Parametric Equalizer in Audio 20
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,128
Likes: 19
From: Acapulco Mexico
2010 C300 Sport
Parametric Equalizer in Audio 20
Many have asked how to access this function.
First, to get into the Engineering Menu, press "Hang-up", "1" and "#" at the same time for a couple of seconds.
The rest of the photos show, in order, the hierarchy of screens.
PLEASE remember that a Parametric Equalizer is a sophisticated tool to correct some glaring sonic defects, it is NOT a "Tone Control". If speakers were perfect (none are) this equalizer, or even tone controls, would not be necessary!
These were the factory settings, except changing the Second band to a Gain of "0.0" instead of "+2.0" dB. When the equalizer is at "0.0" dB, of course NO Gain or attenuation is being applied, hence no change at that frequency, as are the 3rd and 4th bands as set from the factory.
Hope this is helpful.
First, to get into the Engineering Menu, press "Hang-up", "1" and "#" at the same time for a couple of seconds.
The rest of the photos show, in order, the hierarchy of screens.
PLEASE remember that a Parametric Equalizer is a sophisticated tool to correct some glaring sonic defects, it is NOT a "Tone Control". If speakers were perfect (none are) this equalizer, or even tone controls, would not be necessary!
These were the factory settings, except changing the Second band to a Gain of "0.0" instead of "+2.0" dB. When the equalizer is at "0.0" dB, of course NO Gain or attenuation is being applied, hence no change at that frequency, as are the 3rd and 4th bands as set from the factory.
Hope this is helpful.
Member
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
From: Virginia, USA
2009 C63 AMG
Many have asked how to access this function.
First, to get into the Engineering Menu, press "Hang-up", "1" and "#" at the same time for a couple of seconds.
The rest of the photos show, in order, the hierarchy of screens.
PLEASE remember that a Parametric Equalizer is a sophisticated tool to correct some glaring sonic defects, it is NOT a "Tone Control". If speakers were perfect (none are) this equalizer, or even tone controls, would not be necessary!
These were the factory settings, except changing the Second band to a Gain of "0.0" instead of "+2.0" dB. When the equalizer is at "0.0" dB, of course NO Gain or attenuation is being applied, hence no change at that frequency, as are the 3rd and 4th bands as set from the factory.
Hope this is helpful.
First, to get into the Engineering Menu, press "Hang-up", "1" and "#" at the same time for a couple of seconds.
The rest of the photos show, in order, the hierarchy of screens.
PLEASE remember that a Parametric Equalizer is a sophisticated tool to correct some glaring sonic defects, it is NOT a "Tone Control". If speakers were perfect (none are) this equalizer, or even tone controls, would not be necessary!
These were the factory settings, except changing the Second band to a Gain of "0.0" instead of "+2.0" dB. When the equalizer is at "0.0" dB, of course NO Gain or attenuation is being applied, hence no change at that frequency, as are the 3rd and 4th bands as set from the factory.
Hope this is helpful.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,128
Likes: 19
From: Acapulco Mexico
2010 C300 Sport
@AkaSigFreak: While it may be true that in the Parametric EQ section, the frequencies of 600 Hz and 2300 Hz, if these frequencies are changed, can only revert to 500 Hz, and 2000 or 2500 Hz respectively.
That said, in practical terms, as a musical octave represents the doubling of a frequency, the loss of the specific 600 Hz and 2300 Hz presets, whose differences are just a small fraction of an octave, are INSIGNIFICANT changes and challenge anyone to tell the difference in a double-blind listening test.
OTHER menus, for sure, DON'T MESS WITH THEM! Not me, anyway.
That said, in practical terms, as a musical octave represents the doubling of a frequency, the loss of the specific 600 Hz and 2300 Hz presets, whose differences are just a small fraction of an octave, are INSIGNIFICANT changes and challenge anyone to tell the difference in a double-blind listening test.
OTHER menus, for sure, DON'T MESS WITH THEM! Not me, anyway.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,128
Likes: 19
From: Acapulco Mexico
2010 C300 Sport
This thread is exclusively about the Audio 20, non-Harman Kardon system.
The Harman Kardon audio system for the W204, is perhaps the most sophisticated and sonically accurate, distortion-free stereo ever installed in a production automobile. The HK system is the result of 20 years and ten of thousands of hours of research, measurement and engineering efforts, and what is installed in the current C class was designed in parallel during the computer-modeling stage of the W204.
