Sportstick

For those who have not seen yesterday's news, here is an interesting nugget from the new Consumer's Union report.

Of 28 brands, Mercedes-Benz was 18, BMW 19, and Audi, at 26, was third from the bottom. Within MB, the lowest quality model was the GL, and the highest quality was.......C Class (rear wheel drive model)!

A lot of chatter around here supports the overall quality of the C Class, and it's nice to see something beyond anecdotal data that agrees.


(Other than Volvo at #10, the top 12 spots were all Asian brands, with Jeep as the #1 American brand...once again proving the only thing constant is change.)

bigben320e

Links?

Sportstick

You need to be a subscriber to read the original report. Try this and click to enlarge the graphic on the lower left:

http://www.freep.com/article/2011102...xt|FRONTPAGE|p

bigben320e

Awesome...let me do something.

There:

Sportstick

That helps.....good skills! Thanks!

WorstNightmare

Not to sound ignorant on this... but what are these "studies" based on?

I've hopped in several brand new Chrysler products, and quite frankly they feel like absolute junk...... cheaply made plastics, cheapo buttons, low on power, and rattly plastic pieces all around.

My roomate's brand new Jeep Wrangler has been in the shop now 3 times with transmission problems, and random vehicle shut off issues.

I really don't see how they've upped their quality.....

GM ... oh god, please don't even get me started on those.

bigben320e

Your name and your post ironically...match. LOL.

You are right about those damn Jeeps, Chrysler's, and several other lines. Not say I agree or disagree with the data or findings but I wonder about how they determined these results as well. Number of failures out of 100? 1000? What? How?

Now my personal experience, with GM and Chrysler products have been dismal. On my 300M, transmission malfunction at 85K. Interior falling apart around 60-70K, cheap plastics, just CHEAP. I had to replace all of the door seals on the car, they all buckled and deteriorated. After I sold the car at 120K and transmission replacement, shortly after coil packs failure and transmission issues again from what the new owner told me. WTF?

On the flip, my 1998 E320 with 220K miles on it has never had any issues except for a left cat replacement, replace the front aux fans, and just routine upkeep. I drive her M-T every week.

My Buick Regal, let's not even go into that....

However, we can never forget the issues MB's have had and have though. There have been a lot of dog's especially 1999-2004. 100K paperweights.

ddatin

Volvo is an Asian brand. It's 100% owned by the Chinese. Just like the VW Jetta, made in Puebla Mexico, is German even though it's made in Mexico.

Sportstick

An interesting but odd distinction. VW is German as the corporate activities are in Germany, engineering, design, development, the essence of what defines a vehicle. Assembly plants for various companies are located outside their home markets. The situation is not analogous for Volvo, as all of those functions are in Sweden, including assembly, with only the corporate financial ownership having been purchased by a Chinese company. Similarly, Chrysler, Dodge, and Jeep are not now Italian brands, simply due to a change in legal status of the ownership.

Choy

That is funny. I used to own a Volvo XC90 that needs a new tranny after 50K miles. Known problem for 2004 to 2005 MY. The funny thing is that the trans was made by GM. For 2006 thereafter, they changed their trans dealer.

encoder

So looking at that chart, the C-Class is about 20% more reliable than industry average.

Glyn M Ruck

The W204 C Class is well screwed together. If W204 diesel models were included they would do even better.

I'm really surprised at Porsche. I wonder if all faults carry equal weight. Complexity on German designs usually give a few niggles whereas the Asians frequently have more simple execution of the same features. I still find NA built cars interior plastic work etc. dismal. NA built cars have generally been mechanically solid if a little crude in certain areas such as NVH on some configurations.

Sportstick

....and, if MB's best is C Class and Audi's best is A4, we can see the differential between those two cars which some Audi trolls occasionally bring up here, not knowing the data.

Sportstick

Porsche seems to be struggling with Cayenne which represents some significant volume for them here. This survey does not assess how much someone likes the proverbial piece of plastic, but only if that piece of plastic fell off. Having said that, if you haven't sat in a 2012 version of several Chrysler models, including the 300, new Grand Cherokee, and Dodge Durango, you will be surprised at the difference a new, more enlightened management can make.

Glyn M Ruck

Yes - the 300 & the Grand Cherokee sell in SA & I agree with you.

See my edit above on diesels.

Glyn M Ruck

Indeed. More a reliability survey than quality.

bigben320e

Excatly, so people have to keep that in perspective when looking at the list.

Sportstick

Yes, for consumer data on satisfaction with design and performance, go to J.D.Power's website.

ddatin

Unfortunately for the western world, the Volvo intellectual property and high paying jobs are already in transition to China.

http://www.chinaautoreview.com/pub/CARArticle.aspx?ID=5424

"According to the announced strategy, the Shanghai headquarters will serve as Geely-Volvo’s administration center in China and the Shanghai technical center will be responsible for the design and research and development of high-end sedans, electric vehicles and new energy vehicles."

Three state of the art Volvo manufacturing plants are almost completed in China. The legacy plants in the western world will just manufacture what the technical center in Shanghai develops.

I don't think anyone really believed that China would not move the intelectual property, R&D and design functions to a lower cost source.

Each time a Volvo is purchased, China grows richer.

Sportstick

If this comes to pass, my view of current view of Volvo will no longer be correct. However, there are also press reports that Geely management has said, "Let Volvo be Volvo" and vowed not to interfere in their ongoing work. We will need to see what happens.