Normandie4life

Hey guys have a question i want to know if u have done a ecu tune if you put a sprint booster will ur car get more improved throttle response or since you did a ecu tune sprint booster wont make any difference anymore. Can you have both or its not nessasary

jimmythegreek

I have both, definitely an improvement. The tune doesnt do much for throttle response and it only slightly feels faster, not much. figure 10 hp no matter what they claim on a 300, 15hp on a 350

Normandie4life

So both wrk in their own different ways if you have them, i was told no point in geting the ecu tune if ur geting da sprint booster it already feels you car goes faster but then sprint booster just makes it not to lag

Glyn M Ruck

They will work together. The sprint booster will increase throttle response. It does not reduce lag - that is programmed into the ECU. The sprint booster is merely an amplifier. The throttle plate opens further for a given pedal movement & is wide open over the last approx 30% of pedal movement with SB installed.

Normandie4life

Thx for the info

wnunez89

ecu tune improves Hp & torque
sprint booster is just better throttle response.

Normandie4life

i got couple major mods going on right now i have spent about $600 and got another $700 to spend by the end of the month but ones im done the car is going to have a total different look from what you guys have seen

wnunez89

cant wait to see it.

kevink2

That is how the SB operates. How do you define Lag, and what variables does the ECU tweak to establish your Lag? It has a universal meaning for turbo cars, but that's different. I ~eliminated lag in an old Saab turbo by changing timing .. it ran like a big V6.

Glyn M Ruck

The throttle plate actuator does not respond instantly to throttle pedal input on a Merc. This is what we are terming lag in this context.

It has two components to my knowledge.
1) Processing latency - this you can do nothing about.
2) Programmed damping of the throttle to smooth out erratic input from a driver. This can be varied & "improved" by a savvy ECU tuner.

Turbo lag is governed by "spin up" time & is usually countered by fitting a smaller turbo with a shorter spooling time. BMW fit a small & large turbo to give you the benefits of both.

6.2AMG

does anyone have both on a c63?? i have a w212 e63 and im getting a tune and im interested in sprint booster...
thanks

chewychiu

can i ask where you got your 350 tuned and with what tune and how much?

kevink2

This cpu lag was carefullyy measured on a 1999 mercedes, in the famous sprint booster "white paper" .

SprintBooster.pdf

This was clearly shown in Fig 2, where the pedal was rapidly floored, and pedal and TB response were measured. The initial throttle lag was 1/22 nd of a second, and the final lag at WOT was 1/28 th of a second. These are tiny numbers, representing the "ecu lag".

If the current TB response curve is similar to this 1998 model, the "ecu lag" is negligible.

Correct !

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Unless the

Glyn M Ruck

Yes Kevin. The numbers are small. They vary by market I'm told but are nevertheless tiny.

However we humans are sensitive to the disconnected feel this gives us, just as we are very sensitive to audio latency.

We should remember that this is not the only lag in the system.

-We have ECU/throttle plate lag.
-We have TCU lag.
-We have lag created as the MAF fights to get fuel trim under control when we stomp on the throttle.
-We have lag created by the variable length inlet & swirl systems on the inlet manifold.
-We have flywheel/TC effects.

People are equally aware of & able to sense the SB effect. While ECU tunes are certainly able to move torque & horsepower curves around by usually giving up in one area & gaining in another I have little doubt that many tuners also do a SB type simulation & make the throttle a little more sensitive. Good for the butt dyno.

jimmythegreek

My initial tune was with OEtuning, i had 800 miles on my 2011 and was in break in period, but I ripped out the interior to redo the whole system so I figured I would send it out then so I wouldnt be down a whole week later on. This car feels faster than my 08c350, the tune def helps, I got it for arond 500 during a promotion they had. I overnited it to cali and then 2 days and back to me. I have since gotten the brabus tune on a diff ECU i had coded to my car by my dealer. My godbrother is the service manager and I got a steal on the ECU, literally. My brother-in-law did some work in germany for brabus and got me the tune as a gift he got it for free. I sent him over w the ECU from the states, I beleive the brabus tune is like 1500 retail, I would never pay that or more than a few hundred, we r talking a few HP w a tune, nothing major. Supposedly brabus tuned the ECU for 93 octane (what i run here in NJ) and for a free flowing exhasut system, I have a meisterschaft custom setup. I would love to dyno tune my car but theres nobody around, they are just generic tunes really for these cars. I did race my moms 2010 C350 w my cousin drivin hers, hes got a porsche and knows how to run a car. same setup in S mode trac off and I had a car length plus on 2 runs dead start from a light so I beleive the tune does something. I since got a sprintbooster a few months ago and I like it too. I can run my car in C mode and its more responsive, I have dynamic handling package and to get S mode on this car I have to engage the sport suspension and its really stiff with the drop being so low on my car...........

kevink2

How may us models offered this package? I think it first showed up on the Corvette. I't sounds like a great option.

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kevink2

Thanks for the detailed reply Glyn. I offer these comments on lag, with great respect:

1) ECU/TP ... agreed, tiny. Back to the white paper Fig-2 , stock (1999) system. Time to rapidly floor it was .284 sec, while initial lag was .045 sec. The lag was 1/6 th the time to floor the pedal, in this test.

2) TCU ... no efffect at launch, but clearly noticeable during transient based shifts.

3) MAF reacting to stomped pedal ... Not likely, IMHO. For a quick, significant change in load, the ecu utilizes fixed open loop map sets for fuel flow vs load & rpm, and no trim (closed loop) is involved.

4) Manifold flow systems ... Don't know about this.

5) Flywheel and TC effects ... Assume you mean the rotational inertia. This is only signficant during max engine acceleration in first few gears, and even there not noticed as a lag, as it is lumped in with the task of accelerating the mass of the car.

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Glyn M Ruck

I think we pretty much agree although I'm told that the MAF does create some hunting as the system decides what to do. If true the latency will nevertheless be small. Certainly agree with "rotational inertia" but believe that TC can lead to perception of disconnection due to slip.

What I think all of this displays is how sensitive we are to latency or what we experience as lag as a Benz goes about it's business.

kevink2

Agreed, and I think some of the perceived lag is the very nonlinear TB response curve vs pedal travel, illustrated for the 1999 model in the SB "white paper". It shows minimal initial response.

If the current models have the same response curve, then you get this response in the TB for the listed pedal depressions:

Pedal ----- TB

1/4 ----- 4.0%
3/8 ----- 11%
1/2 ----- 29%

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Glyn M Ruck

+1