In order to keep hum and noise to a minimum, fibre-optic cable is used to connect the subwoofer to the main amplifier head. Besides this, special door panels and dampening materials are used to insure the proper loading of the speakers and accuracy of reproduction without resonances or distortions.
Plus time-delay to phase-align the driver outputs to best serve all listening positions.
SO... if you were one of the lucky ones to have received the Harman Kardon system in your W204 for the mere few hundreds of dollars that MB charges (an equivalently accurate home system would cost tens of thousands of dollars), the best recommendation is just to turn on the radio, insert a CD or plug in an iPod, and enjoy the music just as it is. (e.g. leave well enough alone!)
The REST of us will have to suffer and fiddle around and upgrade with aftermarket speaker systems and subwoofers, using to the maximum the limitations of the base Audio20 headunit, the purpose of this thread is to get the best from what is available in the Audio20, NOT the fabulous HK.
That said, with an Infinity Kappa speaker upgrade, a self-amplified subwoofer and dealing with various iPod Interface issues, the Audio20 system can perform at an excellent level that rivals that of the HK system.
The Harman Kardon audio system for the W204, is perhaps the most sophisticated and sonically accurate, distortion-free stereo ever installed in a production automobile. The HK system is the result of 20 years and ten of thousands of hours of research, measurement and engineering efforts, and what is installed in the current C class was designed in parallel during the computer-modeling stage of the W204.
In order to keep hum and noise to a minimum, fibre-optic cable is used to connect the subwoofer to the main amplifier head. Besides this, special door panels and dampening materials are used to insure the proper loading of the speakers and accuracy of reproduction without resonances or distortions.
Plus time-delay to phase-align the driver outputs to best serve all listening positions.
SO... if you were one of the lucky ones to have received the Harman Kardon system in your W204 for the mere few hundreds of dollars that MB charges (an equivalently accurate home system would cost tens of thousands of dollars), the best recommendation is just to turn on the radio, insert a CD or plug in an iPod, and enjoy the music just as it is. (e.g. leave well enough alone!)
The REST of us will have to suffer and fiddle around and upgrade with aftermarket speaker systems and subwoofers, using to the maximum the limitations of the base Audio20 headunit, the purpose of this thread is to get the best from what is available in the Audio20, NOT the fabulous HK.
That said, with an Infinity Kappa speaker upgrade, a self-amplified subwoofer and dealing with various iPod Interface issues, the Audio20 system can perform at an excellent level that rivals that of the HK system.
Member
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
From: Virginia, USA
2009 C63 AMG
Many have asked how to access this function.
First, to get into the Engineering Menu, press "Hang-up", "1" and "#" at the same time for a couple of seconds.
The rest of the photos show, in order, the hierarchy of screens.
PLEASE remember that a Parametric Equalizer is a sophisticated tool to correct some glaring sonic defects, it is NOT a "Tone Control". If speakers were perfect (none are) this equalizer, or even tone controls, would not be necessary!
These were the factory settings, except changing the Second band to a Gain of "0.0" instead of "+2.0" dB. When the equalizer is at "0.0" dB, of course NO Gain or attenuation is being applied, hence no change at that frequency, as are the 3rd and 4th bands as set from the factory.
Hope this is helpful.
First, to get into the Engineering Menu, press "Hang-up", "1" and "#" at the same time for a couple of seconds.
The rest of the photos show, in order, the hierarchy of screens.
PLEASE remember that a Parametric Equalizer is a sophisticated tool to correct some glaring sonic defects, it is NOT a "Tone Control". If speakers were perfect (none are) this equalizer, or even tone controls, would not be necessary!
These were the factory settings, except changing the Second band to a Gain of "0.0" instead of "+2.0" dB. When the equalizer is at "0.0" dB, of course NO Gain or attenuation is being applied, hence no change at that frequency, as are the 3rd and 4th bands as set from the factory.
Hope this is helpful.
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Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 171
Likes: 1
2008 C350
Excellent as usual, Bill.
Right now I'm planning on trading her in in 2 years or so and I'll possibly get another C Class. (Which stuns me, i've always looked down my nose at people who re-bought the same car!)
