AWD Dyno
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Joined: Jun 2008
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From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
I'm satisfied that my experience is the experience of most. We don't operate in a vacuum. We have had some incredibly well qualified people working around us for years, & not in SA but globally. Go & talk to Schenk. They will confirm this. It's not rocket science. But you always know better but seem to lack this experience. That's why I respect timdf - He's been there & done the work & his experience has been that of many of us. But I guess you did not read his comments.
I've been watching all the critics on this thread squabble about my comments with amusement. This thread started about micropower's intention of doing runs on a rolling road dyno. It was stated or intimated early in the thread that this was to ultimately evaluate an ECU tune & maybe other mods & to establish a base line which is good practice.
Critics can be forgiven for not suggesting a set of skimmed dedicated dyno tyres, & pushing back the pads in the brake calipers etc. etc. as this might be considered by some overkill considering the circumstances.
Not one of the mud slingers has raised dyno vehicle/engine preparation rule 1 from dyno basics 101 for dummies - Check that the engine is achieving WOT!!!!
Merc use a DBW throttle as you are no doubt all aware. Not one of you suggested doing a throttle reset prior to testing to ensure that the throttle plate was achieving WOT. Some experience you all have.
Please don't play the race card. You too come from a country with a most unfortunate & tragic past as do I. It does not mean that either of us condone what was done in the past.
I've been watching all the critics on this thread squabble about my comments with amusement. This thread started about micropower's intention of doing runs on a rolling road dyno. It was stated or intimated early in the thread that this was to ultimately evaluate an ECU tune & maybe other mods & to establish a base line which is good practice.
Critics can be forgiven for not suggesting a set of skimmed dedicated dyno tyres, & pushing back the pads in the brake calipers etc. etc. as this might be considered by some overkill considering the circumstances.
Not one of the mud slingers has raised dyno vehicle/engine preparation rule 1 from dyno basics 101 for dummies - Check that the engine is achieving WOT!!!!
Merc use a DBW throttle as you are no doubt all aware. Not one of you suggested doing a throttle reset prior to testing to ensure that the throttle plate was achieving WOT. Some experience you all have.
Please don't play the race card. You too come from a country with a most unfortunate & tragic past as do I. It does not mean that either of us condone what was done in the past.
Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; Dec 7, 2009 at 11:40 AM.
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Joined: Aug 2009
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\
The truth is that it could be worse than nothing. Getting dyno repeatability below 10% can be a battle. What if your mod only gives an 8% or smaller improvement? The inlet air temperature as an example increases by 4 degrees from before to after testing & you show zero or negative improvement. Then you are confused. You have wasted your time & money.
Correct - but adequate move in air density & IAT can certainly cause a 10% float along with many other factors. See my original post - All I was trying to do was to get these factors recognised in attempting to achieve a sane result. Reasonable guidance.
Getting meaningful, repeatable results is still a nightmare irrespective of dyno resolution.
Getting meaningful, repeatable results is still a nightmare irrespective of dyno resolution.
VS
I'll just let you argue with yourself henceforth.
Thread Starter
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Joined: Dec 2007
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From: Vancouver, BC
2008 Mercedes C300 4Matic
All I can see in this thread is Glyn's ego not letting go to the fact that NOT EVERYONE HAS THE RESOURCES AS YOU. As said earlier, the reason for me doing this is simply for some before and after numbers for a specific mod. I'm sorry if I don't have a multimillion dollar F1 dyno, but you have to learn something... not everyone has access to that shi*t. Once you get that through your head, you can realize the reason we all want to do a simple dyno. Thanks for hijacking my thread, I simply wanted to post numbers for others to see but you made this into a terrible debate on why people should go to multimillion dollar F1 dynos and how all other dyno's are useless. Oh and by the way, doing 0-60 runs on the street is waaay less effective than a regular dyno. Think about it, you were talking about temp changes before, well umm I'm sure outside is where the temperature changes the most. Not to mention the wind factor.
Post after post I see you make (especially in this thread) it's just you repeating your theory and thoughts. Frankly I'm sick of it. I'm sick of the fact that you think you are superior to everyone else. If you were truly smart you would have made your point once and stopped. But the fact that you stayed and argued and made discriminatory remarks to Americans is offensive and disgusting. Nobody likes a smartass.
