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Obsidium Black - initial care

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Obsidium Black - initial care

 
Old 06-05-2009, 06:22 PM
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C220d Estate Avantgarde, Obsidium black, command, factory tint. MB CLK240 Iolith Blue / Pebble-Gone
Obsidium Black - initial care

This week collected my new estate and have a long weekend as well. It is a c 220d Avantgarde, which i think you might refer to as a sports. That is, its a bit lower, has wider wheels, the blue glass and command. I have the split sahara beige / black interior and factory tint glass from the B pillar back and the drivers doors has that bluey glass. The factory tint is surprisingly dark with the back window just black. Merc only does factory tinting on wagons and four wheel drives so it may well not be available in your market but bloody hell is does look gooood. IIf anyone wants any photo's could you provide a bit of a nutshell as to how to do it.

My question is different to the recently posted black care. What I need advice on are a few suggestions as to what to put onto the car when its brand new. Something to put onto the car at its first wash.

I already have a high pressure water sprayer which I always used before sponging the vehicles and I use the two bucket method as well. I had a cadet blue clk (color code 357 - medium blue) which never got a swirl with this method.

Question is do i go canuba wax or polymer. In Australia we have zaino (by mailorder), Meguirs & mothers along with others. For my part for the past couple of years i have been using mothers and I have to say that I think their product line is better than meguirs. I have never used zaino but note positive feedback on forums re that product and I intend to get some.

Whatever it is it I would prefer it not to dry white as that just creates so if any suggested products do dry white could you let me know so i can throw that into my decision making process.

Cheers
Maxy

Last edited by Maxy; 06-05-2009 at 06:25 PM. Reason: forgot to mention photos
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Old 06-05-2009, 06:32 PM
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Long life polymer sealant before it gets a swirl. Check that paint has hardened first though. See if you can deform the clearcoat in a doorjam or somewhere inconspicuous with a finger nail. If you can give the car plently of sun before you coat it. Nano clear really does not need polishing. Seal properly every 5 years.
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Old 06-05-2009, 06:40 PM
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Read this - it gives mainly good advice. Just be carefull with micro fiber cloths. A number of the paint companies & polish manufacturers recommend against them.

https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ng-swirls.html
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Old 06-05-2009, 06:54 PM
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C220d Estate Avantgarde, Obsidium black, command, factory tint. MB CLK240 Iolith Blue / Pebble-Gone
Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Read this - it gives mainly good advice. Just be carefull with micro fiber cloths. A number of the paint companies & polish manufacturers recommend against them.

https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ng-swirls.html
Thanks,

I have a read right now. Some of the product in SA isnt available here though.
i have never used polymer always canuba wax - there isnt any dulling of the paint is there as i really want to keep the reflections they are remarkable. Congrats on the Bulls too. We are going to the Barbs / Wallabies game tonight.

Cheers & Thanks again
Maxy
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Old 06-06-2009, 07:58 AM
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Maxy,

let me know what products you choose. My estate arrives next Friday.

Which dealer did you pick yours up from? I got mine at MB Sydney in Zetland.

cheers
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Old 06-06-2009, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Maxy View Post
Thanks,

I have a read right now. Some of the product in SA isnt available here though.
i have never used polymer always canuba wax - there isnt any dulling of the paint is there as i really want to keep the reflections they are remarkable. Congrats on the Bulls too. We are going to the Barbs / Wallabies game tonight.

Cheers & Thanks again
Maxy
Yeah! Lived in Sydney for 5 years working Asia for Caltex. Drove a Holden Berlina from the company LOL. Travelled so much that I only did 19,000Km from new on the car. I'm not sure if you can get products like Auto Armor there. You do have damn good touchless car washes though. I used one on the Northwest Highway - big chain owned by some Malaysian dude.

