C400Driver

Yes I dunno if he was bsing with the arrival date...originally it was early oct

MBNUT1

One other comment I wanted to mention is that after I drove the w204 which was after the W205 I drove a 2012 E3504 matic. With all the commentary about how luxurious the W205 is the W212 still felt like a richer place to be.

teja1936

Sorry to say, but I doubt that it’s a German thing. Rather I believe it to be a US marketing ploy to market the vehicle to a price for the US buyers. With respect to vehicles here in Oz, premium or not, they all have amber indicators front and back. Amber indicators have been on Benzes since the Dead Sea was only sick.

alsyli

B/c of the interior ambiance, the way the car drove, or both?

MB-JIM

I drove a C300 this morning in Scottsdale, AZ. My greatest concern was resolved and that was concerning the 4 cylinder turbo engine. In driving around town, on surface streets, I felt the engine response was fine with no objectionable turbo lag. For me, I would see no need to go for the 400.
The steering was firm and responsive. The 8.4" Command screen was excellent and it didn't block the windshield. The car was very quiet but that was at surface street speeds. The Burmeister sound had more bass than my HK systems. Overall visibility seemed a lot better than in my GLK.
I still need to drive one, on a freeway, to see how the engine responds at highway speeds.
If I order one it will be a C300 Luxury model with two wheel drive.

MBNUT1

My comment was the interior ambiance (to be fair the car was black on black with tinted windows so that conveyed a certain elegance that the silver on black W205 didn't possess) but for sure the way it drove was more Mercede's like. It felt special.

Glyn M Ruck

I believe that Benz traditionalists like MBNUT & myself are going to have a hard time liking the lighter cars that Benz is forced to make for the sake of fuel efficiency. Weight adds to the feel we like in the cars. The W205 is on average over 100Kg's lighter than a W204 (Benz claim) due to the greater use of lightweight, high strength materials. It is impressive that they have achieved the level of comfort they have in the W205 considering it is lighter. Well tuned, well damped steel suspension or air suspension are to thank on other than Sport models which I find jarringly firm especially with large diameter wheels & very low profile tyres.

The younger demographic that like a Sporty feel will live with the discomfort & love the lighter weight because it makes the vehicle more chuckable.

C400Driver

you forget a lighter more powerful vehicle=more speed... The c400 can get to 60 in 4.6 secs in sport+ mode...which is very impressive considering its in a stock tuned state.... This is a smaller sportier car there is no reason for this case to be 4000+ lbs...I welcome lightening... But I'm also a motorsports enthusiast

Germancar1

The weight isn't what gives a Mercedes its feel, it is the suspension, steering, seats, most importantly the air tight build quality. This thing about sheer weight giving feel is just an outdated perception. Weight is just weight and excess weight is just that. You can get the same tank like feeling from a lighter Mercedes. It is the build and the tuning of the various components that give the feel.

M

Glyn M Ruck

The perception might be outdated but it is there with traditionalists & it is certainly responsible for some of the feel that those traditionalists like.

Just open a new lightweight door on a W205. It is a completely competent door but it will never feel or thunk like a heavy door. Jaguar had exactly the same issues when they took the XJ's from steel to aluminum contruction. They felt less substantial. The fact that the entire structure was more stiff was overlooked by the buying public.

Marketing departments struggle with these issues of perception daily.

Glyn M Ruck

+1^ ~ no I did not forget. I too love motorsport. I just want my daily driver to be a bit of a tank & my weekend fun run car to be something accessible like a Honda S2000 or a Boxster S or similar.

At the same time I can appreciate my old tank like Jaguar S Type manual overdrive for what it was in 1965. 0 to 100 Kph in 10 seconds, Door armrest digging you in the butt on hard cornering & the pleasant smell of Connolly hide, Wilton carpets, lambswool Union Cloth headlining & acres of Burr Walnut.

The marque I love the most is Aston Martin. That should tell you something about where my tastes are if money were not a consideration. Old DB6 or new stock DB9 would do just fine.

