FIXEDupW209

im really interested in the ASP pulley and read somewhere about a meet with a free install.
id like to know how much the ASP pulley is gonna cost?
how much HP and torque gain there will be?
and if it can be later removed and changed back to stock.

also i would like an opinion from the owners who have changed their filter.

what filter adds more hp and makes the engine sound more aggressive? stock? k&n? itg?....


thanks

Lockbuster

Are you sure you have read all the threads about this pully?????

Buellwinkle

I went from 168 rwhp to 192 rwhp just with the ASP pulley. I also got 3 hp more from a K&N, a little more from an ITG drop in panel filter. That translates to about 230 HP, but the boost in torque was even greater. Count on 0-60 times in the low 6's. They have 3 pulleys but the one I have is the alloy with the steel hub and it costs $300 plus another $20 for a belt you can get at Pep Boys or any other auto supply store. As for sound you will get a more defined noticible s/c whine at full throttle, the rest of the time it's the same.

There was supposed to be a meet on 2/22 but I haven't seen anything else on that, I think the sponsor backed out. If you can make it to San Diego, Linh Nguyen can order and install the pulley for you. Call him at 619-972-4114, he's an authorized ASP pulley dealer and can answer all your questions.

FIXEDupW209

wow great thanks a lot...im really interested in this pulley, its a lot cheaper then the kleeman one. you said there are three type of ASP pulleys? whats the difference between the three and which do you recommend?
aslo i for sure will get the drop in air filter either before or after the pulley but should i go with ITG or K&N and where can i get a ITG air filter? how much do you say the cost?

thanks so much for the info..

Buellwinkle

The 3 ASP pulleys are;

All Alloy, similar to Kleemann - $350 - most HP but some say the alloy hub many not be strong enough for the long haul

Alloy with steel center hub - $300 - 8 oz more than the all alloy but has a steel hub similar to the factory pulley.

Pressed on ring (Renntech Style) - $200 + your old pulley, twice the weight and would likely produce a few less HP. This is considered by many to be the safest setup as it uses a modified factory pulley.


Everyone has to make up their own mind as to which one. I run the alloy pulley with the steel center hub as it gives me a little more piece of mind vs. an alloy hub with a very slight performance penalty over the all alloy pulley but significantly better performance than the ring style. On the 2 alloy pulleys you always have your stock pulley to go back to. On the ring style your pulley is permanently converted, you would have to buy another one from the dealer to go back to stock. The list price on the factory pulley is $302 but I got one cheaper from my dealer. Even with a spare factory pulley it's still less expensive than Renntech by over $1,000.

I went from 168 rwhp to 192 rwhp with just the pulley but everyone's results vary. The K&N and ITG filters get about 3-4 rwhp but only with the pulley with the winner being ITG. The K&N is about $40 and the ITG is $60. Search the forum for where to buy and part numbers, don't remember other than the place is in Utah. Don't trust the K&N website part numbers, it's wrong. Every tuner converts rear wheel HP (rwhp) to flywheel HP differently. With the pulley and air filter I expect I have 230 HP. Add my Renntech intercooler and muffler and I'm probably good for another 10-15 HP. I'll be doing another dyno once I get the Renntech muffler on next week. All that's left is a chip and I think I would have maxed out what that engine can do without major work like a Renntech 2.5L conversion or cam, neither of which is in my budget.

For pulley installation instructions check out one of the following sites. I updated it today but I don't know when they'll have the latest version up so check back once you get a pulley;

http://www.c-coupe.info/

http://www.benzforum.com/howtos/

rrf

Buellwinkle,
Very nice write up. Someday you may want to add the trick to hold the auto tranny. I have not tried this but someone said that there is an access hole on bottom of bell housing, where a tool can be used to hold the rear of the crank from spinning.

hokusbenz

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Buellwinkle



Everyone has to make up their own mind as to which one. I run the alloy pulley with the steel center hub as it gives me a little more piece of mind vs. an alloy hub with a very slight performance penalty over the all alloy pulley but significantly better performance than the ring style.


Hey buell- now that you've tried them both, can you actually "feel" the difference at all between the new steel hub asp and your old all alloy one? or is the difference strictly in the numbers? thanks

Buellwinkle

I don't think 8 oz would make that big a difference and certainly too small for me to tell on the butt dyno. I'm doing a dyno next week but that includes other mods that I've done since then like the intercooler. The ring type is about 5 lbs. heavier and I believe that I would notice that for sure.