I am very anti polishing these new clearcoats. Once you start they never seems the same again. I've Auto Armoured two new Mercs in a row now & never polished them & they both look stunning. I make my service advisor do a body inspection before every service and they can't believe that there are zero swirls in the paint after 5 years. I don't let the dealer wash the car either unless I'm present to direct affairs. Otherwise they dry clean the exterior with dirty cloths & watches & buttons & zips etc & scratch the hell out of everything. Also scratch the interior with vacuum cleaner nozzles

Enjoy the game.
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Old 06-06-2009, 09:15 PM
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C220d Estate Avantgarde, Obsidium black, command, factory tint. MB CLK240 Iolith Blue / Pebble-Gone
Originally Posted by blueyh View Post
Maxy,

let me know what products you choose. My estate arrives next Friday.

Which dealer did you pick yours up from? I got mine at MB Sydney in Zetland.

cheers
Hi,

Havent decided yet. But I agree with the wax being somewhat dulling. I put that on the clk when it arrived and it wasnt as shiny afterwards. (never told the mrs. though!!). Currently torn between Blackfire, Zaino and this Nano product. The other product that sounds interesting is Mothers tech 2 but from what I can see most advice is to stay away from off the shelf product. The suggested product Auto Armor is not available in Australia only Sth Africa. In earlier posts the word "nano" was used so did a word search and it might be the clear seal. Below are some web addresses which i have found.

Blackfire
http://www.zas.com.au/product.php?pi...20Cart%3C/b%3E

Zaino
http://www.zainobros.com.au/

I got my new merc from Peter Warren, Liverpool though I'm at Eastwood. My drive (the merc is the mrs car though I will be putting about 10k kms on it to avoid fbt) is actually a Volvo (also got at Warren's) and before that the clk. The advantage with buying cars from a "multi-make" dealer is that they know you. I went in and signed all the forms and I dont know if they even called my accountant. It just makes buying a car that EASY especially because I had applying for finance - bowing/scraping/grovelling is disagreeable to me. the other good thing is that because they are a little out of town and if they know your from farafield then they give you their best price to get their business. Thats what I think it is anyway and i limit my selection of rides to the brands they have franchises for (pity though as the new audi Q5 does look enticing). Like the clk this one has been put thru merc finance - and our first contact with them was when they called and offered to give the wife the clk (at the same lease figure) until our new ride arrived - something our dealer requested apparently without us even asking - how GOOD is that. We got the wagon, 220 diesel, comand, factory tint, avantgarde, metallic (and of course the mats) for a couple of grand short of $75K. the luxury tax is increased to $75k because of the fuel efficiency so no Luxury car tax. trick is now to keep it nice and shiny!!!

Bryn mentioned auto armor but it doesnt seem to be available in Aus or I cant find it on the net only their SA site.

What color interior/exterior is your estate?

It may be that zaino is the same type of technology as auto armorhttps://mbworld.org/forums/images/smilies/crazy.gif

Let me know the results of your research please.

cheers
Maxy

Last edited by Maxy; 06-07-2009 at 07:08 PM. Reason: Nano seal / auto armor
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Old 06-09-2009, 05:52 AM
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thx for info - I'm black on black.
Haven't had time to research this week... but only 3 days to 'C' Day, so I'd better get cracking...
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Old 06-15-2009, 06:56 AM
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Maxy, after much to-ing and fro-ing I'm going to go with Zaino. All the debates are if something else is as good as Zaino. It has the spray on finishing option, and fast drying additives so I can do my job in a day. And it lasts longest so I only need to do this twice a year.

This was a useful link for me:

http://www.fordforums.com.au/showthread.php?t=11259545

The cost is an issue, but think my new baby is worth it

So the next question is --- what's the equivalent of dawn dishwashing liquid, i.e. a concentrate or not?
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Old 06-15-2009, 10:14 PM
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Dawn is a very mild detergeant - Won't strip off coatings & promote rust
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Old 06-16-2009, 08:19 AM
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Sorry - I have to jump in here to resolve some issues...

Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Dawn is a very mild detergeant - Won't strip off coatings & promote rust
I've spent many years properly caring for paints and have a few comments:

Only use products that are made for your finish. The only "Dawn" that we have in the US is dishwashing detergent and that WILL strip wax from paint. A car wash product (even the cheapest brand name sold at places like Walmart) will do a better job at protecting your finish than a dishsoap - that actually removes all protective waxes.

I use products like Dawn annually when it is time to strip the wax - just prior to adding the new stuff.

Paint sealants (like Auto Armor or that junk normally offered by dealers) are usually way overpriced. More importantly, they are only as good as the surface prep. If the dealer hasn't prepped the car properly (a good day's work with claybar, 3M glue solvent and assorted polishing aids) then the sealant will trap contaminants and debris. I have yet to see a dealer properly prep a car for delivery - most still have glue remnants and rail dust on the paint.

I'm also not sure what effects these sealants have on the nano paints now being used, but the old school methods probably no longer apply...
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Old 06-16-2009, 09:46 AM
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No special care, just regular car wash and hand wax every 1 1/2 month.
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Old 06-16-2009, 09:49 AM
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Yes - you are spot on - I remember from my days living in the US. Dawn there is dishwashing liquid - LOL - Here it is environmentally friendly & does not strip coatings - Need to be careful - Thanks for pointing this out.

The trick with the nano clear coats is not to abrade the surface with any type of product - never mind how mild. It needs to maintain it's from the gun skin - so to speak. The cars here come with surface tension film applied to the paintwork rather sloppily but provides the delivery protection. Take that off - straight to Auto Armor for a mild chemical prep & straight on with the sealant - applied with a large low speed lambswool buff. Obviously the clearcoat must be fully hardened but always is with East London built cars. Auto Armor costs US$75 to have applied which I consider cheap for a product that lasts for years & is Daimler AG approved & encouraged. I was skeptical about Auto Armor but after about 10 family cars having been done & looking good after a number of years with the odd touch up & being washed with the Auto Armor car wash I am convinced. I can run the back of my hand over my cars paint after five years & it's smooth as a baby's bum & water still pebbles on the surface with zero "polishing" done in that time.

If you are getting cars that have been rail transported with exposed paint then heaven forbid - with all that steel flake & crap it must be a nightmare. Here they are shipped around the coast & road transported by car carrier to the dealers with protective film in place. American dealers which are in many cases huge also park new vehicles outdoors by the thousands exposed to the elements. Here they are stored under roof & in showrooms.

I just don't believe that the Nano clears ever look the same once wax has been applied. In my experience they loose that inherent sparkle. Many many products have mild to not so mild compounds in them to polish of debris & this is what nanoclears don't need.

To everyone their own though - whatever makes you happy.

Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; 06-16-2009 at 12:03 PM.
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Old 06-16-2009, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by tanktube67 View Post
No special care, just regular car wash and hand wax every 1 1/2 month.
You obviously enjoy it but a hand wax every 6 weeks would drive me mad firstly & secondly it increases the chances of swirls in the clearcoat many fold. One spec of dirt on the polishing cloth or whatever & it's all over. Lot's of water when washing with a top sealant to protect the paint every time for me - but that's me. Any dry rubbing of a cars paint should be avoided.

Cut any dry rubbing of a dark car's paint to an absolute minimum. In fact any car.

And no I have no connections to the polymer sealant market. I'm just an oil man.
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Old 06-16-2009, 10:52 AM
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W213 200CDI -Fascination
i'm very suprised that the onderlaying layer is white. even a small
impact from a pebble leaves a (very visible)white mark.

bumber is the worst: very thin layer of black pain & white plastic underneath
it already looks worn out after not even a year

btw: what should i use to clean the car, before a touch up?

cheers,
Egon
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Old 06-16-2009, 11:16 AM
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You make good points....

Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Yes - you are spot on - I remember from my days living in the US. Dawn there is dishwashing liquid - LOL - Here it is environmentally friendly & does not strip coatings - Need to be careful - Thanks for pointing this out.

