will 3mm spacers fix the vibration ?
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 229
Likes: 0
From: Brisbane, Australia
C32
will 3mm spacers fix the vibration ?
I have 5mm H&R spacers, and a 35mm offset wheels on at the moment to allow clearence with the PSS9s and it vibrates at 100kmh even thought they have been balanced recently.
I pulled the wheel off and had a look at how the hub and wheels mate together, and if the wheel is not sitting correctly on the hub, I do not believe a hubcentric spacer will fix the problem on our cars as the hubcentric inside diameter on the hub sticks out 8mm, and with a 5mm spacer, and an angle cut into the first few mm of the wheel, they will not mate up, hence all the load will be on the wheel nuts ....... Please see the attached pic to try and explain what I mean.
Has anyone tried 3mm spacers, and this has fixed the vibration ?
I pulled the wheel off and had a look at how the hub and wheels mate together, and if the wheel is not sitting correctly on the hub, I do not believe a hubcentric spacer will fix the problem on our cars as the hubcentric inside diameter on the hub sticks out 8mm, and with a 5mm spacer, and an angle cut into the first few mm of the wheel, they will not mate up, hence all the load will be on the wheel nuts ....... Please see the attached pic to try and explain what I mean.
Has anyone tried 3mm spacers, and this has fixed the vibration ?
Last edited by steve_bris; Oct 20, 2007 at 03:49 AM.
Junior Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 54
Likes: 0
From: Ottawa, Ontario, Up North
2009 C300 4Matic
I had a similar issue with my Work wheels...
My dust cap was hitting the back of the wheel - Went to a machine shop and the dust cap in the front sticks out by 2-3 mm and does not go in all the way (it bottoms out before its sitting flush), must be a manufacturing default, the lip of my dust cap was machined (shaved 3mm I believe) and it now goes in 2-3mm more that fixed my issue... hope this makes sense ? if you are talking about the rears though I have no clue.
My dust cap was hitting the back of the wheel - Went to a machine shop and the dust cap in the front sticks out by 2-3 mm and does not go in all the way (it bottoms out before its sitting flush), must be a manufacturing default, the lip of my dust cap was machined (shaved 3mm I believe) and it now goes in 2-3mm more that fixed my issue... hope this makes sense ? if you are talking about the rears though I have no clue.
Junior Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
From: Frederick, MD
'10 W212 E350 4Matic SS, '12 W204 C63, '05 W203K Sport Sedan (Sold)
So the right side image is of the wheel? If it is, then you indicate the center bore is the same as your hub at 66.56 so you shouldn't have a centering problem. Are you running H&R TRAK+ 5mm spacers?
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 229
Likes: 0
From: Brisbane, Australia
C32
Yes the right side image is the wheel ..... and it has a center bore of 66.56 ....... but the problem is the hub is only 66.56 for 8 mm out , then it goes into a smaller diameter like 65mm or something for the rest of the hub ........ so with the 5mm spacer, and the angled indent of the wheel ..... the wheels ID of 66.56 is to big as it is sitting over the part of the hub that is like 65mm, which is causing the vibration.
Yeh they are H&R, and from memory of the box they are trak+ ..... not 100% sure though
Am going to order a set of 3mm now and see if they fix it.
Yeh they are H&R, and from memory of the box they are trak+ ..... not 100% sure though
Am going to order a set of 3mm now and see if they fix it.
Last edited by steve_bris; Oct 20, 2007 at 08:10 AM.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 229
Likes: 0
From: Brisbane, Australia
C32
I put the 3mm spacers in today and the extra 2 mm of exposed hub was enough to allow the wheels hubcentic sleeve to engage the hub, and correctly center the wheel .... so all vibration is gone.
These are the universal 3mm spacers ........ so does anyone know where to get 5*112 specific 3 mm spacers ?
These are the universal 3mm spacers ........ so does anyone know where to get 5*112 specific 3 mm spacers ?
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
2004 C230 Kompressor Sport sedan 6 speed manual, 2013 S550 Sport 20" AMG
I am having the same problem as steve bris. With a 5mm spacer on the front hubs, perfectly balanced tires (watched mechanic friend use a Hunter 9700 road force), vibration occurs at 40+ mph.
I did see that the first few mm of the hub tapers to the longer portion of the hub. The 5mm H&R spacers are machined to fit this thicker part (as are the wheels), so the wheel only sits on the longer, thinner part of the hub. I cannot use a 3mm spacer because with the 5mm spacer, the brake calipers only clear 3-4mm.
I noticed on the Tire Rack's website that the BBS LM wheels come with two 5mm spacers and two centering rings. I assume these centering rings account for the diameter loss of the hub that steve bris and I are referring to? Or are they used because the BBS center bore is significantly larger (70+mm)?
Luke, can you confirm? Can these centering rings be bought from the Tire Rack?
Thanks...
