C320 finishes 5th of 6 in Car and Driver Comparo
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From: Stockton, CA
2002 C230, 6 Speed, Bose Stereo, 6 CD Changer
C320 finishes 5th of 6 in Car and Driver Comparo
The latest issue of Car and Driver has the C320 finsihing 5th of 6 cars in their latest sedan comparo. BMW 330i finished first, Audi A4 3.0 CVT (Continuously Variable Transmission) second, Acura 3.2CL Type-S third, Infiniti G-35 fourth, MB C320 fifth, and VW Passat W-8 4Motion finished last.
Some positive comments about the C320 included "quick-thinking transmission, supple ride, sports-car brakes." Negative comments included "delinquent body motions, mushy throttle response, a window sticker from hell."
I have a coupe, I don't have a window sticker from hell or delinquent body motions, but I have noticed too much delay in the throttle response when trying to drive fast through twisty mountain roads.
I would say my coupe has a firm ride and sports car brakes.
For me the BMW was not roomy enough and too expensive compared to the MB C230 coupe.
I think I got a great car at a good price.
Some positive comments about the C320 included "quick-thinking transmission, supple ride, sports-car brakes." Negative comments included "delinquent body motions, mushy throttle response, a window sticker from hell."
I have a coupe, I don't have a window sticker from hell or delinquent body motions, but I have noticed too much delay in the throttle response when trying to drive fast through twisty mountain roads.
I would say my coupe has a firm ride and sports car brakes.
For me the BMW was not roomy enough and too expensive compared to the MB C230 coupe.
I think I got a great car at a good price.
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From: Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
2005 smart cabrio; 2008 Mercedes-Benz B 200
C 230 K
Yeah, the C 230 K seems to be awfully good value compared to the C 240, at least here in Canada. The engine is stronger, the car is far faster, the fuel economy potential if higher especially on the highway, the suspension is nicer, the body design is more sporty and...provocative....and all this for a sticker price that's $4000 CDN less than the C 240 Classic with its steel wheels/hubcaps.
Our 2002 Magma Red C 230 K cost about $23 K US with rain sensor and panorama roof. It seems to be a very good value for the $. A great car for a great price!
Our 2002 Magma Red C 230 K cost about $23 K US with rain sensor and panorama roof. It seems to be a very good value for the $. A great car for a great price!
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From: Earth
GLB 250 4matic
the mb wasn't even in the edmund's comparison. but it correlates w/ the car & driver article.
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/compa...9/article.html
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/compa...9/article.html
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From: All Around Dallas-Fort Worth
2002 C230K, 2001 Audi TT 225 Coupe
I realize this is relative but
the the Coupe does not have a firm ride. It is supple, but at speed or just around corners, too many ups and downs and too much roll - that is why some owners are going to Kleemann springs and Eibach sway bars - which will be my first major mod before pulleys - I'll wait till a decent chip/pulley combo comes out - hopefully GIAC will come out with something that works well with one of these pulleys or maybe the chip alone will do the trick.
As to the comparo, it's all subjective, but I still think a well equipped C320 should be no more than 37k with leather, roof and fold down rear seat.
As to the comparo, it's all subjective, but I still think a well equipped C320 should be no more than 37k with leather, roof and fold down rear seat.
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From: Canada
The Car and Driver comparison was poorly done. They did not even follow their own rating system. They said the MB had great brakes - it even had the shortest stopping distance of all the cars yet they gave it 8 and the BMW got 10. Then they said the transmission was really nice on the MB but on the BMW they said it was not so great. Yet they gave the BMW higher marks again. The BMW was also rated higher for ergonomics - even with those silly window switches mounted next to the transmission. This is not good ergonomics. I think they need some new reviewers at Car and Driver. People that know how to be objective when the facts are right in front of them. The BMW is a fine car but the MB deserved a much better rating than it received.
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Good observations, viper. For my part, I have two thoughts:
1) Well, at least the C320 made the list. The IS300 did not... with or without its new (for 2003) manual tranny.
