Acapulco Bill

Two CNet reviews of the new C-Class chassis'd GLK and the very new flagship S-Class, both complain of excruciatingly slow-loading MB apps that make them useless, plus a last-decade NAV map system.

And why a back-up camera on the MB if Ford's cheapest vehicle, the Fiesta, has been successfully parking itself for YEARS? (e.g. no steering input needed, the Fiesta does the driving).

Read about the MB tech debacle (hype vs. reality) in these links. Its shameful, really.

GLK:
http://ct.cbsi.com/pt?t=1202656047-e...d=CNET-SSA&s=5

S-Class:
http://reviews.cnet.com/sedan/2014-m...tag=CADc8fa1f1

djejglk

I've read PLENTY of posts and articles about myfordtouch being horrible.

edit..
There are pro's and con's for every vehicle on the planet. That's how the universe works. I feel pretty good about my car actually.


I think we should use this forum to help each other, not make each other feel bad about their purchase.

Drazil

I agree the tech is a little lacking, especially when you see relatively cheaper cars like Fords, Hyundai's, KIA's sporting a lot of this stuff as standard equipment, but I guess they gotta fleece you somehow. MB wanna make the base price attractive enough to lure people, but then you end up with having to pay for every little thing. I don't mind them charging extra for things like COMAND, but there are certain basic things that one would expect to be standard from a "luxury" automobile.

Things like:
Keyless Go
Power Seats
Memory Seats
(previously) Split-fold rear seats

I think though, that when MB finally get off their *** and add the tech, they usually do a great job at it, for example the fuel monitor shows me down to the km how far I can go and recalculates on the fly while I am driving. Compare that to the monitor on a Hyundai where it just says "low" and you have no idea how far you can still go.

The parking thing I feel is a gimmick. I thought I saw MB had an "Active Parking Assist" option which does the same thing. I tried it on my friend's fusion and I actually didn't like the steering wheel going automatically, cuz my hands were still hovering over the wheel. You still have to shift the car into gear (from D > R > D, etc) and operate the pedals. The MB "Passive Parking Assist" just shows you instructions in the instrument cluster and I prefer that. If I ignore the instructions, it will alter them as I manouver. The biggest problem with these parking assist, is that the spot has to be pretty big before it kicks in. I have never had the system detect a spot for me yet (where I was able to successfully parallel park manually). I actually had to drive around the neighbourhood looking for a huge spot before the system detected a spot for me to test.

djejglk

Agreed 100%. Pro's and con's. Some forum members seem to have an agenda though.

Knightmare69

What agenda would that be? My family has been driving Mercedes since the tank era S-class's and continually the prices sore while the tech and quality dip through the years. I compare MB to RIM (Blackberry), at the top of their game at one point and thinking they were untouchable not noticing the other brands slowly catching up and overtaking them.

glennp_1999

Have you guys tried using the Mbrace on your car? OMG it's the slowest thing ever to use it's useless I don't even know why they installed this thing. I will never subscribe to this after my 3 month free usage is up. Terrible addition to the car MB should be shot in the a$$ for even introducing this crap.

snowmuch

The reason why cheap Kias and ****ty Hyundais (or any other economy car) have them is because if they want to attract more buyers then they need the "wow" factor so they can justified the buyers.

Example:
Person 1: "Hey, why did you buy a ****ty kia (insert any other auto manufacture here)?"
Person 2: "Oh my car has back up camera"
Person 1: "wow okay"

In term of electronic technology MB is tiny bit behind. However mechanically they will never catch up to MB or any other German auto maker. I pop my hood open to show my friends what my engine looks like, they all wowed because how advanced MB engine layout is. (they owned various other brand such as e92 is350 350z r33 etc)

Knightmare69

That's not always a good thing, sometimes simplicity is best. Nowandays with all the integrated electronics in cars, it makes things a hassle.

snowmuch

My statement was basically saying you do get your money worth but not that "tangible" when compared to things like push start and back up camera. I still cant get over the fact that to perform a oil change on a civic requires take off a front wheel...

glennp_1999

What year civic is this? I change the oil on my Civic and Accord I never have to remove the front wheel. Alligator jack is just fine no need to remove the front wheel.

dolvio

Some of you may remember my post back in April about the car accident I was in driving my 2008 C230. Absolutely hammered a young driver who cut me off. Was unable to walk for a week after... Then walked again. My point? Safety. I then bought a newer, better C250. My car is a tank and that's why I bought it. When I drive my mother around in it I feel safe and secure. Yes, the technology in some cheaper cars blows away mine and that does tick me a little. But If I bought engineering, safety and technology I am paying $100K plus for an MB or BMW. Can't have it all...