I did see that the first few mm of the hub tapers to the longer portion of the hub. The 5mm H&R spacers are machined to fit this thicker part (as are the wheels), so the wheel only sits on the longer, thinner part of the hub. I cannot use a 3mm spacer because with the 5mm spacer, the brake calipers only clear 3-4mm.
I noticed on the Tire Rack's website that the BBS LM wheels come with two 5mm spacers and two centering rings. I assume these centering rings account for the diameter loss of the hub that steve bris and I are referring to? Or are they used because the BBS center bore is significantly larger (70+mm)?
Luke, can you confirm? Can these centering rings be bought from the Tire Rack?
Thanks...
Last edited by Hokie1200; Sep 16, 2008 at 06:06 PM.
Trending Topics
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
2004 C230 Kompressor Sport sedan 6 speed manual, 2013 S550 Sport 20" AMG
I measured the inside diameter of the H&R spacer and it is right at 66 mm. It slides easily, yet closely, over the length of the hub, so I assume that part of the hub has even less diameter.
The wheel's inside hub bore is right around 66.6 mm. So, there must be about 0.6-1.0 mm of space between the hub and wheel center bore causing vibration.
I read on another thread about wrapping the hub in electrical/duct tape to eliminate this small difference and knock out the vibration.
Can anyone comment on this?
The wheel's inside hub bore is right around 66.6 mm. So, there must be about 0.6-1.0 mm of space between the hub and wheel center bore causing vibration.
I read on another thread about wrapping the hub in electrical/duct tape to eliminate this small difference and knock out the vibration.
Can anyone comment on this?
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
10 Most Reliable Mercedes-Benz Models You Can Buy Used
Verdad Gallardo
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,597
Likes: 18
From: So Cal... In between LA and OC
2005 CLK320 Vert & 2005 CLK55 AMG
I measured the inside diameter of the H&R spacer and it is right at 66 mm. It slides easily, yet closely, over the length of the hub, so I assume that part of the hub has even less diameter.
The wheel's inside hub bore is right around 66.6 mm. So, there must be about 0.6-1.0 mm of space between the hub and wheel center bore causing vibration.
I read on another thread about wrapping the hub in electrical/duct tape to eliminate this small difference and knock out the vibration.
Can anyone comment on this?
The wheel's inside hub bore is right around 66.6 mm. So, there must be about 0.6-1.0 mm of space between the hub and wheel center bore causing vibration.
I read on another thread about wrapping the hub in electrical/duct tape to eliminate this small difference and knock out the vibration.
Can anyone comment on this?
Do you have pics of what you are trying to explain?? that might help to get more responses here....
Super Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 617
Likes: 1
From: Burnaby
2002 CL203
If you are using 5mm hubcentric spacers installed correctly, you shouldn't have any problems. After you put your wheels back on are you guys torquing the bolts to spec? Torque wrench is your friend.
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
2004 C230 Kompressor Sport sedan 6 speed manual, 2013 S550 Sport 20" AMG
The 5mm spacer is hubcentric in that the center bore of it matches the hub. But the H&R spacer does not have the lip for the wheel to sit on like the 10mm spacer. I assume that lip is about 66.6mm (outside diameter) to match the wheel's center bore. Without that lip, the wheel rests on the hub flange with a diameter just shy of 66 mm. See pic.
The lugbolts are correct size and are torqued to spec (85 ft-lb.)
The lugbolts are correct size and are torqued to spec (85 ft-lb.)
Super Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 617
Likes: 1
From: Burnaby
2002 CL203
The 5mm spacer is hubcentric in that the center bore of it matches the hub. But the H&R spacer does not have the lip for the wheel to sit on like the 10mm spacer. I assume that lip is about 66.6mm (outside diameter) to match the wheel's center bore. Without that lip, the wheel rests on the hub flange with a diameter just shy of 66 mm. See pic.
The lugbolts are correct size and are torqued to spec (85 ft-lb.)
The lugbolts are correct size and are torqued to spec (85 ft-lb.)
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,597
Likes: 18
From: So Cal... In between LA and OC
2005 CLK320 Vert & 2005 CLK55 AMG
I've heard that the H&R 5mm spacers are not truly hubcentric, only the 10mm and bigger are, i heard this from of few of the performance shops in the area. You can probably get them custom made somewhere..
Also try using a hub ring, i tried that before, but couldn't find one that fit. If not id recommend the aluminum tape, it worked really well on my car...
Also try using a hub ring, i tried that before, but couldn't find one that fit. If not id recommend the aluminum tape, it worked really well on my car...
