Finally got a chance to drive one. Was kinda meh about it from a performance standpoint, but would have loved to put her under the knife and see what power could be squeaked out. Would have preferred to see her in a turbo-6 variant.

 

Yeah, as I mentioned BMW has softened everything up these days and it's not like the previous model. The skid pad and slalom numbers are impressive with the new C Class (compared to the earlier versions.) Although Car and Driver still awarded the BMW and Audi with their subjective handling characteristics and 'fun to drive' ratings over the C Class. In the 'seat of the pants' subjective feel, the C Class isn't the same. And C&D ranked the car next to the bottom with the Volvo S60 coming in last. The C Class lacks that 'feel' of sportiness.

Another review with the same line of thinking comes from Motor Trend and also Edmunds Inside Line: http://www.insideline.com/bmw/3-seri...ison-test.html

That all said, I'd get the C Class (C350) over the BMW as a daily driver. For a project car for tuning and sports driving, I'd go with BMW and Audi. But ideally with the E46 or E90 and probably not the new version of BMW 328i (although the 335i would be a different issue.)

 

I drove all three of those cars, to be honest I didn't feel a big difference and but than again I was not doing a car and driver type drive. I think we put way to much emphasis on characteristics that we as normal drivers can use or even really want. Just my 2 cents

 

The 2.5L M272 from the 06-07 C230s lives on. It has a long history of being low on power yet very thirsty.

The old M271, like in my car, is down on power compared to the new but there is no lag associated with it due to the supercharger. I like the engine in this application but will not have another, this thread re-iterates that.

 

Will be interesting to see how long the timing chain lasts in the M271 Evo Turbo.

 

"One bad apple" ? That's some powerful understatement! This was the worst spill in history. "Punishing"? It would seem prudent to stop until there was strong evidence that the rest of the drillers knew what they were doing and could better contain an accident. Until this event, we all thought BP was among them. Here is non-partisan review from National Geographic.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/n...op-kill-obama/

Gulf oil drilling resumed 2/28/11.

Also, the price of gas has almost nothing to do with the gulf, Keystone pipeline, etc. Oil is a world market, and price fluctuations in the US have exactly mirrored world price changes (although we pay among the lowest taxes on gasoline, keeping our actual prices lower), driven much more by the rapidly growing demand in Asia (specifically China). The bottleneck in the US is not drilling, as there are many available offshore leases not being drilled. The U.S. problem is refining capacity.

http://gaspricesexplained.org/#a-global-commodity

 

That's reasonable. I was too limiting in just focusing on the frame, as "chassis" does include the suspension.


imho, the buyer of the (once avoided) tubo engine cares less about ever increasing cafe standards (an approach that I don't like), and more about mpg's, and that demographic is larger than any other buyer.

 

No question about the magnitude of the tragity. One reason for the magnitude of the leak was the EPA not allowing resonable risk in the fix that was finally used ( it was suggested in the first week, both there and on forums I followed. One simply needs to look at the record of the other drillers, and trans ocean was worst by 10. Because of this one bad apple, most of the gulf rigs are still shut down. Enough politics, I was wrong to bring it up.

.

 

No problem...an interesting topic, without any personal invective, and fuel consumption and the price of gas are still within the thread! Always glad to find folks willing to get into a significant area of discussion!

Have a good day!

 

I just got back early this morning from a trip DC -> NYC -> DC. I made it on 1 tank of gas with 65 miles on the range to spare as it sits in my garage right now.

29.4 MPG at a 63 MPH average.

The thing is an absolute baby out on the highway - most of the time was spent at 80+ MPH on the NJ Turnpike with the A/C set on 68. I love how this thing pulls in the midrange - makes for great quick passes around stupid people hogging the left lanes and getting the jump on people out of tollbooths.

I know at least for me, it was the perfect choice.

 

They haven't made the M271 EVO more efficient than the M271 was paired to a 5-speed box? Odd.

 

That is indeed the case, as I've previously pointed out even on other threads from many journalist reviews here in Australia, the new C Class coupe has moved up the handling/steering response etc. ladder compared to previous MB's and is as good or better than the current E92's and combines that handling with unmatched ride quality.

You made a good choice, it's always a case of each to their own, I'm set and happy with the diesels but IMHO if it were between those 2 variants, I too would choose a C250 petrol over the C350 petrol all things considered

 

Bottom I am happy with the C250 and happy with the car. Just looking for a little bit more power and I found that with the JB. All is good, I would recommend this car and power plant to anybody.

 

Well, how effective an "elixir" is it ?
Enquiring minds want to know ...

.

 

getting my 2012 C200 in under a week here in shanghai. can't wait to get back into another benz again!

