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Differential Fluid Change (4MATIC Owners)

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Differential Fluid Change (4MATIC Owners)

 
Old 12-19-2011, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by qaz393 View Post
there is not transfer case for W204-4matics!!!! i cannot stress this enough times. The transfer gears all all integrated into the transmission sharing the oil with the transmission!!!

Here is a video I found showing the 4m system at work on the w221, check out 1:15, it mentions the integrated transfer case, you were right, my question is what happens to that transfer case on the RWD models, their transmission must have a different part number and must be built without that transfer case right?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZoIc4SyZy2M

Last edited by LandSeaAir; 12-19-2011 at 06:28 PM.
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by LandSeaAir View Post
Okay makes sense. So if this is the case, would that mean that W204 4MATICs have different transmissions than the RWD cars? If its all integrated into one unit than you would need a transmission that has a driveline going to the front and rear whereas the RWD cars just have one going to the rear, and again if its all integrated, the whole unit must be different. Its hard for me to understand.

I know this isn't a reliable source but this listing for a W204 trans claims it works for RWD and AWD, how could that be?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/722-9-TRANSM...#ht_1251wt_945

I've been look for a 4MATIC system diagram, no luck yet.


here is a picture from the GLK sales brocher. looks like its all integrated into the same unit.
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:33 PM
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Here we go.

Attached Thumbnails Differential Fluid Change (4MATIC Owners)-4matic-layout.jpg  
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:33 PM
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if you take a look at them manual, the 4matic cars use more fluid than the 2wd cars. this is because the transfer gearing is all integrated into one unit!!!

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Old 12-19-2011, 06:40 PM
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Here's a C-Class / GLK Class 4-Matic differential.... Sure looks like it has a drain and filler plug to me!




... seen here too! (#3).. but the filler plug looks sealed off in this sketch.


Last edited by MBRedux; 12-19-2011 at 09:36 PM.
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:41 PM
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And to top it all off, it seems the E-Class for some reason has a separate transfer case, so JC had correct info, just different for the C-class, taken from the MBusa website:

notice bottom left of picture

Differential Fluid Change (4MATIC Owners)-picture2.png
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:41 PM
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The transfer case is integral with the transmission. It bolts straight onto the back of the 722.9 in place of the tail shaft. All Benz 4Matic systems are modifications of the same theme. The E Class & C Class have the same system. Propshafts are different.

Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; 12-19-2011 at 07:49 PM. Reason: Softened & accuracy.
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by MBRedux View Post
Here's a C-Class / GLK Class 4-Matic transfer case.... Sure looks like it has a drain and filler plug to me!




... seen here too! (#3).. but the filler plug looks sealed off in this sketch.

thats not a transfer case. its a differential. y u guys no understand?
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:49 PM
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Originally Posted by qaz393 View Post
thats not a transfer case. its a differential. y u guys no understand?
My bad... not thinking... you're right... it's a dif... the car is rear drive, with a front differential... and one in back as well...
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Old 12-19-2011, 06:53 PM
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lets not talk about the e-class. the w212 should be the same, but keep that in e-class forums please. people here are getting confused........

in the end, no transfer case like the older 4matic for the W204. front and rear differentials need different gear oil (85w-90)
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Old 12-19-2011, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Of course the transfer case is integral with the transmission. It bolts staraight onto the back of the 722.9 in place of the tail shaft. All Benz 4Matic systems are modifications of the same theme. The E Class & C Class have the same system. Propshafts are different.
Here - corrected

5 speed C Class Transfer Case:



5 speed E Class Transfer Case:

Attached Thumbnails Differential Fluid Change (4MATIC Owners)-w204-transfer-case.jpg   Differential Fluid Change (4MATIC Owners)-e-class-w211-212-transfer-case..jpg  

Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; 12-19-2011 at 09:15 PM.
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Old 12-19-2011, 07:02 PM
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so i think the important question here is

does the w204 transmission fluid flow through the transfer case too or is it a separate loop?
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Old 12-19-2011, 07:10 PM
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The transmission fluid is common sump. There is no seal between transmission & transfer case.

Edit - This appears to apply to W204/W212 I can't identify if this applies from certain VIN numbers. Benz has done a number of running upgrades on the 4Matic system. LandSeaAir - What E Class was that you posted for above?

W203/W211 have a level plug at the rear but no drain & show a seal & run on transmission fluid. Now I intend investigating whether any service has ever been recommended on W203/211 4 Matics.

