Kleemann, is the work on the Lysholm charger replacement for the 230k resumed?
02-16-2003, 10:25 AM
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Yes the project is resumed.
As I mentioned before is will be a Lysholm replacement for the M45 Eaton that comes from MBZ. Lower HP required to drive the SC, lower discharge temps as result of greatly improved eff., and higher boost level.
The project is underway and I will post as progress is made.
As I mentioned before is will be a Lysholm replacement for the M45 Eaton that comes from MBZ. Lower HP required to drive the SC, lower discharge temps as result of greatly improved eff., and higher boost level.
The project is underway and I will post as progress is made.
02-16-2003, 11:41 PM
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Most certainly there is a need for a fuel system modification. The ECU is not the way to go however- there is not an infinite duty cycle on the injectors. We will use a similar solution as our SC for V6 kompressors.
02-17-2003, 09:08 AM
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C230 AMG Sports coupe
Kleemann....will this upgrade only be available in America?........or is it something I will be able to source from/and have fitted by Oakley the U.K. importers of Kleemann products?
02-19-2003, 01:53 AM
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so do you mean larger cc's injectors and hi-flow fuel pump?
what is the price range for thr kompressor upgrade kit you are thinking about?
When do you think you will be ready?
what is the price range for thr kompressor upgrade kit you are thinking about?
When do you think you will be ready?
Originally posted by KLEEMANN
Most certainly there is a need for a fuel system modification. The ECU is not the way to go however- there is not an infinite duty cycle on the injectors. We will use a similar solution as our SC for V6 kompressors.
Most certainly there is a need for a fuel system modification. The ECU is not the way to go however- there is not an infinite duty cycle on the injectors. We will use a similar solution as our SC for V6 kompressors.
02-19-2003, 09:12 PM
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Originally posted by London AMG
Kleemann....will this upgrade only be available in America?........or is it something I will be able to source from/and have fitted by Oakley the U.K. importers of Kleemann products?
Kleemann....will this upgrade only be available in America?........or is it something I will be able to source from/and have fitted by Oakley the U.K. importers of Kleemann products?
In addition to the SC we are prototyping a single mass alloy flywheel with kevlar disk and high clamping force pressure plate. Amazingly the stock C230 flywheel/disk/pressure plate tip the scales at 51lbs! MBZ has taken NVH to the extreme with a dual mass flywheel on a 4 cylinder car! Removing 20lbs from this assembly should wake things up quite a bit.
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02-20-2003, 03:27 AM
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2003 C230K, 6 spd, Brilliant Silver, C-5, C-7, CD changer
Originally posted by KLEEMANN
Currently we are doing this as a one-off engineering/feasibility test. The test bed is our own 2002 C230 Coupe which we will use in a competition in the early summer. If the results are stimulating enough to create enough interest we will make it a product.
In addition to the SC we are prototyping a single mass alloy flywheel with kevlar disk and high clamping force pressure plate. Amazingly the stock C230 flywheel/disk/pressure plate tip the scales at 51lbs! MBZ has taken NVH to the extreme with a dual mass flywheel on a 4 cylinder car! Removing 20lbs from this assembly should wake things up quite a bit.
Currently we are doing this as a one-off engineering/feasibility test. The test bed is our own 2002 C230 Coupe which we will use in a competition in the early summer. If the results are stimulating enough to create enough interest we will make it a product.
In addition to the SC we are prototyping a single mass alloy flywheel with kevlar disk and high clamping force pressure plate. Amazingly the stock C230 flywheel/disk/pressure plate tip the scales at 51lbs! MBZ has taken NVH to the extreme with a dual mass flywheel on a 4 cylinder car! Removing 20lbs from this assembly should wake things up quite a bit.
BTW, most of our dyno setups use dual mass flywheels, it helps other things live longer.
02-20-2003, 08:59 PM
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Originally posted by DCXdynodog
No, NVH quality is one of the main reasons to own a Benz and pay the big buck. I don't think it's extreme at all to use a dual mass flywheel on a 4 cyl vehicle with the MB name, or, dare I say, a torsional damper (gasp), it begs for it and their efforts show in the smoothness of this class of vehicle (4 cyl compact car) which is typically much rougher.
BTW, most of our dyno setups use dual mass flywheels, it helps other things live longer.
No, NVH quality is one of the main reasons to own a Benz and pay the big buck. I don't think it's extreme at all to use a dual mass flywheel on a 4 cyl vehicle with the MB name, or, dare I say, a torsional damper (gasp), it begs for it and their efforts show in the smoothness of this class of vehicle (4 cyl compact car) which is typically much rougher.
BTW, most of our dyno setups use dual mass flywheels, it helps other things live longer.
What I mean is that in chasing nearly zero NVH levels perhaps "maximum performance" is sacraficed. A 50+ lbs dual mass flywheel may make for a smooth driveline where you can lift the throttle and not feel any jerk, but its hardly "performance" oriented.
