mguerrero

if it didn't have an AMG motor its NOT a "genuine AMG" .... are you under the assumption that all cars with a simple AMG badge are built by AMG?? I got news for you, if it doesn't have an AMG plate on the engine its NOT and AMG - a simple badge doesn't make it one

StanAE86

I don't think its a problem to have AMG looks with an AMG line (like an M Sport line with BMW). I guess it depends how far it goes. I like to see tell tale signs so I can tell the difference when I see one. It lets me know if I need to take an extra moment to appreciate the car. If this new AMG line has EVERYTHING AMG but the motor, that will be a disappointment. But I suspect you will still be able to tell by the quad tailpipes and 4-pot AMG calipers at the least. It'll make it harder to tell real ones from "AMG line" cars, but there is money to be made there and that's why they're doing it.

I don't know that it dilutes the brand name though...after all, it's the motor that counts. I can understand it...the AMG cars look better...they're more hunkered down, have better looking wheels, sit fatter. I get it. Some people just want the car they think looks better and wouldn't even know what to do with more than 300hp.

The first day I brought my E63 home I debadged it completely...and the only badge on it now sits on the left corner of the trunk...E320. So obviously, making sure everyone knows I have an E63 means very little to me. It's the incredible rumble that brings ME joy that matters. I don't see many fake AMG cars, but when I do, I giggle. Like the mass of fake //M cars out there. Maybe making the badges "AMG Line" like Audi's sport line would make it better? I dunno.

I smoke a Mitsubishi EVO tonight running it up to 120 in a blink on the freeway and I hope he's still wondering how he got dusted by an E320...

BeachDoc

How about AMG*.... Maybe this will be the Steroid Era for AMG. Everyone knows that the product changed, but the decision-makers decided on greed above the purity of the pursuit.

The engine and suspension are 95% of the reason someone should by an authentic AMG....though admittedly some of the exterior changes are nice too. My local dealer has a boatload of C300's with the AMG wheels et al. I had a dealer loaner C300 for almost 2 months (long story), and no amount of badging made the car more fun to drive. I haven't tried a C450 yet...though I suspect a similar experience.

desertwindauh

Summary:
AMGs are a special, highly tuned, limited run series with hand built, powerful engines, suspension, interiors, etc...
AMG kits on non AMG cars are not.
Diluting this can only affect Mercedes in general and AMG in particular.
The End

rchangek

To be honest all the engine parts are made with machines. I don't know what the fuss is about "handcrafting". Yes, only one individual does the final assembly with "extra care", alright. But I don't think that is where the value of AMG is. I think the extra engineering being put into those engines, innovative technologies like "hot V" and dry sump lubrication, advanced transmissions, axles, brakes and hours and hours of lab testing is worth much more than the "handcrafting" process. That badge on the AMG motor is nothing but a marketing gimmick. I bet all the AMG engines will be equally good even if those are put together on a regular MB engine assembly line. Even regular engines are assembled by hand. It's just that the engines move on assembly line and multiple people make the final assembly.

dreamerak

If only people would do a little research and reading before making dumb proclamations.

http://www.mbusa.com/vcm/MB/DigitalA...ATIC-FINAL.pdf

pawoodford

For me AMG once stood for something a bit special. With the exception of the Black Series of AMG's there has not been a true AMG since the SLK32 or C32 from the early 2000's. They were the last models to be hand modified by AMG and are "special" and hopefully will be future classics. These days its all badge engineering on the production line and I for one have lost some interest in AMG due to this.
The notion that the AMG "one man one engine" ethos is somehow special turns out to be little more than a marketing ploy. Anyone who has been to Afalterbach will know that the "man" is not a master engineer (V12 line excepted possibly) rather someone who carts the engine around a production line using pre calibrated tools to bolt ready built parts together.
Having said all that MB do build bloody good motors. The "4 banger" should not be underestimated, after all its half a V8 and provides exceptional power in its production detuned form.

beergut

A wolf in sheep's clothing..