 

the c250 is a capable car .. certainly better than the c300 v6.. i know because my mom has a 2011 c300..

with a tune.. the c250 is a rocket in the mid range...

bottom line is it's quick.. handles good.. very stiff chasis and suspension not uncomfortable..

my evo drives on rails but its so stiff it's like a go kart.. lotta haters around here.. most probably never drove the c250 and just talking outta their ***.. yes i'm talking to you

 

Please watch your language. Everyone's opinion is equally valid...including yours about your mom's car.

 

I went ahead and contacted the JB people. I asked and they answered.

----------------------------------------------------------

Me:
I considered trading in an older Mercedes C300 and buying a C250, but as-is there is a lot of lag, confused shifts, and when in manual mode, a delay in up-shifts after requested. On the highway it's great. I was thinking your JB+ would fix what ails it.

I have some experience with curing terrible lag on an old 83 Saab APC turbo, with mechanical timing control. It started with low base advance at idle, and at 4 psi it dumped all retard in .. just like throwing out a boat anchor. The cure was to advance base timing, and replace the crude pressure-pod mechanical retard with an MSD Boost Timing Master, that allowed linear introduction of boost retard. With these timing changes, it drove like it had a BMW 3.0 I6 under the hood.

Point is I found advancing timing was critical in reducing turbo delay. When I looked at your dyno curves, it was not apparent that there was timing changes as boost came up.

Please let me know if your JB+ alters timing, in particular does it add advance as initial boost rise occurs? Also, does it directly alter the atx trans ecu? Based on the nice dyno curves you published, it's obvious you adjusted boost and fuel maps. Just curious now ... does tune have a change in gas pedal response (aka sprintbooster)?

---------------------------------------------------------------

Them:
The JB+ helps it a bit. But it's also a bit like putting lipstick on a
pig. So don't expect miracles.

We've had to reduce advance down low at the higher boost levels. Just
no other way to do it on this platform at the moment. I'd love to add
more advance down low in the low boost range but our tuning equipment
doesn't allow it currently. Maybe in the future. But the trans
shifting is the real problem and I don't know where to start on
solving that...

-------------------------------------------------------------------

.

 

Personally I think the lag, while there is not horrible. But than again I drove a Big Turbo setup before this car so I might be a little skewed on my driving instincts with that experience.

 

Have you considered the C350 cdi. It has massive torque, in fact more than the C63 (620nm on the c350 cdi against 600nm of the v8 C63). Purchased this for my wife and she absolutely love it. It has power and economy, the best of both worlds

Perry

 

If only we could get the diesels in North America

I'm a torque addict.

 

Yeah! ~ the diesels are like hanging on the end of a long, strong elastic band!

 

I think the E series had/has a monster diesel torque machine ... 0-60 in ~6 sec.

If you added the JB, you have an extra 43 ft-lbs torque increase from 2700 to 3100 rpms. JB just doesn't help initial low rpm boost-gain that much, and retarding the timing then is the likely reason why.

.

 

I drove this new 1.8T a few times in the new C250 Coupe as well as in the new SL250 roadster (with manual tranny)... full blast with my buddy (the salesman) holding on for dear life as I took it through all of its paces. As I said, this engine spools up to hit its torque peak real well and will continue to pull all the way up to redline. No doubt that with the simplest of tuning, (chip, fuel trim adjustments, etc) this engine can be made to run with the best small block turbos out there. (although mileage will slightly suffer) But would I buy it? It has an uncanny putt-putt feel during casual wheelin... not my cup of tea. Next year the C300 will have a detuned DI 3.5L producing 260+hp. Just imagine what could be done to that baby.... that's more like it. I wish I could have had that engine, but unfortunately the only 4-Matic for 2012 in the USA is the old 3.0L...

 

Okay I put on the JBox and the Intake on my car today. So here is a little feedback. First of all there is still lag but I would say its better than before and the throttle response is crisper. Where you can really feel the power and torque increase is between 20-80 mph. Its not fast but really quick and smooth as silk, you can tell this 1.8T is one of the more refined 4 cylinders out there. Im content as of right now short of a tune that becomes available with min alterations of the engine bay Im staying with the JBox. For $279 dollars this is well worth the price, it does not fix the issues that people are griping about, but it does address them to a satisfactory degree and the Torque increase is really really noticable.

I was wondering if anybody else notice that the C250 has significant more wheel chirp off the line than the new BMW. Me and my Buddy where testing the cars out toay and my car had considerable more wheel chirp than the BMW. I dont know if this is the cause of the 7 second 0-60 time. There is no reason that with the specs this car has that is shouldnt be mid 6.5 speed. Once you get it going its a quick guy and had no problem keeping up with the BMW.