Senior Member
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 307
Likes: 0
From: NPR florida
C230k coupe 500sec convertible
Been there done this----you will have to get them custom made---period---5mm will give you a shake unless you slowly do a star pattern on the lug nuts while turning the tire in the air and hand tighten them a bit at a time, then really crank them down in the air by hand---you will also need RAD lug bolts that are the same quality as OEM otherwise you will snap nuts--especially considering the bolt holes are usually a predrilled 14mm.
that being said, 5mm are too big and allow rubbing, 3mm are what I needed in the front to fit my sl rims on the car w/o rubbing on the outside of the fender when hitting a bump, I believe the best thing is to get them made to fit right, or leave it stock
that being said, 5mm are too big and allow rubbing, 3mm are what I needed in the front to fit my sl rims on the car w/o rubbing on the outside of the fender when hitting a bump, I believe the best thing is to get them made to fit right, or leave it stock
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
2004 C230 Kompressor Sport sedan 6 speed manual, 2013 S550 Sport 20" AMG
The wheels are only 8" wide, offset is 29mm (24mm with the spacer) and with the 5mm spacer, the outside lip of the wheel is exactly inline with the outside lip of the fender. There is not a lot of clearance above the tire, but I have never rubbed. The Sport's suspension is fairly stiff.
The 5mm H&R spacer is not hubcentric in that it does not have the lip for the wheel to rest on, but it has a 66.56mm center bore to match the hub.
I am going to try lightly fixing the spacer to the wheel before install and using the aluminum tape around the hub.
I will report the results early next week...
The 5mm H&R spacer is not hubcentric in that it does not have the lip for the wheel to rest on, but it has a 66.56mm center bore to match the hub.
I am going to try lightly fixing the spacer to the wheel before install and using the aluminum tape around the hub.
I will report the results early next week...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9,498
Likes: 4
From: San Diego, CA & San Jose, Costa Rica & Stuttgart, Germany
1959 220S / 1979 230 G / 2002 A210 AMG / 2003 C320 SC / 2004.5 C320 SS / 2005 ML350 SE / 2008 smart
I think I have some new H&R 5mm spacers in box sitting in my attic
I'm pretty sure I didn't use them because they were not hub-centric.
I guess I can sell them if anyone needs them.
But with this thread I think most people are probably going to stay away from them.
Carlos
Saprissa@aol.com
I'm pretty sure I didn't use them because they were not hub-centric.
I guess I can sell them if anyone needs them.
But with this thread I think most people are probably going to stay away from them.
Carlos
Saprissa@aol.com
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
2004 C230 Kompressor Sport sedan 6 speed manual, 2013 S550 Sport 20" AMG
The wheels are only 8" wide, offset is 29mm (24mm with the spacer) and with the 5mm spacer, the outside lip of the wheel is exactly inline with the outside lip of the fender. There is not a lot of clearance above the tire, but I have never rubbed. The Sport's suspension is fairly stiff.
The 5mm H&R spacer is not hubcentric in that it does not have the lip for the wheel to rest on, but it has a 66.56mm center bore to match the hub.
I am going to try lightly fixing the spacer to the wheel before install and using the aluminum tape around the hub.
I will report the results early next week...
The 5mm H&R spacer is not hubcentric in that it does not have the lip for the wheel to rest on, but it has a 66.56mm center bore to match the hub.
I am going to try lightly fixing the spacer to the wheel before install and using the aluminum tape around the hub.
I will report the results early next week...
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 1,389
Likes: 1
'06 CLK500
I finally got around to glueing the 5mm spacer to the wheel (to center it perfectly) and taping the hub (to make the wheel fit hubcentric). I used electrical tape that had a perfect 3/4" width and wrapped the hub 4 times. The wheel would not go on the hub, so I took some off to make it 3 tape layers. The taped outer hub section was then the same diameter as the inside section of the hub (there was maybe a mm of difference before causing vibration). The wheel fit snug on the hub and the vibration is completely gone at all speeds. I am finally happy with these wheels
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
2004 C230 Kompressor Sport sedan 6 speed manual, 2013 S550 Sport 20" AMG
Thanks coin. I have been messing with these fronts on weekends since July. Spacers, then lugbolts, getting the right lugbolts, vibration, research, etc. All the while worried I spent money for nothing. While having direct fitting fronts would be nice, I need to spend $2K on other things besides this car. If nothing else, I have received an education in wheel/spacer fitment.
Newbie
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
W203 C180K
Hokia1200 - has the vibration come back at all? All sweet?
Did you tape from the portion of the hub "after the spacer"? E.g. Install spacer first, run tape around hub (19mm or 3/4inch) from border of spacer outwards (towards yourself)?
Did you tape from the portion of the hub "after the spacer"? E.g. Install spacer first, run tape around hub (19mm or 3/4inch) from border of spacer outwards (towards yourself)?
Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 105
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta
2004 C230 Kompressor Sport sedan 6 speed manual, 2013 S550 Sport 20" AMG
I glued the spacer to the wheel first so it was as centered as possible on the wheel (and hub once the wheel is on). Tape went on the thinner outer end of the hub so it was the same diameter as the inner part of the hub. There is only about 1-2 mm difference. The thicker inner part of the hub usually fits perfectly with the wheel's center bore, but the spacer covers that inner part.
Using electrical tape, I essentially made a hubcentric ring. I only made 3 wraps of the hub. 4 wraps was too thick for the wheel to go on. 3 was a snug fit. Hope that helps...