Ron Martin

Having owned and even raced Mercedes (an old '55 W198)along with a SIATA 208S and a Lotus MK 11 LM - WAY back in the fifties in SCCA ...plus being a long time Mercedes "history nut" and making the annual pilgrimage to the Rolex 24 (now Tudor Series) , guess I am too biased to road racing - versus straight line power alone! Fortunately we still have Formula ONE and the DTM series in other areas ..but NOT in Mercedes largest geographic market ?

Regret to say it, but gobs of money and expensive street modifications to flash on the boulevards do not equal the road racing reputation that made Mercedes the preeminent respected car it is .. The men in the marketing department of Stuttgart need to read the rich heritage and history of their (our) company and urge a return in US ROAD competition. IMHO, Having the most expensive "AMG" to merely impress...is not the same as the REAL thing that chews up AUDIs and BMWs ..in THIS country......sigh.


Lets truly hope the AMG GT(S) is not the spoof of its costly predecessors. Would love to see it in the pits next year...

rwm

JKehler

All right, guys. Take a deep breath, pull up your panties, and get a life. I have written to Mercedes many times asking for the sportline-type model. There is a huge gap between the standard Mercedes line-up and the AMG line-up. This gapping whole is what the Sportline fills. So, for those of us who cannot afford an AMG whatever, we can get an uprated engine, along with the brakes, suspension tuning, and bodywork of the AMG models. So, for us regular guys, it raises the fun level of the standard Mercedes to interesting, if not downright exciting, driving. This is long overdue and will continue to build on the Mercedes brand and put fun within reach of all of us. You AMG owners should not be upset - you still have the finest mega-motors to propel you to work in the morning.

coladin

I guess people expected Merecedes, when trying to sell the car, to tell prospective clients that it is not a true AMG? Come on.


We all know it is not a true AMG, regardless of the sales brochure. I think it is going to be a great car, with a lot of AMG hardware, not just an appearance pack. I still can't see anyone who buys it saying it is an AMG. AMGs have 2 numbers, this is not it!

William Kayen

I think this is a way for Mercedes to sell more cars to people that might like some AMG hardware without going through the expense of a true AMG. I see nothing wrong with this. It doesn't cheapen the AMG name. In fact it gives people more ways of personalizing their cars.

jrcart

Says the guy with a BMW screename......

jrcart

....as well as the posers

jrcart

This is your first post? "I think this is a way for Mercedes to sell more cars to people that might like some AMG hardware without going through the expense of a true AMG"

....and you are ok with this???

bwoodbmw

Whats your point? Yes I drive a BMW as my daily driver. I started this thread because I genuinely am interested in the C450 and wanted to know when orders will be available and how much the car will cost above the 400. Not because i'm a poser, but because I don't need 500 hp (I have a 911 C4S to satisfy the performance bug) but the C400 felt too soft coming from a BMW, even for a daily driver. I seriously can't believe how many people on this thread suddenly have their AMG manhood threatened by what will likely be one of the more interesting cars in the MB portfolio. If anybody is a true fan of Mercedes they should be excited about something that will finally be competitive with the 335i (soon to be 340i) and S4 and cause people like me to care about a benz for the first time. Ya'll need something more interesting to worry about in life.

This thread has gotten so absurd, can I request that it be locked as the one who started it? It literally now has nothing to do with the reason I started it so we should just kill it.

jrcart

You can request to lock it but I don't see the point there are a few other threads in other sections of this forum discussing the same topics and those people are calling it a posermobile as well.

DanielSL

How did so many ****-holes come to own Mercedes lately? I mean, really; you AMG snobs claim to know the history, and then belittle other MB owners that want to have something that stands apart from the standard MB offerings.

Idiots! ****-Holes! Pay attention.

Originally, as a tuner, AMG would not let you get an AMG badge unless you had three separate items from the catalog on your car.
Not only were they a tuner, they were a boutique builder. Everything was custom, by the customers wishes, and a-la-carte.

My 87' 560 SEC AMG came from AMG Fort Lauderdale, NOT Affalterbach. It does not have an AMG tuned engine. Not a 4-cam. Not a 6.0 stroker. No engine tuning at all...

And you know what, you AMG Snob trifling Bi-Atch **** owners: My car is More of an AMG than yours will ever be.