Anyway, the HK system is now on my list of things I wish I had in this one and defniitely will have in the next.
Question, though: I'm seriously considering going E-Class. Is the HK system on the E as stunning as it is on the C?
Primarily I'm looking at the E because of the safety tech that they just haven't trickled down to the C yet. My sister has blind spot BLIS on her 27k volvo s40 (great car btw) but it's not even an option on a 40k w204. Lame.
Drive alertness, blind spot, lane detection, infrared camera, etc. In addition to the drivetrain-centric safety systems, are very important to me. You know, they never were until I met the woman I'm marrying. All of a sudden I felt like I had something very very important to keep as safe as possible. That's why I chose the S60 before my C. The C didn't have many of the technolog-based safety features I wanted when I bought it, but the rest of the 'passive' safety features let me sleep well at night. The stability control hardware & software is great, the passenger compartment feels nearly blast-proof
, and also the fact that the car handles amazingly well is a safety thing to me as well. Sorry for droning on and on!!!
Right now I'm planning on trading her in in 2 years or so and I'll possibly get another C Class. (Which stuns me, i've always looked down my nose at people who re-bought the same car!)
Anyway, the HK system is now on my list of things I wish I had in this one and defniitely will have in the next.
Question, though: I'm seriously considering going E-Class. Is the HK system on the E as stunning as it is on the C?
Primarily I'm looking at the E because of the safety tech that they just haven't trickled down to the C yet. My sister has blind spot BLIS on her 27k volvo s40 (great car btw) but it's not even an option on a 40k w204. Lame.
Drive alertness, blind spot, lane detection, infrared camera, etc. In addition to the drivetrain-centric safety systems, are very important to me. You know, they never were until I met the woman I'm marrying. All of a sudden I felt like I had something very very important to keep as safe as possible. That's why I chose the S60 before my C. The C didn't have many of the technolog-based safety features I wanted when I bought it, but the rest of the 'passive' safety features let me sleep well at night. The stability control hardware & software is great, the passenger compartment feels nearly blast-proof
, and also the fact that the car handles amazingly well is a safety thing to me as well. Sorry for droning on and on!!!
I added 4db at 13khz and the highs are really clear now. It's a pretty decent stereo now with the adjustments.
Member
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 126
Likes: 3
From: Toronto
2019 C43 Coupe
Wow Bill! I always thought my HK system was fantastic but you just made me feel a heck of a lot better about it!!
This thread is exclusively about the Audio 20, non-Harman Kardon system.
The Harman Kardon audio system for the W204, is perhaps the most sophisticated and sonically accurate, distortion-free stereo ever installed in a production automobile. The HK system is the result of 20 years and ten of thousands of hours of research, measurement and engineering efforts, and what is installed in the current C class was designed in parallel during the computer-modeling stage of the W204.
In order to keep hum and noise to a minimum, fibre-optic cable is used to connect the subwoofer to the main amplifier head. Besides this, special door panels and dampening materials are used to insure the proper loading of the speakers and accuracy of reproduction without resonances or distortions.
Plus time-delay to phase-align the driver outputs to best serve all listening positions.
SO... if you were one of the lucky ones to have received the Harman Kardon system in your W204 for the mere few hundreds of dollars that MB charges (an equivalently accurate home system would cost tens of thousands of dollars), the best recommendation is just to turn on the radio, insert a CD or plug in an iPod, and enjoy the music just as it is. (e.g. leave well enough alone!)
The REST of us will have to suffer and fiddle around and upgrade with aftermarket speaker systems and subwoofers, using to the maximum the limitations of the base Audio20 headunit, the purpose of this thread is to get the best from what is available in the Audio20, NOT the fabulous HK.
That said, with an Infinity Kappa speaker upgrade, a self-amplified subwoofer and dealing with various iPod Interface issues, the Audio20 system can perform at an excellent level that rivals that of the HK system.
The Harman Kardon audio system for the W204, is perhaps the most sophisticated and sonically accurate, distortion-free stereo ever installed in a production automobile. The HK system is the result of 20 years and ten of thousands of hours of research, measurement and engineering efforts, and what is installed in the current C class was designed in parallel during the computer-modeling stage of the W204.
In order to keep hum and noise to a minimum, fibre-optic cable is used to connect the subwoofer to the main amplifier head. Besides this, special door panels and dampening materials are used to insure the proper loading of the speakers and accuracy of reproduction without resonances or distortions.
