ECU tuning, the blower, and pulley questions
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: Corrales New Mexico
2005 C230 Sport Coupe,1999 BMW M Coupe,Motto Guzzi Centauro,Motto Guzzi V1100 Le Mans,95 T-Bird SC
ECU tuning, the blower, and pulley questions
Help! I have a 2005 C-230 coupe (M271), and was interested in getting more out of it. But,,, I've gotten a bunch of info that conflicts. So far,Cory at Kleeman has told me that they stopped importing over sized crank pulleys because (after a number of start cycles) the ECU told the bypass valve to open (at the normal PSI) and over time there was no increase in boost and performance. I was told the same thing by Lee at ASP. Now on the other hand I've been told by InMotion, Power Chips and LET that the pulleys would work but no body wanted to address if they can modify the ECU to allow for the system to actually allow for an increase in boost. My understanding is that the ECU dials back or dumps the blowers boost (through the bypass valve) when at a steady state or deceleration or at about 6 PSI max. Better fuel mileage, longer life,,,, what ever MB's reasons. From the pics I've seen the valve apears to be electronic, as opposed to a turbos blow off valve. So in theory the ECU could just tell it to stay closed longer, open sooner,,,,,. Does anyone know for sure? I'm sure there are benifits to be had by remapping, but no one said they actually addressed or changed the by pass valves settings. And they kind of side steped the question when asked directly. Does anyone have real world long term experiance with Kleeman headers, ECU flashes (and by whom) and or oversized pulley's? Thanks in advance.
Super Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 573
Likes: 1
W203
EvoSport apparently (and they'll correct me if I'm wrong) tried to pay someone to find the code that controls the bypass valve cause (from what I understand) the ECU is encoded, so its not as simple as just dig inside the ECU and find the code that controls the bypass valve. It might be just flipping a 1 or 0, yet without knowing where its an expensive time-consuming guessing game.
The K-BOX gets around this by changing the MAF signal and tricking the ECU, yet its far from a perfect solution.
Jose (mig888) is probably the best guy to talk to. He has the Kleemann pulley, K-box, headers and worked with a tuning company on a custom ECU map. He did get some good gains, yet nothing extraordinary. I haven't seen him around much lately, PM him.
One of the dealerships in my old city ran a C-coupe in a professional racing series. They had it tuned by someone at HQ in Germany, and still couldn't get the power they wanted. They ended up running standalone.
That's the icing on the cake for me, that even Mercedes cannot tune this ECU to get significantly more power, means its a lost cause. That's not to say you cannot get more power and have some fun, yet to get > 50hp out of this engine would require running standalone.
The K-BOX gets around this by changing the MAF signal and tricking the ECU, yet its far from a perfect solution.
Jose (mig888) is probably the best guy to talk to. He has the Kleemann pulley, K-box, headers and worked with a tuning company on a custom ECU map. He did get some good gains, yet nothing extraordinary. I haven't seen him around much lately, PM him.
One of the dealerships in my old city ran a C-coupe in a professional racing series. They had it tuned by someone at HQ in Germany, and still couldn't get the power they wanted. They ended up running standalone.
That's the icing on the cake for me, that even Mercedes cannot tune this ECU to get significantly more power, means its a lost cause. That's not to say you cannot get more power and have some fun, yet to get > 50hp out of this engine would require running standalone.
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
From: Massachusetts
05 c230 kompressor SS 6MT & 07 BMW 335i
Well, I am running the kleeman headers, CAT, and PowerChip and have definitely experienced some good gains. As per the pulley, I dont think i would buy that just because it puts an additional level of strain on your blower that could cause failure if you drive a lot; just my opinion. Now from my understanding, if you swap out the system's electronic BPV and replace with a mechanical bypass valve, the ECU will no longer be able to dump the excess boost until you let off the throttle (just like a blow off valve). It seems now, the ecu is always playing around and sometimes the car feels very different. Because the ECU controls the wastegate and BPV, the traction control and ecu thresholds are adjusting to compensate i.e. for longer life, more control of the car, limited stress on the blower, etc. But, with a mechanical bypass valve, the ecu has very limited control over the extra boost you may be pushing. The downside is during emergency situations the car's traction control will not be as effective and it will be up to the driver to adjust more with limiting boost. The only way to get big gains out of this engine (aside from going standalone) imo would be to turbo charge it. I myself am working on a bi-boost kit which would add a t3/t4 hybrid turbo to my blower system. With that system, you dont need to mess with the blower at all and just adjust the turbo to get you the boost increase you want. Correct me if im wrong please. cheers!