Cheers,

AH

Knightmare69

+1, never heard of nor actually experienced needing to remove the wheel for this procedure and I've worked on many a Honda's.

Dolvio- Toyota's and Honda's which cost much less have just as high (if not higher depending on model) crash test ratings compared with Mercedes.

C300Sport

If you ever get really bored and start chasing crash test clips on You Tube, you can start to get an idea of why German cars (in general) are considered to be safer.
All cars are now engineered to "score" well in a given situation such as offset, 25% offset(the tough new one), rollover(with the hydraulic rams), etc.. What I have noticed is that the MB passenger compartment remains intact better than most others. If you initial collision sends you into another lane, off an embankment, into a wall, etc. the MB is going to protect you a lot better than the lighter, less sturdy cars that protected you on the first hit but have nothing left to give you for the next.
To get back to the OP, I feel that MB is way ahead with some aspects (look at the new S) and just keeping up with other electronic trends so it is up to each consumer to purchase what they feel is right for them.

Acapulco Bill

Despite all the complaints about the horribly-low tech in my W204 and the obvious fail of the lazy lethargic 7G Tronic transmission, a compelling reason for me to buy a C-Class was the actual "Deaths-per-million-vehicles" statistic that the DOT and insurance groups publish, the C-Class historically with about 21 deaths per million vehicles (BMW was 48).

But this thread is all about the TECH. Where is Mercedes' response to iDrive, Audi or even Hyundai in base-model tech? How awful is it to load phone contacts into you headunit? Why do the speakers in the non-HK stereos have a $1 OEM cost for ALL EIGHT SPEAKERS? Why cant I see the name of a song when playing an original CD?

The point is that just the "tech" options on the S-Class, when added all together, cost MORE than an entire car from another manufacturer whose tech and apps actually WORK!!!! You can get $17,000 in tech options in the S-Class, and it is guaranteed that a $17,000 Hyundai or Ford will have more functional tech than the $130,000 Merc.

Glyn M Ruck

The new S Class Benz is a wonderful vehicle. I particularly look forward to the diesel hybrid.

It will sell well for all the right reasons & there will of course be improvements over time. It is a class leading vehicle that had to fill the gap left by the Maybach in it's stretched configurations & does that admirably. Benz focus is not aimed at geeks.

Benz is on a roll. The A Class order book is full until mid 2014 in SA & the S Class order book is a mile long. Benz values are appreciated by many.

They have a large range of new engines in development & the new 9 speed transmission.

Acapulco Bill

As for Ford specifically, one daughter leased a new 2013 Fusion S (absolute base model trim), having gotten tired of filling my exotic 300 kph V12 all the time, her husband has a 2009 E90 he uses as a daily driver. Got it because of how nice my original European Mondeo is (on which the new 2013 Fusion is based, not the former awful American-engineered model).

Just spend a couple of thousand miles in the Fusion, and for $20k I would buy one - the W204 frankly is NOT "twice the car at twice the price". It is great to have E-Class room plus the trunk/seat arrangement which can actually transport full-size pre-hung doors no sweat, which we did, besides doing a run from San Diego to Vegas and back with five in the car, 7 suitcases, while getting 35 MPG hammering the accelerator.

As for TECH, it was refreshing to see that in the Fusion CD's displayed album and title (the Merc does NOT), the radio had trial Pandora, plus digital FM showed the title of what was playing (the Merc does NOT), there is a gasoline trip calculator, has Sync for simple Bluetooth cellphone pairing (the Merc does NOT, have to load contact by contact, I have 100+), the seats are more comfortable than my W204 Sport seats, and still didnt have time to explore all that MyTouch and Sync had to offer as standard on a large $20k car.

AND the Fusion has some "tech" like the door locks are LED's so you know as a rear-seat passenger at night if the door is actually locked - it's really kewl and useful (and what does the button do for you anyway?, its just another mechanical piece that is doomed to fail someday).

