laerm

Hi all –

A friend has a 2012 C300 Sport she would like to sell to me. 53000 miles, got a few of the AMG things like wheels and skirts, two extremely minor dents, pretty well taken care of as far as I and the dealer can tell.

1. Are there any trouble spots I should be aware of?
2. 6 year maintenance is due and I was quoted $1300. Is that one of the higher yearly maintenances? I don't want to spend $1000+/year on scheduled maintenance.
3. Nav data and COMAND have never been updated. I know I can update nav data for a couple hundred bucks, but is it possible to update the COMAND firmware? Bluetooth is currently glitchy and unreliable.

Thanks a bunch, everyone.
Micah

tapankd

How well was the car maintained ? Does your friend have records.. Was regular maintenance performed ? Also is it a M272 or M276 six cylinder engine..

What is includes in that 1300$ maintenance

laerm

All of the scheduled maintenance was done at the dealer. The service records are complete and good. It was well-taken care of.

Based on the VIN decoder info, it looks like the 272 engine.

IIRC, the $1300 maintenance includes all fluids, spark plugs, brakes, and...something else. Filters, I think.

Micah

M~Factor

If you opt for 2013 C300, you will get the 3.5 engine instead of 3.0. More HP and torque.

tapankd

When you say Brakes.. does it mean replacement of the front and rear brake pads and rotors..

Well I would suggest you should have an independent Mercedes Mechanic check out your car unless you are planning on getting everything done at the dealer. I am pretty sure you can save around 400-500$ getting those things done at independent mechanic buying your own parts and just paying for labor or DIY .. like changing the air filters and cabin filters is pretty straight forward.

Does it come with extended warranty ?

How are the tires?

Since you are buying from a private party ( your friend ) please check out the electrical systems..

I wouldn't worry about NAV updates.. you can simply buy a GPS with lifetime updates for around 100... rather than updating maps every year for 250..

Others in this forum will chip in..

There are some issues with M272 .. I am not sure what but at the beginning of the forum people have discussed in detail..

tapankd

Ya 2013-2014 C300 Sport have the M276 6 cylinder 3.5 litter engine..

laerm

That doesn't matter to me. Besides, buying from a friend, I'm getting a great deal.

Micah

laerm

Brakes I think just includes pads. The rotors have no noticeable issues in driving. Tires seem fine.

I'll look into an independent mechanic. I live in NYC, though, so things are just pricey here.

Extended warranties are non-transferable.

I prefer the nav built-in to the car than my phone or a standalone GPS. I like the nav info in the instrument cluster, and I don't like mounting a phone or GPS unit on the dash or windshield.

Yeah, I googled on the M272: this issue doesn't affect the engine in this car.

Micah

tapankd

Like I said just do your research thoroughly.. get all the major electrical components as well as engine, transmission, powertrain and suspension checked from like couple of independent mechanics.. I would rather have like 2-3 opinions of decent mechanics along with the dealer and if everything works out.. take the plunge.

is the ride 4matic or rwd... being in NY you might need a 4Matic for winters... I am from Boston so 4wd is a must for me

Welcome to the forum.

laerm

Thank you. Yep, it's the 4MATIC. I'd take it to a decent mechanic if I knew any... It seems like a pretty good generation of the car, though. TrueDelta has it really well-rated.

Micah

Adi-Benz

drive it at 70+ mph with everything off

if you hear a whining sound its the transmission, dont buy it

B737

map updates for the on board navi are about 20 bucks, or free if you know how to make an ISO. but the onboard navigation sucks anyways.

the most important thing is a thorough test drive like Adi said. drive it and listen carefully to transmission for any whining, or groaning at speed, common issue with these transmissions. also take some hard turns and listen for noises. It should have had a transmission service by now so make sure that was done, if not that will be around $1000 (dealer) unless you DIY. It is due 40,000 miles or 4 years. see if you can connect your phone to make calls listen to music (whole nother thing to deal with on 2012)

you can ask MB SA to run the vin, some of them will tell you the entire vehicle service history, my local dealer did. then just cover your basics like any other used car. focus on drive train noises is a big one though.

superangrypenguin

Bad suggestion. You're now looking at direct injection - and this is NOT a cheap engine to care for long term. Carbon buildup on the intake valves, HPFP woes, etc.