Germancar1

You're still missing the point, it isn't just the heft of the door, it is the construction of the door. No car maker is making heavy doors anymore and really how much of a bank vault do you expect on car like the C-Class? Those traditionalist are just going to have to get used to it. When you increase equipment like on the new C you increase weight, but that weight has to be taken out somewhere otherwise you wind up with an overweight car that drives like an old school Benz way too stodgy for today's customer/market.

M

alsyli

I agree w/ both you and Glyn, BUT....

The old 190e had the same bank value door slam that has characterized all MBs....

AND....

The old 190e was still considerably lighter than the W205.


For me, a classic MB feeling is about bank-vault solidity, unruffled high-speed behavior, a fantastic ride/handling balance w/ some roll softness, and an astere but high-quality interior. You'll note that speed is not one of the things that make an MB, IMHO. I leave the lurching aggression to BMW.


And also, IMHO, they haven't made a classic MB since the W202....

MBNUT1

Complete concurrence and as an engineer it isn't that I don't appreciate reduced weight and amount of engineering required to produce a lighter weight solution. In my business one lb in a 5000 lb product is worth a lot.

All I know is that I drove a 2011 E350 4matic luxury and it felt just how I expected a Benz to feel.

From the steering weight and liquid smoothness to the unerring straight line stability to the roll softness to the vault like solidity to the nearly silent and smooth engine and seamless transmission and when pressed it was able to make good report of itself on the off ramp.

The trades with the W205 for me are styling (really think the luxury W205 is beautiful, fortunately I don't have to look at the mess of the front end of a W212 when I'm driving it), fuel efficiency and larger size than I need or really want but that is becoming the price I am willing to pay for the enjoyment of the driving experience.

MBNUT1

Had a 190 E and agree on all comments



I remember driving a W202 and thinking the the potholes were getting the worse end of the deal when I drove over them you had this sense of them being crushed by the car.

esse22

Had anyone heard when the C400 will be available for a test drive?
Thanks!

InTheBenz0

DO we know what the C400 4matic weighs?

The xdrive automatic F30 335 weighs 3731 per motortrend (http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...ve_first_test/)

I can't find the C400 weight....

Germancar1

The C400 4Matic is lighter according to MBUSA:

3,583 lbs (4MATIC)

http://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/vehicl...nt=model-specs


M

Glyn M Ruck

I'm not missing the point at all. You choose to misconstrue.

Damn right we are going to have to get used to it. One day I will be driving a composite electric or whatever.

For now I choose something with greater substance.

I like the W205, as stated on another thread, I could be happy with a fully loaded, steel suspended C400 Exclusive with traditional grill & hoodstar.

Glyn M Ruck

+1 Fred. You and I are always on the same wavelength. A long PM on every Benz model in the last 15 years & more would seem proof of that.

Also owned a 190E 2.3 16, a W202 & a W203 ~ both 6's

Still love the drive in the new S Class which I have driven as S500 & S400 Hybrid at our launch day last year.

For now I'll stick to my 20,000 mile CLK.

InTheBenz0

Wow, I am even more excited to drive it. 150 lbs lighter than its exact 3 series competitor. 150 lbs is a good amount of savings... that car at 35XX lbs is no joke... aluminum frame goes a long way in weight savings and the car grew in size... I imagine it feels significantly better than its old W/C 204 Brother.

squid23

Did it have a manual mode for the transmission?

MBNUT1

I'm jealous.

C400Driver

I've driven last gen S550 as well as current gen. S550..the C class is the closest thing you're getting to the S class until the new e class is released..period!

NYC-Style

Went for "another" test drive today and had the chance to play with some of the infotainment features. It definitely will take some getting used to. I bought along my Passport 500GB portable hard drive...I keep music and videos on it. The videos played while the car was in park mode...the music played but it did not display the album art (it did identify the artist). Switched driving modes and could tell the difference between sport and comfort. I originally ordered a C300 with sport package...but decided to go with the C400 in which the sport package is standard. So I went from a mid/late Sept. delivery to early November...oh well...it'll be an early Christmas gift to myself.