Just jumping in and driving the Fusion/Mondeo vs. the Merc, steering column stalks are in their "logical" place, turn signals on the left, wipers on the right. Not the still-after-four-years-cant-get-used-to-it cruise control on the W204, the Fusion has it logically on the steering wheel. Also paddle shifters (the Merc does NOT) Fusion comes with a center console shifter, which will probably be a thing of the past with the W205, MB has already eliminated it in the A, B, CLA, E (except AMG). A REAL parking brake. Does that qualify as "tech"?

The point is MB offers at $130,000 a supposedly high-tech S-Class that "smells nice" but none of it's essential MB apps work worth a crap, and a map system that was outdated when it was introduced. Poor connectivity, especially for back-seat passengers who for $130k deserve to be online so they can do business while being transported.

As for mBrace, many say it sucks, as well as MB dealer service in general. Is that "tech"? Cadillac broadcasts failing parts orders to your dealer to have them in stock when you go for service. Doubt the S Class does that. Does the S Class have lifetime service for free including drop off and pick up at your door with a free loaner? Hyundai does, because its "tech" lets the dealer know how many miles you've driven.

I cant really call this S Class perfume thing "tech", not for all the $$$$ when a $1 car air freshener can just be chucked under the seat. As for venerable Glyn M. Ruck's mention of yet a 9-speed in the works, the 7G Tronic is a total fail in comparison to even VW. Maybe the S-Class "leads the class" but NOT in tech. A 9-speed will not solve the disappointing performance of MB's inferior transmission design engineering. Should just pony-up to ZF and get a decent shifter.

When the C-Class and other MB models offer useful, real-world "tech" as standard equipment, maybe then MB can be proud about it. Until then it is all just hype and BS, and the W204 is nearly a decade behind most brands. Period.

dolvio

Hey bud,

Here in Canada Toyota's and Honda's are anything but cheap. Actually a fully loaded Toyota Camry is very $$ and the same for the Accord... Probably out-cost my C250... Toyota and Honda are not cheap brands in North America by any means. Hyundai and Kia or those cheaper brands. Lots of car test well under crash conditions. IMHO, my benz is safer than any Kia or Hyundai out there.

Glyn M Ruck

If you knew all this why did you buy a W204. Buy a new Mondeo. It's certainly a nice car. The European packaging is better than the Fusion. It appears from many postings in many threads that Benz does not do it for you any longer so get out of the brand & buy something else you like.

Even CNet likes the new S & our friends on Top Gear generally believe they are twice the car at twice the price ~ albeit generally the AMG models because they are power mad.

Benz will continue to build cars for their target audience which today leans toward Asia where the Brand has God like status.

US bound Benz vehicles will probably continue to be trimmed of features due to sticker price considerations in that market which is actually small for Benz. Little SA consumes two thirds the number of Benz vehicles per annum that the US does. Here all vehicles are expensive so Benz is seen as good value fully loaded.

MBUSA makes the decision on spec'ing vehicles for that market. Many of the functions that you desire are available with the stock telematics. They merely require to be switched on. Litres/Gals. to empty being an example. Harmon Becker based units are capable of reading the TOC & displaying CD/track titles etc. etc.

C300Sport

+1

Acapulco Bill

Agreed, Glyn, that the new S certainly raises the bar in it's segment. However, why is MB still looping in its outdated NAV and inconvenient/bothersome COMAND systems? Maybe I am just objecting to MB's constant claims of being at the "pinnacle of tech". Not to mention that world-wide MB websites still proudly proclaim the 7G-Tronic as being "the world's first 7-speed transmission" (as though customers who actually read this on a website were ignorant or just plain laughing) when MB should be totally embarrassed to have burdened it's owners with such a horrible slow-shifting and maintenance-intensive piece of bad engineering.

As for MBUSA, most US MBWorld forum readers are not aware of how truly despised they are by MB. Why are so few models offered? Why are the options so bleak and expensive (compared to worldwide offerings)? Why is the US dead last to get exciting new models, as the CLAs have been on Mexico's highways for nearly 6 months now?

As for my purchase of the W204, this was done after having driven a C350 Luxury in San Diego, a very different driving environment than Mexico. The 7G-Tronic, because it was a fresh C350 with 7 miles on it, had not yet contaminated its Adaptive Learning memory and shifting was zippy. It had the P1 & P2 packages plus the HK. However although the Mexico salesperson specified that the Mexico C300 Sport I ordered would come with the HK system (No NAV in Mexico at the time not even in the S Class), turns out that no Mexico C-Class was available with the HK option among other things, except the C63 AMG.