If you're looking for an engine to own long term that's cheap, stick to the 3.0L 272 engine that doesn't have DI.

Anyone recommending owning a long term DI engine simply hasn't owned one (I have). NEVER AGAIN am I buying a car with DI/cancer!!

tapankd

Lol man have been following your posts on different threads you are really against DI..

tapankd

Map Updates for $20.. Where can I find those..

B737

ebay, mapman60 sold me my discs, they worked well. updated navi from 2012 to 2017

superangrypenguin

When you're at the dealership every week for...

Rough idle
Engine misfires
New coilpacks
New PCV valves
New cam follower (flat tappet design was asinine)
New HPFP
Carbon buildup on the intake valves!!!

(the items above), I got very turned off by it. There are some designs which I will buy (Lexus D4S), and in a few years if it's tested well by time, the Audi 3.0 TSI Dual Injection, but these traditional designs like MB has....hell no. MB's current answer to my intake buildup answer is something along the lines of "we don't have this problem b/c we're Mercedes". I call horseshi* especially when posters have posted pictures indicating problems just like that I've had on previous cars. is the issue as bad? No. But does it mean there is no problem as per MB, NO.

So - hats off to those of you who lease cars every 4 years, but the OP wants to own a used car for a long time. Direct Injection is NOT the way to go.

Just my $0.01. In 2012 when I test drove my C300, I asked when DI was coming. That same moment, that same day, I bought my 2012 C300 4matic b/c I was told in 2013 DI was coming.

I put my money where my mouth is on this one!!

tapankd

Hey out of curiosity which DI engine car did you have before..

Rodpwnz

I'm not penguin, but my brother has a N54 engine in his 335i. It's a twin turbo, inline 6 with DI. At around 55K miles he had considerable carbon build up but a $450 walnut blasting cleaned it up very nicely. I did it as a surprise birthday gift for him and afterwards asked him to give me a ride in the car. He no longer had a rough idle. He felt it was noticeably smoother with throttle and he was making more power(He had JB4). It felt like a new car and I didn't tell him I did anything until he pretty much knew something was up.

So if that's any indication of how bad the carbon build up can affect performance and feel...I don't know what measures can be taken to clean up the carbon on the M276.

superangrypenguin

Audi 2.0TFSI engine on a B7 A4. This was the first engine that Audi mass produced for consumption in N. America that had DI.

It's a 4 cylinder turbocharged engine that produced 100HP/L making a total of 200HP/L. When the engine worked, it was fantastic. When it didn't (90% of the time), it sucked. It would shear through engine oil within 3000km, and it was a nightmare to maintain.

Now, some of you may be saying - but wait, that's not made by MB! And you're right; however, an automaker learns their mistakes and improves on them as they get more and more experience with them. Since 2007, Audi has learned that they needed to change the HPFP design from a cam follower to a cam roller (the 2.0 TSI engine in 2011 introduced this), and they redesigned the PCV valve so that they...umm...worked? Since 2015? the 3.0 TSI engine now featured dual injection to try and fix the issues of carbon buildup. So it has taken Audi almost a decade and millions and millions of engines to finally fix some of their critical flaws. (by the way, during this time, they also learned that we in N. America have issues they didn't think of due to the high sulfur content in our gasoline - this means Audi's engines can't run on lean mode which would cut down on intake valve buildup due to excessive gasoline not being burnt during combustion the first time around).

These issues above are also now found on Ford EcoBoost engines, Hyundai GDI, VW engines, Porsche engines, BMW engines, and all gasoline DI engines except those found on the LEXUS D4S system and others where a dual injection setup is used.

AFAIK, MB's first mass series production DI engine in N. America started with the 2012 C350/C250 (6 cyl/4 cyl) and then introduced in 2013 on the C300. Sure - there haven't been widespread concerns about intake valve buildup, but then again, VW/Audi owners didn't really notice until year 3/4 and we're right around that mark now (being 2017 now).