2) Since when does the Acura 3.2CL Type S qualify as a "sedan?"
I assume it's not a typo for the TL, which is a 4-door sedan. I don't intend to buy the rag to find out which it is.
My boss drives a 3.2TL Type S. Yes, the C320 costs $10K more, but when we go to lunch, the boss invariably asks to ride in my car.
1) Well, at least the C320 made the list. The IS300 did not... with or without its new (for 2003) manual tranny.
2) Since when does the Acura 3.2CL Type S qualify as a "sedan?"
I assume it's not a typo for the TL, which is a 4-door sedan. I don't intend to buy the rag to find out which it is.My boss drives a 3.2TL Type S. Yes, the C320 costs $10K more, but when we go to lunch, the boss invariably asks to ride in my car.
Last edited by MB-BOB; Sep 17, 2002 at 09:51 AM.
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From: Afghanistan / South Florida / Camp Lejeune, NC
2008 BMW M6, 2008 Ducati 1098, 2008 Ducati Monster S2R1000, 1971 Ducati Scrambler
Car and Driver gave the BMW 330i first place, what a shocker!
Car and Driver is among the most bias magazine on the news stands today.
Car and Driver is among the most bias magazine on the news stands today.
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Originally posted by MB-BOB
1) Well, at least the C320 made the list. The IS300 did not... with or without its new (for 2003) manual tranny.
1) Well, at least the C320 made the list. The IS300 did not... with or without its new (for 2003) manual tranny.
If I used Buellwinkle's criteria for buying a car I would have the IS300. Much better dealer provided goodies. Like a free buffet and ****tail hour monthly.
Last edited by Lynn; Sep 16, 2002 at 09:15 PM.
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Originally posted by Accord
Car and Driver gave the BMW 330i first place, what a shocker!
Car and Driver is among the most bias magazine on the news stands today.
Car and Driver gave the BMW 330i first place, what a shocker!
Car and Driver is among the most bias magazine on the news stands today.
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GLB 250 4matic
Originally posted by viper
The BMW was also rated higher for ergonomics - even with those silly window switches mounted next to the transmission. This is not good ergonomics. .
The BMW was also rated higher for ergonomics - even with those silly window switches mounted next to the transmission. This is not good ergonomics. .
on the other hand, i find the touchshift of mb to be far superior ergonomically compared to bmw's craptronic, audi's tiptronic and jag's j gate.
i don't understand the criticism that one magazine is biased... as far as i can tell, in general, ALL the magazines seem to like the bmws better. are they all biased?
Last edited by young; Sep 17, 2002 at 12:20 PM.
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2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
Originally posted by young
i don't understand the criticism that one magazine is biased... as far as i can tell, in general, ALL the magazines seem to like the bmws better. are they all biased?
i don't understand the criticism that one magazine is biased... as far as i can tell, in general, ALL the magazines seem to like the bmws better. are they all biased?
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From: Colorado
Originally posted by Accord
Car and Driver gave the BMW 330i first place, what a shocker!
Car and Driver is among the most bias magazine on the news stands today.
Car and Driver gave the BMW 330i first place, what a shocker!
Car and Driver is among the most bias magazine on the news stands today.
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From: Westwood, NJ
2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
Originally posted by CoryU
Of course the WRX is a hell of a lot cheaper than the audi, but in all reality, what true enthusiast with $40 K is going to buy a subaru over an audi?
Of course the WRX is a hell of a lot cheaper than the audi, but in all reality, what true enthusiast with $40 K is going to buy a subaru over an audi?
At some point, reality has to set in, and a "true enthusiast" would pick the Scooby for that exact reason. Can you imagine what kind of uber-STi you could make with $40k? You could even fix the headlights and make the interior somewhat-classy.
IMHO, the person who would pick the Audi either is a snob, or wants more luxury than the Scooby could offer, which is the opposite of a true enthusiast.