Both new and old have magnets in the base of the housing.

Last edited by Glyn M Ruck; 12-19-2011 at 08:13 PM.
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Old 12-19-2011, 07:18 PM
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And this must be why the 4MATIC engine requires 7.4 quarts of oil while the RWD takes 8.5, always wondered how a awd system could effect engine oil capacity, I learned a lot from this thread!

Differential Fluid Change (4MATIC Owners)-4-matic.jpg
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Old 12-19-2011, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by LandSeaAir View Post
And this must be why the 4MATIC engine requires 7.4 quarts of oil while the RWD takes 8.5, always wondered how a awd system could effect engine oil capacity, I learned a lot from this thread!

Indeed - the driveshaft goes through the sump. This can mess with sucking oil out of a 4Matic's engine. Many gripes on the 203 forum.
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Old 12-19-2011, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
The transmission fluid is common sump. There is no seal between transmission & transfer case.

Edit - This appears to apply to W204/W212 I can't identify if this applies from certain VIN numbers. Benz has done a number of running upgrades on the 4Matic system. LandSeaAir - What E Class was that you posted for above?

W203/W211 have a level plug at the rear but no drain & show a seal & run on transmission fluid. Now I intend investigating whether any service has ever been recommended on W203/211 4 Matics. I don't think I have seen any for 203.

Both new and old have magnets in the base of the housing.
i believe only the W211 with V8 AND 7Gtronic AND 4matic (e500/e550). the other W211 used a 5 speed with a 4matic and that required a separate transfer case oil.

Originally Posted by LandSeaAir View Post
And this must be why the 4MATIC engine requires 7.4 quarts of oil while the RWD takes 8.5, always wondered how a awd system could effect engine oil capacity, I learned a lot from this thread!

has been mention before. you can still drain it but you might or might not get all of it out.
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Old 12-19-2011, 08:24 PM
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Indeed - Look what I found and I'm pleased I did. With the 5 Speed 4matic the transfer case took gear oil. This applies to W203 & W211. W204 4Matics were a running change to 7 speed - Yes? That is why the EPC is confusing. The above diagrams I have posted are for 5 Speed 4Matics.

Here is oil drain method for 5 speed 4Matics.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf
Oil change on transfer case.pdf (196.2 KB, 1500 views)
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Old 12-19-2011, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Indeed - Look what I found and I'm pleased I did. With the 5 Speed 4matic the transfer case took gear oil. This applies to W203 & W211. W204 4Matics were a running change to 7 speed - Yes? That is why the EPC is confusing. The above diagrams I have posted are for 5 Speed 4Matics.

Here is oil drain method for 5 speed 4Matics.
sort of a useless link for w204 forum. if possible can you put the one for w204 7g up??? thanks!!!
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:13 PM
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Thanks guys. It's been some useful research. The W204 4Matics were never built in RHD so I have limited knowledge of them.
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
Thanks guys. It's been some useful research. The W204 4Matics were never built in RHD so I have limited knowledge of them.
i thought they were in the UK?? what about trying to look for the e-class ones since they do share the same tranny?

just looked on japan site. they offer 4matic but in LHD form. never knew 4matix is so exclusivly for LHD markets.....
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:33 PM
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No RHD 4Matics built.

I've had my say here. If you want any more go look it up yourself.
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
No RHD 4Matics built.

I've had my say here. If you want any more go look it up yourself.
where can i find??? what about the ML/R/GL??
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by qaz393 View Post
i believe only the W211 with V8 AND 7Gtronic AND 4matic (e500/e550). the other W211 used a 5 speed with a 4matic and that required a separate transfer case oil.



has been mention before. you can still drain it but you might or might not get all of it out.
Actually the driveshaft doesn't go through the sump... it goes under it... there's a a channel under the sump where it goes through.... thus it decreases the capacity of the sump in AWD 4-Matics... this was widely discussed in the GLK forum.
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:55 PM
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Originally Posted by MBRedux View Post
Actually the driveshaft doesn't go through the sump... it goes under it... there's a a channel under the sump where it goes through.... thus it decreases the capacity of the sump in AWD 4-Matics... this was widely discussed in the GLK forum.
+1 - Terminology - my bad
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Old 12-19-2011, 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by qaz393 View Post
where can i find??? what about the ML/R/GL??
Purchase or obtain a copy of the WIS & EPC & almost dedicate a computer to it.

When you learn some manners you will find me highly cooperative.
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