The absence of proof is not proof itself - and in this case, there have been photos of intake valves of the C350 which are covered in carbon. Now - I am impressed that the symptoms haven't been more rampant and more prevalent, but that doesn't mean anything for people who want to own their cars past the 4 year mark. So while it took 20,000km or so for my old Audi engine to basically die of cancer, maybe with MB it takes 50,000km - great, but you know what doesn't change?

$$$ expensive repairs.

M276 engines and ALL gasoline DI engines can be cleaned using walnut blasting. I've looked at things like the BG Intake service but it doesn't really work. It's a great idea - a mist gets pumped directly into the engine (thus washing over the intake valve), however, that process always resulted in CEL (misfires) and it also requires an oil change afterwards. Plus, I can't imagine the cat's lasting a long time with chunks of carbon being blown into them.

---------------

So while you may have the patience and the money to deal with the consequences of DI engines (and get to enjoy the benefits such as better MPG and HP when the engines are new), I don't like driving around knowing my engine is slowly developing cancer and dying. There were Audi RS4's that lost 20% of HP within 15-30,000km. I don't know about you, but that's depressing.

Basically, from the time you drive off in your spanking new car with a DI engine, your HP will drop, your MPG will drop, and it continues dropping until you do an intake valve cleaning.

No thank you for me. - would you like living life knowing you have cancer and it's slowly killing you? Sure - it's not as dramatic owning an engine that is slowly dying, but it does make me sad where I have to drive WOT every so often to keep the engine cleaner - and at which point, what's the point of saving money fuel wise if you have to WOT every week or so - and there's no conclusive evidence that it even does that!

So yeah, I'll continue driving my port injected engine knowing that it's in a much better shape after 50,000km than any DI engine that doesn't have PFI/Dual injection.

I hope this helps some of you in some way. I don't believe in changing opinions of others on the internet, because you do what you want with your money and i'll do what I want with mine - however, I do hope that this gives some of you additional perspective before you potentially make a decision to buy a DI engine which usually involves an automaker touting all the positives, but not any of the negatives.

tapankd

Hey.. I had a 2010 Audi A4 2.0 liter which I believe was direct injection too. Well in my case I never buy new cars nor do I lease cars. I buy CPO cards just out of lease but under 20k miles well maintained and when they reach 65-70k miles i change them. I never had any problems with my Audi till 64k miles when i soles it. It was running smooth with great mpg and no rough idle. Just fine with regular maintenance. But that is just my experience.

Currently on 2014 C300 sport with M276 which i purchased in Feb 17 with 19k miles on it. I guess time will tell how everything works. But i would rather buy a 3 yo car with less miles on it and well maintained rather than 7 yo car with more miles on it and a different non-di engine.

Thats just my opinion.. and we are all entitled to ours. Cheers all.

superangrypenguin

agreed! Yup yours would have been direct injection too but it may have been the TSI engine which had a lot of improvements! But yup. Entitled to our own opinions!

bankerkys

Well, I have a 2010 C350 Sport that I bought in 2012 with 15k miles on it from Ft. Lauderdale Mercedes Benz. Here is what I have spent money on so far: two batteries, a power steering pump, a thermostat, and now looks like a transmission conductor plate. I also had other items replaced under warranty, including a battery and few suspension components. By far, it's had the most problems of the 12+ vehicles I've owned (Jaguar, BMW, Mercedes, Toyota, Mazda, Volvo, and VW). Good luck with your decision!

lotus49

I've seen prices of well over £100 quoted here in the UK and I've seen recent update DVDs for sale for > £150. $20 seems absurdly cheap, is that really how much it would cost?

You are right though, the onboard satnav is terrible. The route finding is poor, directions are often unclear and too late and if you decide to go a different way to that suggested, you have to drive about 40 miles before it recalculates the route and stops just telling you to turn round.

I used to have a TomTom, then I used Sygic on my phone. Now, Google Maps is easily the best satnav I've used and it's fully voice operated.

superangrypenguin

Wow weird. Here in Canada the maps work great for me. Much better than Waze and even my old Garmin unit!