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From: Canada
Originally posted by young
you keep saying this... but to me, the central location is arguably better. the left hand is always on the wheel, while the right hand does all the other manipulations like shifting, messing w/ buttons, etc.
you keep saying this... but to me, the central location is arguably better. the left hand is always on the wheel, while the right hand does all the other manipulations like shifting, messing w/ buttons, etc.
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From: Colorado
Originally posted by tommy
Well, I'd think that a tuning company like you guys would want the buyer to buy the cheaper car, then add $15k in your products to make it beat the crap out of the more expensive car.
At some point, reality has to set in, and a "true enthusiast" would pick the Scooby for that exact reason. Can you imagine what kind of uber-STi you could make with $40k? You could even fix the headlights and make the interior somewhat-classy.
IMHO, the person who would pick the Audi either is a snob, or wants more luxury than the Scooby could offer, which is the opposite of a true enthusiast.
Well, I'd think that a tuning company like you guys would want the buyer to buy the cheaper car, then add $15k in your products to make it beat the crap out of the more expensive car.
At some point, reality has to set in, and a "true enthusiast" would pick the Scooby for that exact reason. Can you imagine what kind of uber-STi you could make with $40k? You could even fix the headlights and make the interior somewhat-classy.
IMHO, the person who would pick the Audi either is a snob, or wants more luxury than the Scooby could offer, which is the opposite of a true enthusiast.
I guess that would make me a snob then. I would buy a german car over an asian one any day of the week. Why did you buy the german machine over the asian?
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From: Westwood, NJ
2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
Cory, point me to something comparable to a ccoupe that's offered by a Japanese company, and I'll buy it. It has to have: nice sunroof, manny, seating for 4 real people, three doors, decent power, and a foldable rear seat for 20-30k. Other than a GTI, I didn't really find anything else that had all of that.
The Civic Type R is close, but not offered in US, and I didn't really want to go through a RSX Type S swap. I'd love to buy another Honda, but they've forgotten what made them popular in the 90s.
If I had $73k to buy a sportscar, it wouldn't be a Benz, though. Unless I could get that Brabus V8 stuffed into a ccoupe, and use a manny (not sure if the MB manny can handle the power).
The Civic Type R is close, but not offered in US, and I didn't really want to go through a RSX Type S swap. I'd love to buy another Honda, but they've forgotten what made them popular in the 90s.
If I had $73k to buy a sportscar, it wouldn't be a Benz, though. Unless I could get that Brabus V8 stuffed into a ccoupe, and use a manny (not sure if the MB manny can handle the power).
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From: Colorado
Originally posted by tommy
Cory, point me to something comparable to a ccoupe that's offered by a Japanese company, and I'll buy it. It has to have: nice sunroof, manny, seating for 4 real people, three doors, decent power, and a foldable rear seat for 20-30k. Other than a GTI, I didn't really find anything else that had all of that.
The Civic Type R is close, but not offered in US, and I didn't really want to go through a RSX Type S swap. I'd love to buy another Honda, but they've forgotten what made them popular in the 90s.
If I had $73k to buy a sportscar, it wouldn't be a Benz, though. Unless I could get that Brabus V8 stuffed into a ccoupe, and use a manny (not sure if the MB manny can handle the power).
Cory, point me to something comparable to a ccoupe that's offered by a Japanese company, and I'll buy it. It has to have: nice sunroof, manny, seating for 4 real people, three doors, decent power, and a foldable rear seat for 20-30k. Other than a GTI, I didn't really find anything else that had all of that.
The Civic Type R is close, but not offered in US, and I didn't really want to go through a RSX Type S swap. I'd love to buy another Honda, but they've forgotten what made them popular in the 90s.
If I had $73k to buy a sportscar, it wouldn't be a Benz, though. Unless I could get that Brabus V8 stuffed into a ccoupe, and use a manny (not sure if the MB manny can handle the power).
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From: Westwood, NJ
2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
Cory - I did give it some serious thought, especially the wagon, since you can't fold the rear seat on the sedan 
.