FIXEDupW209

wow thanks a lot for all that info....i dont tihnk i would go with the ring pulley because my car is a lease and i would need to switche verything backt o stock once my lease it up.
the allow with steel center hub seems like the best choice for me and i would probably get that one...i will contact linh for more info....
how would changing mod. the pulley affect the warranty?

Buellwinkle

Changing anything, even the radio technically voids some part of the warranty. They have to prove the mod caused the failure and this can be hard to do if you removed the mod when you brought the car in for repairs

gab

Buellwinkle,

in your K&N/ITG filter test, did the car gain hp across the board or just at the top end? hows the throttle response with adding the filter?

FIXEDupW209

haha yeah but it can be a pain changing the car back to stock specialy for a pulley.
is it hard to install and switch back to the stock pulley?

Lockbuster

Buell,

I have to disagree, removing the mod will not help, the Mercedes techs can and will find out about the mod and still void some parts of the warrenty. Do you think that the computer does not hold information about the car? That information is viewed by the Mercedes tech. I think it is a crime to have an aftermarket product, take it off and then take the car in for service when in fact the product may have caused the problem in the first case. Taking advantage of this suitation is just like shoplifting in a store you are trying to get something for free from the seller of the goods!

Buellwinkle

Gab, the power increase is only at the top with air filters but it's there.

FIXEDupW209, it's the same effort to put it back, about an hour's labor.

Lockbuster, when I asked to have stage 2 done the tech checked for any codes. The only thing he found was codes thrown for ESP malfunction because the battery was disconnected. There's nothing kept in the ECU concerning boost pressure, a/f ratio or anything like that. There's no hidden camera, no MB spies lurking near my house (that I know of). I've taken the bolt on and off several times and there's no real signs of use. Besides you are assuming that the pulley caused the problem. Take the 2 people that had S/C failures with their ring pulley. Did the ring pulley really cause the failures or was it a coincedence that this happened? Since nobody can answer that with 100% confidence why leave the pulley on to confuse them? I don't think it's cheating, it's just returning the car to stock so they can work on it. I don't think they should be expected to work on the car with many mods, heck, they won't even know what belt size to replace. Besides, I don't hide the fact that I have a pulley with my dealer, afterall they had to do the stage 2 for me and even commented on how nice the pulley looks.

VoyagerDude

It would be helpful if more people with pulley mods participated in this poll:


https://mbworld.org/forums/showthrea...threadid=23096

Buellwinkle

What constitutes a problem? For example I've heard of 3 people have broken woodruff keys when they went to install. It's a problem but not one with a particular pulley. The other problem is that people that are happy don't usually respond to polls as much as the disgruntled. Also you have to look at probabilities. I have no exact numbers for other pulley companies but just for this example lets say that all tuners combined have sales equal to ASP. That would mean there are about 80 pulleys out there on these forums including SLK230K and older C230K's (I can't count the outside world as we have no feedback on those people). Lets say out of this population 4 random pulleys (this is how many I know about) had real problems not related to installation day in the 5 years that these pulleys have been available from any vendor. Then is 5% an acceptable risk? Certainly no mods you make to your car are 100% fool proof, even K&N filters have been known to cause problems with the MAF sensor. The issue for me is probability, how likely am I to incur a problem and what will happen to me with concerns that lean towards safety first, money last. So for me personally that's an acceptable risk and my life is not in danger. Should my 2.3L complete be toast and MB won't fix it under warranty I think that would give me the chance to explore getting a 3.2L V6 from a salvage yard as I'm sure there are plenty as this is MB's #1 motor. At least I can justify part of the cost as an improvement.

If that probability and level of risk is too much for you then hot rodding your car is not for you and their's nothing wrong with that, the C230 is a fine car untouched.

Lockbuster

Buell,
Seriously, you and I both know that the Mercedes techs are not stupid, and they can and will figure out what is going on with a Benz. I have worked with them for years and it does not take a rocket scientist to figure out why the emissions are off and other data stored when an error occurs and you have to admit when you put on a pulley it creates errors within the computer system. The techs I worked with have had vehicles brought back to the dealership just to be voided because of modifications that were removed before service. The techs do document the change so they will not be challenged later on. I have had long discussions with my techs regarding modifications and I am a firm believer to leave well things alone unless you are a rich kid, and your parents gives you gobs of money to throw away.

Buellwinkle

Lockbuster, like I've said my tech and dealer, even the salesman know's that I have a pulley, heck they even asked if it's Kleemann. I've asked them to see if there are any codes and the only one they found was the ESP and that's because I disconnected the battery which is SOP for most work done and certainly wasn't enough to raise an eyebrow that anything is modded. Sure they can hunt for clues like a wrench marks on bolts and such but you have to understand that it's to the dealers benefit if they repair your car under warranty, they get paid for this and it's good for customer service.