Back to "tech" and the 7G - is anyone truly happy with its lethargic performance? 0 to 60 actually takes longer in "S" mode than in "C/E" mode. "Sport" mode in the BMW and Audi can transform everything, not just silly shift points. For those with "M" and/or paddle shifters, its a joke, and CNet says as much in the GLK review. MB makes the "nicest" vehicles, but honestly with the worst transmissions, steering, and "tech" of most major manufacturers. Even Tata gets the Jaguar right. Look at Land/Range Rover vs. any Merc SUV. Just look at Tesla S interior tech.

And yes, I DID buy the Mondeo after the C300 Sport, like 15 days later, so disappointed was the Mercedes "experience". I only keep the W204 around for long, albeit uncomfortable, road trips although there is never enough trunk space. The W204 is a "nice" vehicle, but it is not "twice the car at twice the price", and MB's "tech" hype is just a bunch of misleading exaggerations.

World-wide one can assume that most W204's are sold as C180's/C200's with 4-button steering wheels, and little "tech". Proof are SA's sales numbers, imagine in China. Just a deception that MB hypes it "tech" and delivers "meh". MB's true attitude, like their "tech", stinks.

alsyli

In ~1990 or so, the 560SEL (in America) was ~$80,000. It produced maybe 230 hp (which was pretty respectable back then). It was more than double the cost of the Lexus LS (I presume Toyota was selling it for a large discount to steal market share b/f inflating the price to what the market would tolerate).

In 2014, a base S550 will cost, what, $110,000? And how much more will it have for the price? Heck, an E350 has more power, more equipment, and is probably just as safe for $60,000 nicely equipped.

The prices are not soaring.... At least, not in the US compared to the cost of, um, everything else here.

IMO, MB went through a very bad period (quality wise) in the late 1990s/early 2000s. And, again IMO, their quality has improved tremendously. We've been very happy w/ our C-classes (at least in terms of reliability).

Glyn M Ruck

Benz is a conservative organisation not driven by geek tech & never will be. For that all you need to buy is an Indian Ford built Eco Sport.

Your constant badgering of the 722.9 transmission tells me that there is either something wrong with your transmission or you have a peculiar driving style. Ordering a car with Sport suspension for Mexico equally makes no sense & yes I've spent time at our operations there so I understand the conditions. See my profile.

You imply that the 722.9 constantly calls attention to itself. Once you have adapted as a driver from the 722.6 experience this is simply not so. I've just done some shopping in my CLK. This included driving over a short pass from my house, steep hills both up & down, some tight cornering, a stretch of open freeway where I gave the car it's head, some traffic near the shopping centre & return.

On no occasion during this trip did the transmission draw attention to itself or frustrate me. I don't even notice what it is doing anymore because it does what I want it to.

I have said before. Drive deliberately, no yo-yo'ing of the throttle. If you want some performance just shove the throttle & it will immediately change down multiple gears & take off. Don't try to predict it. You will foul up. The torque converter is semi locked all the time other than when stationary so you can't drive it like an old American slush box.

dolvio

More inspiring words have never been spoken. +10

Acapulco Bill

Even with aggressive driving, the 7G is fast to learn parking lots, stop signs, and slow-moving traffic. It's alyways in LOL (Little Old Lady) mode. Why can't one just defeat the ludricous Adaptive Learning with a simple option? The 7G is quite capable of stellar performance, and I was jumping up and down, for a couple of hours anyway, when the 7G got a TCU update flash which overwrote the 8 Adaptive Memory modules. Wow, almost as responsive as the ZF in my V12.

But just going from the hair-pin-turned high-speed highway (with a 180 kph minimum speed for a couple of hours, one gets to hit the limiter often), from the last toll booth to the house, in 20 minutes the 7G "learned" it was a refrigerator, or maybe a washing-machine, again. WHY does MB insist in this supposed Adaptive Learning "tech" if it is to the detriment of the driver, the vehicle, and is a SAFETY ISSUE as downshifts take up to 3 seconds when flooring it in an emergency. The 7G is just lamely engineered that way. And MB is just SO PROUD of this stupid Adaptive Learning and way outdated 7-speed "tech". What possible benefit is it for the driver except for a single MPG?

Glyn M Ruck

You have a problem. One WOT cancels the adaptive learning.