Plus time-delay to phase-align the driver outputs to best serve all listening positions.
SO... if you were one of the lucky ones to have received the Harman Kardon system in your W204 for the mere few hundreds of dollars that MB charges (an equivalently accurate home system would cost tens of thousands of dollars), the best recommendation is just to turn on the radio, insert a CD or plug in an iPod, and enjoy the music just as it is. (e.g. leave well enough alone!)
The REST of us will have to suffer and fiddle around and upgrade with aftermarket speaker systems and subwoofers, using to the maximum the limitations of the base Audio20 headunit, the purpose of this thread is to get the best from what is available in the Audio20, NOT the fabulous HK.
That said, with an Infinity Kappa speaker upgrade, a self-amplified subwoofer and dealing with various iPod Interface issues, the Audio20 system can perform at an excellent level that rivals that of the HK system.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,128
Likes: 19
From: Acapulco Mexico
2010 C300 Sport
Somehow I will have to get a hold of a decent 1/3 octave spectrum analyzer and do a check on both the stock speakers and an upgraded system like the Infinity´s. This with the objective of getting everything audiophile FLAT and W204 owners could flavor their sound from there.
I was browsing the MB UK website and the explanation of the various levels of audio and nav options is much clearer than MB USA. When you "Configure" your car on the UK site, there is a whole "entertainment" section and there are many more variations than I imagined. Very educational. Here is the link:
http://www2.mercedes-benz.co.uk/cont...M6cv:15hadqdfm
For those who wish to forge forward and "do it by ear" with the Parametric Equalizer, maybe one could create a manual "PE 101" or "PE's for Dummies" downloadable document in PDF. The adjustment and results are not understood by most, and hope that cleankutazn doesnt have a dog. Just kidding.
I was browsing the MB UK website and the explanation of the various levels of audio and nav options is much clearer than MB USA. When you "Configure" your car on the UK site, there is a whole "entertainment" section and there are many more variations than I imagined. Very educational. Here is the link:
http://www2.mercedes-benz.co.uk/cont...M6cv:15hadqdfm
For those who wish to forge forward and "do it by ear" with the Parametric Equalizer, maybe one could create a manual "PE 101" or "PE's for Dummies" downloadable document in PDF. The adjustment and results are not understood by most, and hope that cleankutazn doesnt have a dog. Just kidding.
Newbie
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: So Cal
W204 C350
Somehow I will have to get a hold of a decent 1/3 octave spectrum analyzer and do a check on both the stock speakers and an upgraded system like the Infinity´s. This with the objective of getting everything audiophile FLAT and W204 owners could flavor their sound from there.
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/rta/id298839433?mt=8
Built-in compensation curves for the iPhone mics. Not 100% professional quality, but pretty damn good for 11 bucks US.
I have a slightly different (and slightly more expensive) app that I use exactly as you describe. Mine has a built-in pink noise generator, so I can even use it in rental cars.
I'll be stunned if similar apps are missing from the Android marketplace.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,128
Likes: 19
From: Acapulco Mexico
2010 C300 Sport
@zkrr: Can you provide the link for the app with the pink noise generator?Amazing if it provides proper results.
I actually wanted to get a "waterfall" printout of a "chirp", a short square wave burst that contains all frequencies, and determine the parametric equalizer settings based on the resonances of the loudspeaker's sound decay.
I actually wanted to get a "waterfall" printout of a "chirp", a short square wave burst that contains all frequencies, and determine the parametric equalizer settings based on the resonances of the loudspeaker's sound decay.
Member
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 220
Likes: 0
From: Virginia, USA
2009 C63 AMG
@zkrr: Can you provide the link for the app with the pink noise generator?Amazing if it provides proper results.
I actually wanted to get a "waterfall" printout of a "chirp", a short square wave burst that contains all frequencies, and determine the parametric equalizer settings based on the resonances of the loudspeaker's sound decay.
I actually wanted to get a "waterfall" printout of a "chirp", a short square wave burst that contains all frequencies, and determine the parametric equalizer settings based on the resonances of the loudspeaker's sound decay.