BTW, at 46 I'm far from rich or a kid and as risk adverse as many although as a private pilot and motorcycle rider I guess I take more risks than most.

FIXEDupW209

come on guys you both have opinions and thats fine its just a freaken pulley...if you think cars should be kept stock thats fine thats your opinion, i on the other hand would much rather make my car unique by addidng after market stuff and its a hobby, it gives me something to do in my spare time and if i can get this ASP pulley for $300 and it gives me around 230hp then hell yeah im gonna do it. if it was only gonna add 10hp then i can honestly say i wouldn't but thats a big difference from 192hp. im really surprised by the price to.
as for changing it back to stock i will for sure do that cuz i dont want my warranty to be voided and i dont want to pay to replace it. i am confident in the fact that im pretty sure this pulley wont mess up my car but if ever soemthing happened to my car i will take it out so htere isn't the slightest chance of MB blaming the failure on the pulley.

as for disconnecting the battery and have ESP codes. why do they need to disconect the battery? im in a bad situation because when i baught my car i wasn't presented with a radio code and once the battery is disconnected you need a radio code to turn the radio back on. and its honestly a pain in the *** to go behind ym head unti and get all those numbers to call the main dealership in the united states and get my radio code. this is jsut a pulley i dont see what all the fuss is about.
and LOCKBUSTER its not gobs of money its $300 that is soooooo cheap for a european aftermarket performance upgrade. its your opinion on to now upgrade your car.

Matt230K

You don't need a radio code anymore for most of the models. Only the ones with the old style radios still require a code. C-classes do not require a radio code. Feel free to disconnect the battery all you want.

Lockbuster

1. You can be cheap and buy a 300.00 pulley, now remember how much will it cost when it fails?
2. If Mercedes does find out about the pulley you will have warranty issues to deal with.
3. You need to go and do a little more study on Benz's, radio codes are not needed on the C class 2002 they are plug and play when exchanged within the C class models of that year. Removing the battery cable will not trip the radio code feature.
4. If I wanted to have a faster car than what I have I would buy one.
5. If I wanted to modify a vehicle with pulleys, after market radios, speakers and the likes I would have bought a throw away vehicle like a Ford Focus so I would not destroy a great vehicle like the Mercedes Benz.

Buellwinkle

Disconnecting the battery has a two fold advantage. 1) you need to re-map the ECU to the change and this does it much faster, 2) safety first, it's standard operating procedure to disconnect the battery when working on the motor. Say for example you left the key on and now you are spining the crank with a wrench, the engine can start an you now lost some fingers, maybe an arm. It's up to you but I include this step in my instructions and follow the practice myself.

Like Matt says, the radio is not coded to the car anymore, it's coded to the model, you can switch radios from W203 to W203, try it in another car and PROD will be displayed and the radio is a bust, I know, I did it to my first Audio 10 and back to Germany it went. Moral of the story, don't turn on your radio if every single connector is not attached.

What will happen when you disconnect the battery is when you start the car you will get an ESP malfunction. Turn the wheel lock to lock and it will go away and reset the ESP. The other thing that happens is the auto up on the windows will stop working, open and shut both windows and hold them closed for a few seconds and they are reset. It will log the malfunction but dealers see this all the time as they disconnect the battery for some work so it's no biggy. BTW, this is outlined in the owners manual, you know that huge phonebook size manual that nobody reads.


Lockbuster, what happened to leaving well enough alone, we know you don't like to mod your car, why annoy those that do? There's a guy like you on the SLK forum, ArizonaCharlie, is that you?

Matt230K

Another reason to disconnect the battery is if you are changing the alternator pulley as well. The alternator is not a good thing to mess with when it is powered up. I ended up having to take my alternator out just to be able to get an impact gun on it and get the bolt off. That was the hardest part of the whole installation. It's not the easiest part to take off.

FIXEDupW209

damn...thanks a lot for all that info...

now i really want to make my car faster but i can't risk messing it up due to the fact that it is a lease.

so what are the chances of this pulley messing up my car?
and thanks for the info on the battery adn the radio code...i used to have the older clkw208 and it needed a radio code so i always figured these did to.
anyways im going to call the guy up in san diego and ask him a few questions over the phone i will let you all know if i decide to get it or not and if i do get it i will probably dyno my car...thanks a lot again!

DCXdynodog

Dude,

When my manual 6spd trans failed it's 1-2 synchronizers they first told me it was a software problem and they had a patch for it.

You really do give them way too much credit.