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 9
Likes: 0
From: Corrales New Mexico
2005 C230 Sport Coupe,1999 BMW M Coupe,Motto Guzzi Centauro,Motto Guzzi V1100 Le Mans,95 T-Bird SC
Thanks
Thanks for the tips, I think,,,, that is what I was afraid of. But better to know than waste a bunch of money. I will be curious to see if any of the tuners have actually resolved the problem, but if MB can't get past it, I doubt anyone can. Have you heard of what the issue(s) are with the K box? Other than the usual add on box issues of communication from the ECU to the box and back, or does it go from the ECU to the box and then to the system?
Thanks again.
Thanks again.
Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
From: Massachusetts
05 c230 kompressor SS 6MT & 07 BMW 335i
i disagree with you there lightdragon. the engine itself is very strong and very solid. MB has just electronically limited how much boost/power the engine will put out to insure longevity, ride quality/smoothness and fuel economy. If you can either bypass some of those restrictions, or have the money to swap out the right components, the 1.8L can be (is) a very nice performing motor. it wont be able to hold 400 or 500 hp without internal work, but the compression is definitely good enough for added boost or a mid-level turbo system. i truly believe with the right mods, you can safely put 300+ hp to the wheels without omuch worry of catastrophic failure. it will never be a drag race car, but for the track or playing on the highway/autobahn, this car is a very a very good candidate. i myself am very happy with the performance of my engine and after all the mods i have, i have experienced no engine problems and the car purrs like it was brand new. just my opinion
Senior Member
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 290
Likes: 1
w203 M111 E20 ML EVO
jokerswld34, mum benz has already reached the limit for the 1.8l 192ps, im personally aware that at the beginning will stand the pressure but in a few years there'll be a valve issue in the cylinders. remember that the normal power for m271 is 184ps, thats why they are replacing the supercharger with the turbo, a whole new tech. if he had an m111 i'd be the first to give the green light to proceed
Trending Topics
Super Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 573
Likes: 1
W203
This engine is not a good base to mod, better to save your money and get into another car with a better engine, or swap the 2.3L in, it'll take > 300 hp.
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
10 Most Reliable Mercedes-Benz Models You Can Buy Used
Verdad Gallardo
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,058
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
lol...M271 making 300hp at crank is more likely with a bigger supercharger, injector, pulley, and some internal works. 300+ to the wheel on M271 sorry to say is nearly impossible for street application.
Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 223
Likes: 0
From: California
03 CLK 500
Hey guys I am new on the forum.
I have 03 CLK 500 and I would like get a little more out of it <power wise>
so far I have a quad exchaust setup and that all. Any other suggestions?? Thought about tuning the ECU, but can't find anyone, in this town.
I have 03 CLK 500 and I would like get a little more out of it <power wise>
so far I have a quad exchaust setup and that all. Any other suggestions?? Thought about tuning the ECU, but can't find anyone, in this town.
MBworld Guru
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 22,058
Likes: 18
From: Diamond Bar, CA
W206 PHEV AMG
but i can tell you ecu does minimal on the M113 without other mods. 10hp at best when you lean out the fuel map under full throttle.
if you really want power, go with headers, under-drive pulley kit, and even the supercharger before doing the tune.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 358
Likes: 0
From: San Pedro CA and Costa Mesa CA
2005 W203 SS
my car will never pass 200hp but im cool with that cuz it looks good and it runs good.