Because mine was built when AMG was still AMG GmbH. Not a watered down, teeth pulled, nails clipped AMG Owned by Mercedes, because Mercedes saw a way of increasing profits, and not losing sales to the grey market.

My car came equipped with the following:

AMG Headers / down-pipes
AMG full exhaust
AMG full body-kit
AMG rear decklid rear wing
AMG shocks
AMG springs
AMG differential, with LSD and R/P
AMG wheels
AMG steering wheel

Oh yeah, and an AMG Fort Lauderdale applied AMG trunk badge.

As it had more than 3 items out of the catalog, by AMG Affalterbachs Own rules.

AMG Fort Lauderdale was as much of an AMG shop, as BHMA or AMG Westmont.

I also have a W220 S600 which came from the factory with an applied ///AMG badge, even though it only had an AMG body kit, sport suspension, and wheels.

My W209 CLK500 has a factory installed AMG bodykit, and AMG wheels (All CLK 500's in NA came that way), and no ///AMG badge.

My W220 S55 ///AMG has a badge, but is a True MB owned AMG. Same with my R230 SL55.

In the end, I regard the W126 the truest, real AMG car, because thats when AMG was owned by the founders still.

bwoodbmw

Wow... despite the continued off topic conversation this was actually an interesting and informative post. So by the original logic and wish of the founders of AMG the C450 does in fact qualify as a real AMG given that it has more than 3 AMG modifications to it. Case Closed. And by the way PLEASE post a pic of the '87 560... I'd love to see it.

MDMercedesGuy

Or the people who don't need a badge to validate themselves...

Asterix187

Blimey did you guys get this annoyed when the A250 Engineered by AMG came out? (which coincidentally my wife has).

I for one an getting a C450 as it suits my needs down to the ground. Sure I could get a C63S but do i really want to spend and extra 25k for something a bit quicker and a one man, one engine methodology (yeah i know there is a bit more to it) when in the majority it will spend 20k miles a year of its life on a motorway.

I would be very surprised to see any AMG badges on the back on the C450 as, like the A250, it will probably say 4Matic where the AMG badge would be.

It reality its nothing more than a C450 Engineered by AMG (AMG Sport?) which technically speaking is totally true.

As people have said this is no different to an S7 to an RS7 etc.

c63amg507

bmw has been doing that with their m line for a long time...and people have been doing that on their own for a very long time .....so bmw sucks amg sucks an the morons who do it on their own suck ....fake ***** ...lipsync.....some people are making millions as we speak faking everything....could we be the ones not getting it......

Dabo

Sadly, the elitists will keep swooping down here to empty their bladders whenever they see a thread that has anything to do with the C450. Clearly they're threatened by the car in a way that they can't control and if they can't control something, it shouldn't exist. The funny part is that there's NOTHING they can do about it. The decision is made, Mercedes is building the C450, and soon there will be BILLIONS of people all through the universe flashing AMG logos and claiming they drive real AMGs. I bet ebay will even sell LED lights designed to illuminate the logos at night, so they can be seen for miles! The elitists will have to deal with it or their heads will all explode. Either way this forum will become civilized sooner or later.

I still believe that many (probably most) AMG owners are better bred than these buffoons, so they aren't getting all riled up about the C450. They've got better things to do with their time than dump on the people here.

Don't let them drive you away. I'm a former S4/S6/CTSV guy in search of a new experience for a daily driver. C450 is probably it.

MDMercedesGuy

This thread makes me want to go buy an AMG badge to slap on my Honda lawnmower, just because.

vinsuz

I have to chime in here. I have an '07 CLK 550 with the AMG Appearance package. I don't have an AMG badge on the back, but my wheels have an AMG stamp, and I have the white gauges and AMG pedals.

Now the AMG Appearance package also includes a factory-lowered ride height, coil-overs, and six-piston calipers and cross-drilled rotors. That certainly doesn't make me a poser, does it.

Of course I would never put an AMG badge on the back of my car because I know the difference and so do other people like me, but in the case of my car adding the AMG branding is more than just appearance.