I tried matching your settings and had a few questions. When adjusting one side of the speaker, say left front, I can only set things at 500 intervals. I can't get the precise numbers you have on the pictures above. However, if I set it to values close to what you have, the right front speaker's values are exact match of the ones in the pictures you provided. Do you know why this is? Also, should the rear speaker's values be changed as well? My default for all 4 were 'flat'. When I hit 'tune' all the numbers go blank and I am not able to change the values. Just wondering if you knew why this is.
Newbie
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: So Cal
W204 C350
Here's the app I use (Pocket RTA):
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/pocke...317080174?mt=8
Works well, but Pocket RTA must be manually calibrated for the iPhone mic (it provides the tools for this, but you have to have access to a reference analyzer to compare).
The other version i linked to before is RTA from a developer called Studio Six:
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/pocke...317080174?mt=8
RTA is a newer app than Pocket RTA -- it's part of what looks to be an excellent collection from Studio Six called 'Audio Tools':
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/audio...325307477?mt=8
But Audio Tools is expensive, as you have to buy each of the modules as an in-app purchase. As a result, though, it has more advanced features available.
Unfortunately, RTA, and therefore Audio Tools, *don't* have built-in tone generators. The developer promises to add them in the next release. And for pink noise, at least, it's easy to record a sample on a CD or a .wav file and use that as the source. Personally, if I didn't have Pocket RTA already, I would probably go with Audio Tools/RTA due to support for pre-defined iPhone mic curves (a different curve for each iPhone model, BTW).
- --- kevin
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/pocke...317080174?mt=8
Works well, but Pocket RTA must be manually calibrated for the iPhone mic (it provides the tools for this, but you have to have access to a reference analyzer to compare).
The other version i linked to before is RTA from a developer called Studio Six:
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/pocke...317080174?mt=8
RTA is a newer app than Pocket RTA -- it's part of what looks to be an excellent collection from Studio Six called 'Audio Tools':
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/audio...325307477?mt=8
But Audio Tools is expensive, as you have to buy each of the modules as an in-app purchase. As a result, though, it has more advanced features available.
Unfortunately, RTA, and therefore Audio Tools, *don't* have built-in tone generators. The developer promises to add them in the next release. And for pink noise, at least, it's easy to record a sample on a CD or a .wav file and use that as the source. Personally, if I didn't have Pocket RTA already, I would probably go with Audio Tools/RTA due to support for pre-defined iPhone mic curves (a different curve for each iPhone model, BTW).
- --- kevin
Senior Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 490
Likes: 7
From: HELL A
GLC 2026
Hey Bill,
I tried matching your settings and had a few questions. When adjusting one side of the speaker, say left front, I can only set things at 500 intervals. I can't get the precise numbers you have on the pictures above. However, if I set it to values close to what you have, the right front speaker's values are exact match of the ones in the pictures you provided. Do you know why this is? Also, should the rear speaker's values be changed as well? My default for all 4 were 'flat'. When I hit 'tune' all the numbers go blank and I am not able to change the values. Just wondering if you knew why this is.
I tried matching your settings and had a few questions. When adjusting one side of the speaker, say left front, I can only set things at 500 intervals. I can't get the precise numbers you have on the pictures above. However, if I set it to values close to what you have, the right front speaker's values are exact match of the ones in the pictures you provided. Do you know why this is? Also, should the rear speaker's values be changed as well? My default for all 4 were 'flat'. When I hit 'tune' all the numbers go blank and I am not able to change the values. Just wondering if you knew why this is.
Thread Starter
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,128
Likes: 19
From: Acapulco Mexico
2010 C300 Sport
There is some kind of input level adjustment in the engineering menu. However, Mercedes recognizes the problem aux level and has developed, for instance, an iPod amplifier to boost the aux output from the iPod before going through the iPod integration kit (which has no reason to touch the signal, it is just an interface to display info on the speedo).
Perhaps the MB dealer has an adaptor to connect the aux jack through the iPod amplifier. and PLEASE make sure it is the part sourced from Germany, not China, which is poorly manufactured and distorts the aux signal terribly. Here is a thread and pictures, part nos.
https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ff-beware.html
Perhaps the MB dealer has an adaptor to connect the aux jack through the iPod amplifier. and PLEASE make sure it is the part sourced from Germany, not China, which is poorly manufactured and distorts the aux signal terribly. Here is a thread and pictures, part nos.
https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ff-beware.html
