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M271 Oil Filter Question...

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M271 Oil Filter Question...

 
Old 03-26-2009, 10:20 PM
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Guys - This is exactly what I was worried about with paper filters - They simply can't do what the fleece does. Jeff does not come from a dusty area and the moderate silicone levels (12ppm) show this to be true - Imagine if the dust levels had been high, the results would have been even worse - I don't buy Blackstones comments on normal filtration - yes, normal for paper. In fairness - they were not briefed on what we were doing here.

Anyway - reduce oil drains on paper filters until this is resolved - you obviously can't go 13,000 miles - I would like to see Jeffs next sample at 8,000 to get a trend.

Interesting, fortuitous timing - I had dinner last night with Phillip Johnson. One of Donaldson's global VPs from the US - He's a pom I've known for 20 years, & Andre Wessels his local Ops Manager. Mann + Hummel is well known to Donaldson. I raised the issue of Hengst paper vs. Mann fleece with them & they concur that the paper filter is not going to cut it for long drain - especially 20,000 Km or 13,000 miles.

Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; 03-26-2009 at 10:23 PM.
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeff W View Post
.... This is the first time I have done a change since I bought the car used. The FSS said it was at 13,000 since the last change.
The car now has 44,000, and the old filter was paper. The results are pretty ugly. I think I am only going to go 8000 till the next change.
How sure are you that the oil was actually changed 13k ago (instead of just a reset) and that the correct oil was used? Oil analysis is a real science but it depends on correct assumptions to be valid....and one analysis does not make a trend. Remember, the numbers being reported are ppm....parts per million....so your engine isn't dissolving Have another analysis at 8K and see what you get, then another the next 8k and you have something to work with. I'm not familiar with the 4 cylinder numbers, and I sure wouldn't argue with Blackstone's expertise or experience (but I might disagree ) . With all the problems showing up in the 4 cylinder engines you owners would be wise to start documenting oil analysis results and see if you can pinpoint problems before they become failures. With Glyn's background maybe you could talk him into hosting a sticky/thread/repository for such an endeavor.
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:36 PM
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I will gladly get involved with issues OIL. Yes mleskovar - one swallow does does not make a spring which is why I would like to see a trend. This oil certainly has not done double distance or there would be other indicators like higher silicone. Jeff - do you have the cars service book? If so, does it appear to be in order?
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:43 PM
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BTW - It appears within reason to be Mobil 1 - it's 0W-40 & the additive signature is correct - the high temp Moly anti-ox is there. The detergeant/dispersant (Calcium) has taken a bit of a beating but I expect that in this case. Wish I could run my own IR scan.
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
...Interesting, fortuitous timing - I had dinner last night with Phillip Johnson. One of Donaldson's global VPs from the US - He's a pom I've known for 20 years, & Andre Wessels his local Ops Manager. Mann + Hummel is well known to Donaldson. I raised the issue of Hengst paper vs. Mann fleece with them & they concur that the paper filter is not going to cut it for long drain - especially 20,000 Km or 13,000 miles.
Seems counterintuitive that they’d discontinue the proper filter for an engine still in widespread use.
Perhaps it’s a vast conspiracy to hasten their demise and prompt new car purchases. ;-)

Fit a fresh Mann+Hummel to the M112 last Sunday:

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Old 03-26-2009, 10:56 PM
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good info
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:25 PM
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Originally Posted by splinter View Post
Seems counterintuitive that they’d discontinue the proper filter for an engine still in widespread use.
Perhaps it’s a vast conspiracy to hasten their demise and prompt new car purchases. ;-)

Fit a fresh Mann+Hummel to the M112 last Sunday:

Yes - the 6 cylinder & up fraternity is lucky. I don't understand MBUSA - It's almost as though they they are walking away from the 4 cylinder vehicle park in the US. If they want to run paper filters they should reduce drain intervals and let everyone know.

I drove into my dealer today to have my power steering fluid topped up. It squawked at me this morning at full right lock coming out of my garage. Idiots obviously did not top it up at the recent service - nice & quiet now. They are definitely still using fleece on the M271 here.
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
....They are definitely still using fleece on the M271 here...
I can see the headlines now....."South African cartel chief busted for smuggling fleece filters into the USA".
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Old 03-27-2009, 01:25 AM
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I recently bought a Fram filter for the M272. Should I return this? Is the K&N Fleece?
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Old 03-27-2009, 07:39 AM
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Yes - Get rid of the Fram - no good! The K&N is a Mann fleece repackaged. Just make sure it looks like the K&N & MANN pictures I posted early in the thread.
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Old 03-27-2009, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Yes - Get rid of the Fram - no good! The K&N is a Mann fleece repackaged. Just make sure it looks like the K&N & MANN pictures I posted early in the thread.
Thanks Glyn, Always a Big Help.
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Old 03-29-2009, 08:11 AM
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Just went to San Francisco's Parts Department (8th street and Folsom I believe) to pick up an oil filter. They're still selling the Mann Fleece oil filters. But for $25 a pop.
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Old 03-29-2009, 03:32 PM
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I recommend you stock up.
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Old 03-29-2009, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
I recommend you stock up.
That's a good price. I went to an auto store known as AutoZone and a K&N Oil filter was $25.00 and I said I rather go with the original.