Post after post I see you make (especially in this thread) it's just you repeating your theory and thoughts. Frankly I'm sick of it. I'm sick of the fact that you think you are superior to everyone else. If you were truly smart you would have made your point once and stopped. But the fact that you stayed and argued and made discriminatory remarks to Americans is offensive and disgusting. Nobody likes a smartass.
Thread Starter
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From: Vancouver, BC
2008 Mercedes C300 4Matic
I believe that's the reason why people have problems about your posts on this thread. Micropower isn't building a "serious" racing competition vehicle. He just wanted a baseline figure so he can see how much gains were from the ECU tune.
There is nothing wrong with seeing where your car stands from point A to B.
I've have had done many dyno runs on my EJ205 motor at sea level, identical temperature and humidity within a span of many months. All done because I was tuning my car and I've seen relative, consistent gains. Does this mean none of it is real? Nope. If I had multimillion dollar facility to "measure" my cars, I wouldn't have bought a C Class anyway.
There is nothing wrong with seeing where your car stands from point A to B.
I've have had done many dyno runs on my EJ205 motor at sea level, identical temperature and humidity within a span of many months. All done because I was tuning my car and I've seen relative, consistent gains. Does this mean none of it is real? Nope. If I had multimillion dollar facility to "measure" my cars, I wouldn't have bought a C Class anyway.
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 19,942
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From: Llandudno, Cape Town, South Africa
late 2009 CLK 350 Coupe Elegance, '65 Jaguar S Type wires
All I can see in this thread is Glyn's ego not letting go to the fact that NOT EVERYONE HAS THE RESOURCES AS YOU. As said earlier, the reason for me doing this is simply for some before and after numbers for a specific mod. I'm sorry if I don't have a multimillion dollar F1 dyno, but you have to learn something... not everyone has access to that shi*t. Once you get that through your head, you can realize the reason we all want to do a simple dyno. Thanks for hijacking my thread, I simply wanted to post numbers for others to see but you made this into a terrible debate on why people should go to multimillion dollar F1 dynos and how all other dyno's are useless. Oh and by the way, doing 0-60 runs on the street is waaay less effective than a regular dyno. Think about it, you were talking about temp changes before, well umm I'm sure outside is where the temperature changes the most. Not to mention the wind factor.
Post after post I see you make (especially in this thread) it's just you repeating your theory and thoughts. Frankly I'm sick of it. I'm sick of the fact that you think you are superior to everyone else. If you were truly smart you would have made your point once and stopped. But the fact that you stayed and argued and made discriminatory remarks to Americans is offensive and disgusting. Nobody likes a smartass.
Post after post I see you make (especially in this thread) it's just you repeating your theory and thoughts. Frankly I'm sick of it. I'm sick of the fact that you think you are superior to everyone else. If you were truly smart you would have made your point once and stopped. But the fact that you stayed and argued and made discriminatory remarks to Americans is offensive and disgusting. Nobody likes a smartass.
Seriously - did you do a throttle reset? It's wise to. If you do an ECU upgrade it will have to be reset.
Signing off - Good luck!
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From: 1 hours drive north of Sydney Australia
2007 W204 220CDI Classic Sedan
A Dyno Experience from one user.
http://ls1tech.com/forums/dynamomete...nsistancy.html
http://ls1tech.com/forums/dynamomete...nsistancy.html
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w204
your sti was automatic or stick? guessing stick? I am NO guru with AWD cars but 20% seems low. rear wheel drive auto's are about 17-20% dt loss. manuals, considerably less. And obviously an sti or evo awd system is not a 4matic so if you were seeing 20%, MB's 7g slusher should be higher, no.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 2,052
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From: Vancouver, BC
2008 Mercedes C300 4Matic
your sti was automatic or stick? guessing stick? I am NO guru with AWD cars but 20% seems low. rear wheel drive auto's are about 17-20% dt loss. manuals, considerably less. And obviously an sti or evo awd system is not a 4matic so if you were seeing 20%, MB's 7g slusher should be higher, no.
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Saw 27% loss on VTD equipped transmissions(no one has these anymore I bet
). Stock USDM STI's don't settle at 20% consistent loss. I wish it did. They all have been dynoing at consistient 225~ awhp at 25% loss on a EJ257 motor. Tuners have been using this % for a while as not many things changed over the years until the GR chassis change.Back to topic. For a conservative dyno like the Mustang, having 20% loss is fairly impressive for AWD. Maybe MB underrated their M272 3.0L output?