The trick with the nano clear coats is not to abrade the surface with any type of product - never mind how mild. It needs to maintain it's from the gun skin - so to speak. The cars here come with surface tension film applied to the paintwork rather sloppily but provides the delivery protection. Take that off - straight to Auto Armor for a mild chemical prep & straight on with the sealant - applied with a large low speed lambswool buff. Obviously the clearcoat must be fully hardened but always is with East London built cars. Auto Armor costs US$75 to have applied which I consider cheap for a product that lasts for years & is Daimler AG approved & encouraged. I was skeptical about Auto Armor but after about 10 family cars having been done & looking good after a number of years with the odd touch up & being washed with the Auto Armor car wash I am convinced. I can run the back of my hand over my cars paint after five years & it's smooth as a baby's bum & water still pebbles on the surface with zero "polishing" done in that time.

If you are getting cars that have been rail transported with exposed paint then heaven forbid - with all that steel flake & crap it must be a nightmare. Here they are shipped around the coast & road transported by car carrier to the dealers with protective film in place. American dealers which are in many cases huge also park new vehicles outdoors by the thousands exposed to the elements. Here they are stored under roof & in showrooms.

I just don't believe that the Nano clears ever look the same once wax has been applied. In my experience they loose that inherent sparkle. Many many products have mild to not so mild compounds in them to polish of debris & this is what nonoclears don't need.

To everyone their own though - whatever makes you happy.

...but most US dealers will provide the sealants as a $500 service and just pour it on the rail dust and bits of film still stuck to the car. In addition, most use the same stuff that they used 15 years ago - not formulated for the new paints. One of the pamphlets at a MB dealer even bragged "just like the clearcoat paint being used on newer cars"
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Old 06-16-2009, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by CEB View Post
...but most US dealers will provide the sealants as a $500 service and just pour it on the rail dust and bits of film still stuck to the car. In addition, most use the same stuff that they used 15 years ago - not formulated for the new paints. One of the pamphlets at a MB dealer even bragged "just like the clearcoat paint being used on newer cars"
Oh dear! - you guys have a problem.
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Old 06-17-2009, 01:57 PM
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We have multiple threads running on the same subject. This is a copy of what I posted to the other one.

Microfiber towels are made from Polyester & Polyamide fibers. Both of which can scratch modern paint finishes & remove sealants & waxes. I'm posting here a comment from one of the detail product manufacturers - I won't disclose which one because aside from polymer sealants & polishes. They ALSO sell Microfiber towels So if you want the truth speak to the paint manufacturers.

Quote
"Using Microfiber to clean your car:
Those answers mean I step on a few toes, even my own, when it comes to
products. Many of the products that were safe to use on a vehicle 3 years ago are not safe on newer cars due to a change in paint. Many of the products being sold to clean a vehicle will damage the sealant on your vehicle over time.
Unfortunately by the time it's noticeable the damage has already happened and there is no undo key built into a vehicle.

Caution about cleaning with microfiber:
Industrial paint and sealant manufacturers warn against washing your vehicle with the popular microfiber products. They are made from 80 to 85% polyester & polyamide, which is plastic. Plastic scratches and over time and repeated use they will scratch the sealant off your car and then start on the paint. Your car' paint will begin oxidizing even though you have taken excellent care of your vehicle.
Due to VOC regulations, paint is now being changed from lead based to water based. The paint is not as hard as it has been in the past. Even though sealants are applied over the paint to protect it, if the sealant is scratched
off due to microfiber or the wrong kind of petroleum distillate being used in a wax, the paint is then left vulnerable to rapid oxidation, rust and deterioration. I sell microfiber cloths and do not want you using something
that I know will damage your sealant over time. At a large industrial trade show I had microfiber manufacturing companies verify this information.
If your vehicle is a 2002 or prior to 2002 using 100% cotton is safe and does a great job cleaning safely without scratching. If your vehicle is newer than 2002 then 100% Lambswool is recommended. It is even softer and gentler than cotton." Unquote

Nice Huh! - from someone in the detailing product supply business! You have been warned.
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Old 06-17-2009, 09:19 PM
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I don't think that I agree.....

Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
We have multiple threads running on the same subject. This is a copy of what I posted to the other one.

Microfiber towels are made from Polyester & Polyamide fibers. Both of which can scratch modern paint finishes & remove sealants & waxes. I'm posting here a comment from one of the detail product manufacturers - I won't disclose which one because aside from polymer sealants & polishes. They ALSO sell Microfiber towels So if you want the truth speak to the paint manufacturers.

Quote
"Using Microfiber to clean your car:
Those answers mean I step on a few toes, even my own, when it comes to
products. Many of the products that were safe to use on a vehicle 3 years ago are not safe on newer cars due to a change in paint. Many of the products being sold to clean a vehicle will damage the sealant on your vehicle over time.
Unfortunately by the time it's noticeable the damage has already happened and there is no undo key built into a vehicle.

Caution about cleaning with microfiber:
Industrial paint and sealant manufacturers warn against washing your vehicle with the popular microfiber products. They are made from 80 to 85% polyester & polyamide, which is plastic. Plastic scratches and over time and repeated use they will scratch the sealant off your car and then start on the paint. Your car' paint will begin oxidizing even though you have taken excellent care of your vehicle.
Due to VOC regulations, paint is now being changed from lead based to water based. The paint is not as hard as it has been in the past. Even though sealants are applied over the paint to protect it, if the sealant is scratched
off due to microfiber or the wrong kind of petroleum distillate being used in a wax, the paint is then left vulnerable to rapid oxidation, rust and deterioration. I sell microfiber cloths and do not want you using something
that I know will damage your sealant over time. At a large industrial trade show I had microfiber manufacturing companies verify this information.
If your vehicle is a 2002 or prior to 2002 using 100% cotton is safe and does a great job cleaning safely without scratching. If your vehicle is newer than 2002 then 100% Lambswool is recommended. It is even softer and gentler than cotton." Unquote

Nice Huh! - from someone in the detailing product supply business! You have been warned.
...this goes directly against what we've been told recently and there are inconsistencies in this "report." One example is the recommendation to use lambswool - a pretty abrasive product.

I'd like to research this further because - if true - this would turn the detailing scene upside down. Would you be so kind as to identify your source in order to allow us to determine accuracy...
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Old 06-18-2009, 01:55 AM
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No - I'm not revealing my source but it won't take much research. A reputable US care care product manufacturer. In fact a number have commented. It's well known in South Africa. Natural lambswool is not abrasive & does not hold debris. Suggest you contact paint suppliers such as Glasurit that pioneered the waterbased base coats & nano clear that is being used by the German manufacturers. Members on the 203 forum say they were told the same thing on the SEMA show last year. I have no idea how authoritative SEMA is but it's supposed to be a premium show for the trade.

Is it going to be contentious - certainly.

Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; 06-18-2009 at 02:01 AM.
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Old 07-28-2009, 05:17 PM
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car care..any recommendations ??

hey guys...im looking for a good waterless car wash products...any good website i could get them at ? i tried finishfirstpolish.com no results dunno even think that site is the operative....thanks
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Old 07-28-2009, 05:23 PM
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The BEST two waterless car wash I've found was Opt Onr and Chemical Guys One. FMINUS uses Opt Onr (Optimum No Rinse) and his work is amazing. DetailedImage has both of them and you can't go wrong with either, although I'd probably go with Opt Onr. No worries about water spots and a must for people in apartments or have hard water.

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Old 07-29-2009, 08:28 PM
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black = there will be swirls.
invest in a porter cable + numerous car detailing products + have a lot of time to maintain your finish :P otherwise just let it happen and enjoy.
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Old 07-29-2009, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by german-anger View Post
black = there will be swirls.
^+1

I get my wash at a 100% hand car wash
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