I found this website it says all the parts are genuine and you can get an Oil Filter for $17.25 but I don't know if it fleece.

http://www.trademotion.com/partlocat...layCatalogid=0

I guess I can send them an E-Mail asking if it's fleece.
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Old 03-31-2009, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Guys - This is exactly what I was worried about with paper filters - They simply can't do what the fleece does. Jeff does not come from a dusty area and the moderate silicone levels (12ppm) show this to be true - Imagine if the dust levels had been high, the results would have been even worse - I don't buy Blackstones comments on normal filtration - yes, normal for paper. In fairness - they were not briefed on what we were doing here.

Anyway - reduce oil drains on paper filters until this is resolved - you obviously can't go 13,000 miles - I would like to see Jeffs next sample at 8,000 to get a trend.

Interesting, fortuitous timing - I had dinner last night with Phillip Johnson. One of Donaldson's global VPs from the US - He's a pom I've known for 20 years, & Andre Wessels his local Ops Manager. Mann + Hummel is well known to Donaldson. I raised the issue of Hengst paper vs. Mann fleece with them & they concur that the paper filter is not going to cut it for long drain - especially 20,000 Km or 13,000 miles.
The Mercedes dealer here also confirmed there are no more fleece filters for the M271. The paper filter is all that is offered by MBUSA. I didn't buy one yet, since I still have a couple more fleece filters in stock.

Unlike some others on this board, I live in an area with a lot of blowing sand and dust. This is why I change my oil and filter at 5000 mile intervals. I also change the air filter and cabin filter at short intervals, since they get dirty so fast.

So my question is: is the new paper oil filter good enough, given the short drain intervals, but extreme conditions? Mercedes is a fairly rare car here, so aftermarket parts are not too common. Of course I still use the 229.5 Mobil 1 0W-40 synthetic oil.

Incidentally, my BMW (M54 engine) also uses a paper oil filter element, but it is much larger than the Mercedes M271 filter.
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Old 03-31-2009, 05:56 PM
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If you are changing at 5000 miles & your air filtration is good you should be just fine. Have a sample or two analysed if you want a definitive answer.
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Old 03-31-2009, 06:45 PM
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...MBUSA sucks!
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Old 04-01-2009, 01:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
If you are changing at 5000 miles & your air filtration is good you should be just fine. Have a sample or two analysed if you want a definitive answer.
Thanks Glyn. I guess it is what it is. I will make the switch to paper after I use my last fleece filter element.

The Mercedes will stay home tomorrow anyway. We are expecting 60 mph winds and blowing sand. Nothing like the convenience of having the Chihuahua Desert on your front door step.
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Old 04-06-2009, 11:40 AM
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So is it safe to say that the fleece filters no longer exist for a 2005 1.8L? No one can seem to find one (including me). I'm tempted to just buy the M&H filter from germanfilters.com.

I alos found both the Mann and the Mahle filters here:

http://euro.bmpdes********/OEM/viewPr...pID=Oil+System

any difference in the two?

Last edited by Cholleman; 04-06-2009 at 11:45 AM.
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Old 04-06-2009, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Cholleman View Post
So is it safe to say that the fleece filters no longer exist for a 2005 1.8L? No one can seem to find one (including me). I'm tempted to just buy the M&H filter from germanfilters.com.
They do not seem to be available in the US anymore. I am not sure about other countries. So our only alternative is to find some old stock filters somewhere. I have not been successful, so far.

I used to buy a lot of parts (mostly Volkswagen) across the border in Ciudad Juárez, Chihuahua. The dealers there sometimes have parts unavailable in the US. Unfortunately, Juárez has now become so dangerous with violence that I haven't been there in over a year. When things settle down along the border, perhaps we can see if fleece filters are available through Mercedes Benz de México.
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Old 04-06-2009, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Cholleman View Post
So is it safe to say that the fleece filters no longer exist for a 2005 1.8L? No one can seem to find one (including me). I'm tempted to just buy the M&H filter from germanfilters.com.

I alos found both the Mann and the Mahle filters here:

http://euro.bmpdes********/OEM/viewPr...pID=Oil+System

any difference in the two?
Seems a problem in the US - All filters shown here including the M+H are paper - you can see they are paper & their price indicates they are paper. If you use these reduce you drain interval.
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Old 04-06-2009, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Seems a problem in the US - All filters shown here including the M+H are paper - you can see they are paper & their price indicates they are paper. If you use these reduce you drain interval.
an oil change is going to be necessary very soon. if i up the interval, what sounds prudent? half of what's recommended? could i just change the filter every 5K and change the oil every 13k?
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Old 04-06-2009, 01:29 PM
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Used filters work better than unused - so doing a halfway filter change makes no sense. Drop your change interval to 9000 miles & do an oil analysis when you have put on 9000 miles & see what the oil looks like. I'm hoping you guys won't have to halve drain interval.
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Old 04-09-2009, 12:36 PM
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Where to buy the fleece filter

Guys,

Where can I get this fleece filter? My service A is "due now", and every freakin dealer I've called (MB of Greenwich, White Plains Mercedes, and MB of Larchmont), they only have the paper one. I've also tried to google the part number, but no luck. Please help, thanks
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Old 04-09-2009, 08:28 PM
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I can't find it anywhere!
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