We are building this particular car to maximize the potential of the vehicle without resorting to sky high boost levels. We have, perhaps foolishly, entered into a competition with other 4 cyl "tuner cars" we will be up against WRX's with 25 psi and various other Japanese SCC's. We need to find every drop of power from this engine.
gab-
Stock clutch is fine for the pulley upgrade and the SC upgrade. This is an egineering project for us so we will push every direction possible to find the hidden hp/tq.
Last edited by Brandon @ Kleemann; 02-20-2003 at 09:02 PM.
02-23-2003, 05:02 PM
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Originally posted by KLEEMANN
...we are doing this as a one-off engineering/feasibility test...
...prototyping a single mass alloy flywheel with kevlar disk and high clamping force pressure plate...
...we are doing this as a one-off engineering/feasibility test...
...prototyping a single mass alloy flywheel with kevlar disk and high clamping force pressure plate...
Interest seemed high back when this was posted at csportcoupe.com. I am sure that if this would generate more interest if the upgrades were applicable to both the M111 and the M271 engines.
If interest is not high enough for mass production, is there the possibility for a limited amount. I for one am itching like hell to get this conversion for my M111 C230k.
02-24-2003, 05:37 AM
#14
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Warranty?
Quit smokin' that stuff mon,
he's talking about a race car!
Engineering to the extreme.
Extremes you must be willing to pay for when it takes a
few times to get it right.
So, Kleeman, whats you target HP torque output levels?
Or rather how much do you need to have it be feasible enough to have a chance at beating these other cars?
Damn if the Suburu wasn't just so butt ugly.....
they REALLY need to hire the Italians to get a body makeover.
Quit smokin' that stuff mon,
he's talking about a race car!
Engineering to the extreme.
Extremes you must be willing to pay for when it takes a
few times to get it right.
So, Kleeman, whats you target HP torque output levels?
Or rather how much do you need to have it be feasible enough to have a chance at beating these other cars?
Damn if the Suburu wasn't just so butt ugly.....
they REALLY need to hire the Italians to get a body makeover.
02-24-2003, 09:15 AM
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I would love to see 300/300. That still may not be enough for an overall win- but enough to place well and take some attention our way. It will be very unusual to see a MBZ in these ranks.
As for the Japanese cars: they all look like ugly amorphic lumps of putty to me. Great values as vehicles, just never going to have a soul.
As for the Japanese cars: they all look like ugly amorphic lumps of putty to me. Great values as vehicles, just never going to have a soul.
02-24-2003, 11:01 AM
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Originally posted by C230 Sport Coup
Warranty?
Quit smokin' that stuff mon,
he's talking about a race car!
Engineering to the extreme.
Extremes you must be willing to pay for when it takes a
few times to get it right....
Warranty?
Quit smokin' that stuff mon,
he's talking about a race car!
Engineering to the extreme.
Extremes you must be willing to pay for when it takes a
few times to get it right....
The warranty coverage that I am refering to is one that was discussed here on this forum in brief. I believe that Kleemann has been working to obtain the Brabus Type warranty validity aggreement.
Which, (Kleemann correct me if I am wrong please) would make any and all Kleemann modifications installed by an authorized Kleemann installer or MB dealership acceptable under the terms of our original or extended MB warranties.
None the less, I'll take 300/300 in my weekend warrior over the warranty without thinking twice. It is the little crap like pulley wheels that have me hesitating to invalidate my beloved warranty.
Sorry to all in advance if I mis-read that other forum and *rumors*.
Tom
02-24-2003, 11:07 AM
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Originally posted by KLEEMANN
I would love to see 300/300. That still may not be enough for an overall win- but enough to place well and take some attention our way. It will be very unusual to see a MBZ in these ranks.
As for the Japanese cars: they all look like ugly amorphic lumps of putty to me. Great values as vehicles, just never going to have a soul.
I would love to see 300/300. That still may not be enough for an overall win- but enough to place well and take some attention our way. It will be very unusual to see a MBZ in these ranks.
As for the Japanese cars: they all look like ugly amorphic lumps of putty to me. Great values as vehicles, just never going to have a soul.
But, for competition at the levels you are thinking, and despite it going against Kleemann as a princple of your business, I would love to see the Kleemann C230 stomp the S*** out of the jap cars. Would scrapping the SC and going bi-turbo be a possiblility? I don't know what class or club you're going for but turboing a car that wasn't originally turboed is often against the rules.But seriously now, Brandon had said back on csportcoupe that he had gotten as far as CNCing parts before he had taken on other priorities. Where are you all at with this project at this point? How are things going? Is there any estimated timeframe for availability of this for us (if it will be)?
Subaru's are like that ugly nephew you never wanted, but you still have to love them for some reason.
Last edited by nukblazi; 02-24-2003 at 11:13 AM.
