NOT mess with pulling the H/X I wold ask "what is the upside in doing this?" IAT's 25 degrees under ambient versus 20 degrees?

The results may be very undesirable.