Couple of things held me up:
cheap (I mean Kia Rio!) fit/finish in interior, though in-dash cd changer is nice
afore-mentioned headlights - Pam Anderson's look more natural
sunroof is not available, and aftermarket is pretty much impossible; there is a crossbrace on the roof that goes where the roof would - you could do a sunroof, but it'd be tiny. I went back and forth with other members on i-club on this for weeks before it was agreed that it just wasn't worth it
Pluses were nice: factory short shift kit (working on getting one for ccoupe, though), and other STi parts that work and are warrantied if installed by dealer (expensive, but might be worth it for peace of mind); for $5k, it would beat pretty much any US Audi made; the Momo steering wheel alone was a huge benefit. It is a nice car; I've been to autoxes in my crx (a great car in its own right), and the WRXes hold their own.
It really came down mostly to the sunroof - I was very disappointed in that in the WRX; otherwise, it would have been a real contest between it and the ccoupe.
.Couple of things held me up:
cheap (I mean Kia Rio!) fit/finish in interior, though in-dash cd changer is nice
afore-mentioned headlights - Pam Anderson's look more natural
sunroof is not available, and aftermarket is pretty much impossible; there is a crossbrace on the roof that goes where the roof would - you could do a sunroof, but it'd be tiny. I went back and forth with other members on i-club on this for weeks before it was agreed that it just wasn't worth it
Pluses were nice: factory short shift kit (working on getting one for ccoupe, though), and other STi parts that work and are warrantied if installed by dealer (expensive, but might be worth it for peace of mind); for $5k, it would beat pretty much any US Audi made; the Momo steering wheel alone was a huge benefit. It is a nice car; I've been to autoxes in my crx (a great car in its own right), and the WRXes hold their own.
It really came down mostly to the sunroof - I was very disappointed in that in the WRX; otherwise, it would have been a real contest between it and the ccoupe.
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Former A4/528 driver
I've had my C320 wagon for about four months and I have a couple observations:
1. BMW felt more solid and definitely had better handling. However 528 was a little underpowered for wagon.
2. Ergonomics better on BMW and Audi. Controls etc. Also, seats more comfortable.
3. Doors and certain aspects of 320 feel cheap - surprising in a 40K car.
If I had to do it again, I'd buy a bimmer. Audi would be my second choice.
Good news is if I'm really sick of the car, I can always get rid of it on "Swapalease.com) - $499.99 payments/12K a year is an easy sell.
MBNewbii
2002 C320 Wagon Brilliant Silver/Gray/C2
1. BMW felt more solid and definitely had better handling. However 528 was a little underpowered for wagon.
2. Ergonomics better on BMW and Audi. Controls etc. Also, seats more comfortable.
3. Doors and certain aspects of 320 feel cheap - surprising in a 40K car.
If I had to do it again, I'd buy a bimmer. Audi would be my second choice.
Good news is if I'm really sick of the car, I can always get rid of it on "Swapalease.com) - $499.99 payments/12K a year is an easy sell.
MBNewbii
2002 C320 Wagon Brilliant Silver/Gray/C2
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From: Colorado
Tommy-
Very good reasons! I totally agree that the subie has super cheap interior bits. VERY dissapointing. I'm with you on the sunroof as well. It's a must have if you ask me.
The Benz is just nicer overall- better build quality, better components, better options. Plus, with our over-boost kit, springs, and sway bars, it makes for a fun little rocket sled that even outhandles my old Porsche 944 with ease! (not many stock new cars will). I won't even talk about the sluggish performance Porsche THOUGHT people would appreciate.
Very good reasons! I totally agree that the subie has super cheap interior bits. VERY dissapointing. I'm with you on the sunroof as well. It's a must have if you ask me.
The Benz is just nicer overall- better build quality, better components, better options. Plus, with our over-boost kit, springs, and sway bars, it makes for a fun little rocket sled that even outhandles my old Porsche 944 with ease! (not many stock new cars will). I won't even talk about the sluggish performance Porsche THOUGHT people would appreciate.
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From: Earth
GLB 250 4matic
Originally posted by viper
But the front doors have little cover plates where the switches should be.
But the front doors have little cover plates where the switches should be.
